Is it wrong to give monkeys Alzheimer's?

'It just really ethically scares me': Caution urged as scientists look to create human-monkey chimeras

Although the above article is about future possible human-monkey chimeras, the following excerpts caught my eye:

...[The monkeys] socialize and move around and eat and drink in the same way. They don’t fall over or stagger around. In fact, the only thing separating the macaques from their unaltered lab mates is the elevated level of a specific human protein implanted inside their brains — proteins that accumulate in the brains of humans with Alzheimer’s disease.

The monkeys have been injected with beta-amyloid, a molecule that, in high-enough amounts, is toxic to human brain tissue...

...If left alone, eventually the monkeys will start to show signs of Alzheimer’s. They make more mistakes on memory tasks and their reaction time slows.

Now, I understand that Alzheimer's is obviously an awful disease to suffer from or to see a loved one suffering from it; however, the thought of actively destroying monkeys' brains (in the interest of disease research) - monkeys which were perfectly healthy and happy beforehand - is a tad bit unsettling.


What do you think?

originally posted by: AnakinWayneII
'It just really ethically scares me': Caution urged as scientists look to create human-monkey chimeras

Although the above article is about future possible human-monkey chimeras, the following excerpts caught my eye:

...[The monkeys] socialize and move around and eat and drink in the same way. They don’t fall over or stagger around. In fact, the only thing separating the macaques from their unaltered lab mates is the elevated level of a specific human protein implanted inside their brains — proteins that accumulate in the brains of humans with Alzheimer’s disease.

The monkeys have been injected with beta-amyloid, a molecule that, in high-enough amounts, is toxic to human brain tissue...

...If left alone, eventually the monkeys will start to show signs of Alzheimer’s. They make more mistakes on memory tasks and their reaction time slows.

Now, I understand that Alzheimer's is obviously an awful disease to suffer from or to see a loved one suffering from it; however, the thought of actively destroying monkeys' brains (in the interest of disease research) - monkeys which were perfectly healthy and happy beforehand - is a tad bit unsettling.


What do you think?

Yeah, animal testing is messed up but at the same time if you've had a loved one suffer from any number of diseases that in theory could be cured with animal testing, do you just accept you don't want to see how the sausage is made?

Where do you draw the line? Is it only and issue if the animal is cute and cuddley? I mean no one bats an eye at poisoning pests like ants, roaches or even rats.

We send our boys (and gals) off to get shot, blown up, and everything else for dubious reasons at best sometimes. But yet, we don't like animal testing. which is worse?

Just some thoughts.

a reply to: AnakinWayneII

I think it's wrong. Anyone who's ever had a pet can see they have all the same emotions people do. Of course that raises the question of eating meat - but, I do believe in eating ethically raised meat, and hunting for food - as long as the animal has lived a quality and happy life, free to be themselves and doesn't die in pain, suffering, or know it's about to be killed.

I eat meat and from the store. I am slowly changing my ways. However, those are my thoughts.

I have a different opinion than most I guess - that this life is just a temporary existence (and trust me, I have suffered from a lifetime of pain with chronic conditions and am grateful for medicine and life has never been easy for me. If you were to compare my life to others most would say I have had more than my share). I would never cause another creature to suffer just so my life could be better. And so, I live with the thought that this pain will not last forever, the suffering will not last forever and I would rather enjoy animals for the wonderful creatures they are that add so much joy to our lives. My health does not come before them and to subject them to the same suffering I endure is plain evil.

From a Biblical viewpoint - we were told to steward the earth and animals. That didn't mean to use as we wished, it meant to treat all humanely.

a reply to: AnakinWayneII

Whilst some may say I am sitting on a high horse I personally believe animal testing is wrong, I also do not eat meat.. I was once a full blown meat eater but once I realized the food and land needed to produce 1KG of meat vs 1kg of crops I started to change my thinking, also hearing pigs getting slaughtered is a sound that will live with me forever...

I also think it must take a certain personality trait for someone to come into work everyday and conduct these experiments, I could possibly put them in the same light as abortion clinic Doctors but that is another thread...

Moreover, I also tend to believe in what goes around comes around, whilst humans can be down right cruel who is to say what the Human race may face in the coming years as we slowly trudge our way into the stars... How would you feel if your relatives as a family where locked up in cages watching over a matter of hours as each one is taken out to be strapped down screaming then vivisected by some higher being whilst they chat about their alien sports teams and how primitive and simple "the humans" are and how they can justify their actions to help their society..

Just my 2 peso worth....

a reply to: Petra137

And what if one day we discover that plants have thought, feelings and emotions? What will you eat then?
I believe in killing fast and mercifully and eating meat. The best thing ever invented was a fence so a starving family does not have to hunt hoping for one good kill that would save them from perishing.

Ancient people would not have survived with out meat in long harsh winters where no edible plants flourish.

In my humble opinion, I'm sure someone somewhere can and will prove me wrong.

What I find most disturbing is the idea that a monkey can actually be given Alzheimer’s.

And one more thing... we can go nearly anywere today and buy some meat to eat, but for the ancients getting meat was hard to get as lighting a fire. And how do you light a fire with no wood sawed up because there were no saw's.
Things we have so easy today we take for granted and don't realize how hard they were to get years ago just to survive another day.

a reply to: AnakinWayneII

No teting on animals at all in the interest of anything.

If humans get a disease find another way or deal with the consequences.

So sad, too bad.

The only things we humans should give monkeys is a nice fresh healthy banana.

The human race makes me wanna puke.

Man, I must be tired or something. I thought the topic read "Is it wrong to give monkeys to Alsheimer's". I thought maybe they were starting to use monkeys as service animals to help out those with Alsheimer's or something. Like be a domestic servant.

First thought that came to mind was "well here comes Planet of the Apes!"

Doh!...

On topic now. Animals have been used in testing since the beginning of modern medicine. It is not always pretty, but it has yielded results that has helped, well, probably everyone at one point or another. Alsheimers is a nasty disease. My aunt had it, and my uncle has it now. I have seen how they both went down hill. Personally I think it may be related to how we eat, all the processed food and stuff. Which puts me at the top of the list, as I tend to eat a lot of bad for me stuff.

Is it ethical? Tough one. Will it help someone? Maybe. The simian brain is similar to ours, learning the effects without human testing can tell us a lot. I think it may be a necessary evil, that may one day shed insight on treatments and possible cures.

Cruel gods of science. A life for a life.

a reply to: AnakinWayneII

I think if we can do a thing, we will do a thing.

We don't invent tools we do not use.

We already experiment on Humans nevermind Monkeys.

Animal testing will ONLY go the way of the dodo when humans look at (voluntary) human lab rats more favorably. Plenty of people are willing to be the lab rats to lend a hand at getting rid of awful diseases and conditions, but many people eschew the thought as "inhumane" or "unethical", and thus box researchers into the animal testing route.

Take the gene-tweaked twins in China as an example -- just HOW exactly TF are we going to strengthen resistance to HIV in human genes if we don't test on people? Ever? You never move forward with something if you don't swallow pride first. There's a couple of kids that may or may not have future health issues related to their altered DNA, and if we never did it to begin with, no one would ever know for sure anyway.

Frankly, I think both human testing and animal testing have their specific places on the research ladder, and always will. Start with animals to gain an idea of whether or not something could work or be a disaster first, then humans. Similar to how it already is, but I'd prefer to see the animal testing stage shortened & the human testing stage lengthened. We can only glean so much from animals before it's a brick wall.

I've always believed that animal testing for cosmetic and superficial reasons is wrong. But for life and death issues, minimal animal testing may be necessary. Testing on animals for hair conditioners and eye makeup is not essential to our existence. Testing for cures for HIV and the like, as sad as it sounds, I'd rather my dog's life than my son's.

I raise meat. I eat meat. I fish. Hunting not so much because it is difficult for me but I have friends who do and we trade food stuffs. My animals are free range-contained and very happy. I have lost several to wild animals in the past. It was brutal, a slaughter, and senseless. I felt so bad for my deceased critters at the horror and fear they must have felt in their last moments of life. I will always eat meat and I appreciate the practice of harvesting what you eat and eating what you harvest. To use animals for testing products that make people look pretty is plain old torture.

Human consciousness is varying from person to person. It's hard to pin down the deeper levels of morality because of standards and relativity.

If you can't go to bed with a clear conscious because of something you are/aren't doing, that's what should direct your actions.

Yes, It is horrible what is done to primates for experimental purposes. All to produce drugs, vaccines and treatments following human brain trauma.

Primates in Laboratories


Is there an alternative?