Yes! I debunked .... MYSELF!

a reply to: The Shrike


Motion of small objects in space are very ‘unearthly’, you can’t figure it out simply by using your imagination and earthside insights. Vehicle direct action [like thrusters] happened more on shuttles, sometimes spectacularly so, but less often now since they used thrusters for orientation, while ISS uses momentum wheels [shuttle also had an evaporator for auxiliary cooling, the same device that made the famous fireflies on Glenn's flight]. Any gaseous effluent would do, such as airlock or fluid dump valves OR spacesuits [Russian suits are cooled by a water sublimator in the backpack that, if the crewman held a steady working position way out from the center of mass they could put enough angular deflection on the station to require active correction]. Repair work on fluid-carrying valves [coolant loops, mainly] also create bursts of snowflakes. Even at 400 km there's enough dynamic pressure from Mach 25 near vacuum 'wind' to gently push light fluffy stuff away from the velocity vector, and there's enough solar heating to sublimate molecules off preferentially from the sunny side of ice chips, which can produce a gentle down-sun force. Objects moving higher or lower get into faster/slower orbits relative to the station's CG, something 50 meters above the CG will slip behind by several meters per minute, an angular rate visible on TV. Fluids when leaked often form thin ice plates in the nozzle which when they come off, peel off into a tumble, and as they evaporate they can break into separate pieces that spin off in abruptly different directions. It's an awesome new universe out there, we ain't in Kansas any more.

originally posted by: The Shrike
You see in order for the shuttle camera focused on the tether to show all of the "airy disks", the shuttle has to fly through the field created by the shuttle dump and that's an impossibility since the "airy disks" are not behaving as the water dump is shown on the video.

That's not true.

Regardless of what they are, the objects we see on the tether video must be either between the shuttle and the tether or beyond the tether but in the same line of sight. The shuttle doesn't need to fly through an ice crystals cloud for ice crystals to appear on images taken from the shuttle.

a reply to: The Shrike


" There was another pregnant pause by a female astronaut when she started to say where a spacecraft (ISS?) could be seen and a nice, bright "orb" drifted into the and all we heard was silence 'cause she sounded shocked."

I'd be shocked too since there wasn't a female on that mission.

Shrike, you don't even know what you don't know. The relative motion of two objects in orbit is extremely 'unearthly'. Depending on the direction of departure, a small object can pull ahead, drop down, and swoop back underneath, or drift up, fall behind, then swoop back down and forward to return to the shuttle, or drift off sideways, slow, stop, and swoop back right towards the shuttle. These loops play out over a time span of tens of minutes. That's normal 'relative motion'. I'm presuming you had no idea that this happens. What will it take to educate you?

originally posted by: JimOberg
a reply to: The Shrike


" There was another pregnant pause by a female astronaut when she started to say where a spacecraft (ISS?) could be seen and a nice, bright "orb" drifted into the and all we heard was silence 'cause she sounded shocked."

I'd be shocked too since there wasn't a female on that mission.

I didn't say that the female astronaut was on that mission, I just added the comment to match the "pregnant pause" on the tether footage. Here is what happened, and I don't know the mission number.

Female astronaut saying that MIR is at x place although it's not visible as the screen is showing a partial earth and the rest is the dark sky full of bright objects mostly still but with some objects materializing and "shooting stars" flying at the same speed side by side! The camera has panned down away from the earth, showing just a "star"-filled sky and the female astronaut continues: "Okay, MIR Space Station is the small flashing light in the center about an inch ... it's slowly - pregnant pause because a bright object enters from below center and it seems to have affected her vocal cords. There's another voice in the background that snaps her back and starts her talking again.

Doesn't NASA prepare astronauts to the possibility of "ice crystals/debris" behaving unnaturally and telling them to stay on script and not give the impression that they're shocked? If that male voice hadn't intruded, I wonder how long the female astronaut would have remained quite probably looking around her and asking with her looks "What the hell do I do now?"

Request that NASA have astronauts do a spacewalk a distance from the shuttle and video the complete shuttle with plenty of space around it and let's see the ice crystals and debris "that usually fly with us". I'll bet you you won't see a mass of "airy disks" around it or anything else worth talking about for that matter.

originally posted by: The Shrike
I didn't say that the female astronaut was on that mission, I just added the comment to match the "pregnant pause" on the tether footage. Here is what happened, and I don't know the mission number.

I think that what Jim meant to say was that the people that make the comments on those videos are not astronauts, they are on mission control (or something like that), watching the images and making the comments as they go.

Request that NASA have astronauts do a spacewalk a distance from the shuttle and video the complete shuttle with plenty of space around it and let's see the ice crystals and debris "that usually fly with us". I'll bet you you won't see a mass of "airy disks" around it or anything else worth talking about for that matter.

That would be hard to do, seeing that the shuttle fleet stopped flying years ago.

originally posted by: ArMaP

originally posted by: The Shrike
I didn't say that the female astronaut was on that mission, I just added the comment to match the "pregnant pause" on the tether footage. Here is what happened, and I don't know the mission number.

I think that what Jim meant to say was that the people that make the comments on those videos are not astronauts, they are on mission control (or something like that), watching the images and making the comments as they go.

Request that NASA have astronauts do a spacewalk a distance from the shuttle and video the complete shuttle with plenty of space around it and let's see the ice crystals and debris "that usually fly with us". I'll bet you you won't see a mass of "airy disks" around it or anything else worth talking about for that matter.

That would be hard to do, seeing that the shuttle fleet stopped flying years ago.

Hi ArMaP: The female that I say did a pregnant pause in the video was an astronaut. She is heard describing what she is witnessing either with her eyes or looking at a monitor showing what the camera was seeing. A voice from control somewhere is heard talking to her. The trouble with some footage in a compilation video is that the mission number is not always identified. You can hear her at YouTube in the video titled "THE SECRET NASA TRANSMISSIONS: The Smoking Gun". It's 1-1/2 hours.

I was being facetious about the astronaut taking a spacewalk. It can be done by anyone that's up there and the next time a repair is needed I'm sure it'll be videotaped and we just have to wait to view it.

Go to 1:03:25

originally posted by: The Shrike
Hi ArMaP: The female that I say did a pregnant pause in the video was an astronaut. She is heard describing what she is witnessing either with her eyes or looking at a monitor showing what the camera was seeing. A voice from control somewhere is heard talking to her.

I think I found the original video.



At 1:05 that female voice says "this is mission control Houston". Also, the quality of the sound is too good to come from the shuttle.

originally posted by: The Shrike
I'll bet you you won't see a mass of "airy disks" around it or anything else worth talking about for that matter.

I don't see "airy disks" in the tether video either. I see out of focus objects often referred to as "bokeh", especially when they are illuminated. If you see them in focus they won't be "discs" they would be tiny specks.

Here's a bokeh shot from Earth, where you can probably guess what the real object being photographed is and the "airy discs" aren't anything like the object looks when in focus.

Bokeh


By the way if the photographer of that photo used the same kind of camera lens as Nasa used in the tether video, then those "discs" would have a little "black hole" in the center, as Serada calls it, which of course isn't really a black hole but a part of the light blocked by the way a particular type of lens is made.

The camera has panned down away from the earth, showing just a "star"-filled sky and the female astronaut continues: "Okay, MIR Space Station is the small flashing light in the center about an inch ... it's slowly - pregnant pause because a bright object enters from below center and it seems to have affected her vocal cords. There's another voice in the background that snaps her back and starts her talking again.

As ArMaP said that female voice is NOT an astronaut, she's at mission control and the reason she paused is obvious to me and I don't know why it's not as obvious to you too. The astronaut starts to talk and she pauses to try to avoid talking at the same time as the astronaut so we can hear what the astronaut has to say.

As for the speck of light you seem to think made her lose her voice, it doesn't look like anything interesting to me and I don't see why anybody would lose their voice over it, that's really imaginative on your part.