Philando Castile

When this first happened it reminded me of another black man shot dead without so much as a warning in a Walmart as he held an airsoft rifle still in its packaging.

John Crawford III

Mr. Crawford was essentially SWATed by a fat racist neckbeard POS who today walks free and alive when he shouldn't. He deliberately made a false statement of a dangerous black man with a gun threatening other customers. Police didn't even bother issuing verbal warnings nor did they make any effort to deescalate a situation that was based on a lie. No warning, at all, Mr. Crawford was shot twice in the back.

A couple of years later Philando Castile, riding shotgun in his girlfriend's car with her daughter in the back, was shot as a result of negligent and contradictory commands that Mr. Castile was trying to comply with when he was murdered.

Being armed is a RIGHT in this country. A #ING RIGHT. Exercising that right should NOT be justification for the police to murder citizens.

I support the police. In my line of work I have to deal with law enforcement every single day. I am an armed citizen. But I do not support this. This MUST change. This must be addressed so people like John Crawford III and Philando Castile can shop at Walmart or legally carry concealed without fear of being killed by the police.

a reply to: projectvxn

How was this not ATLEAST manslaughter?

There was only about 4 seconds from "I have a fire arm" to "bang x7". When the cop shouted don't reach for it, you can hear him saying "I'm not"

a reply to: projectvxn

For clarity, Castille was the driver. The popular facebook video shows it reversed.

On the subject of John Crawford, I will agree that excessive force was indeed used. There were no reports of shots fired and from the looks of things, upon first glimpse using firearms is essentially murder.
What would you have done in this situation be it the police or Crawford?

Onto Castille. There is something strange about the story regarding that. Upon the officer asking for license/registration, there are conflicting reports of what was handed over. One story claims that only his insurance card is handed over, and then Castille tells Geronimo that he is armed. Upon attempting to possibly find his license, the officer assumes he is moving for his weapon and then discharges his. Seven times. Another story says that he initially did hand over his license in which case the officer could readily believe that he was attempting to access said firearm.
Again, what would you have done in either shoes?

To me, this goes way deeper than the black and white scared scenario. There is indeed fear. There also exists years of stereotypes, supremacy, classism, ignorance and a lust for power. Shooting anyone without all the facts is wrong. Period.

Something that crosses my mind is, he declared his weapon from the start without even having been asked to step out. When I have been pulled over in the past, I have declared my blade only after being asked to step out. Other times it was a simple warning be on your way, and I never declared anything.

So my question is thus, is it proper etiquette to declare your weapon immediately upon an interaction, or should it wait until one is being asked t step out or to be searched??

I go to thinking, could this have been avoided by keeping things to ones self??

I am in no way defending the responding officer's actions, I am merely speaking and seeking constructive dialogue with fellow people who stay armed on ways we can perhaps reduce our exposure or mitigate circumstances that can end with drastic results.

a reply to: JinMI

What would you have done in this situation be it the police or Crawford?

The police have numbers on their side. Surround and issue verbal commands to surrender. Then continue with the investigation. Which would have found that Crawford did NOTHING to warrant being shot.

Again, what would you have done in either shoes?

Upon being told that by Mr. Castile that he is armed I would have had my partner make him exit the vehicle and seize the firearm for the duration of the stop.

Doing so would have ensured that Mr. Castile would still be alive today.

a reply to: projectvxn

I agree with how you would handle that. However, what about if you were in deceased shoes?

a reply to: JinMI

With regard to Mr. Crawford, he never knew what was going on until he was dead. There's no scenario there for me to expand on.

With Regard to Mr. Castile. The second I saw the lights I would have pulled my wallet out of my pocket and would have had the passenger grab the DMV and insurance info before the officer arrived.

That said, I still do not believe that Mr. Castile did anything wrong. He was attempting to comply with the officers directives when he was shot.

It's really hard to make the case for "comply and everything will be ok" when, in this case at least, compliance is what got him killed.

a reply to: JinMI

I think when he told him he had a firearm, he wanted to give the cops a heads up as he reached for his ID, so the cop wouldn't mistake him reaching for a gun. You can hear the girlfriend say he was reaching for his ID.

To me it sounded like he was trying his best to comply, but maybe reaching for his ID after he just told the cop he was armed, was probably not a good idea. The cop was breathing heavily for quite some time too, he definitely panicked to some degree. I don't know, It's a pretty tough situation.

Either way, what a tragedy.. Pulled over for break lights, and ends up dead over a misunderstanding.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

There is no duty to inform a police officer that you are armed in the State of Minnesota. You only tell the officer if asked.

Mr. Castile volunteered that information in the spirit of cooperation with the police.

a reply to: projectvxn

Fair enough.

If I were in Mr. Crawfords shoes, I would not be brandishing a firearm in public. Real or not. I also doubt you would either, but that is my opinion. They are indeed weapons that command and deserve respect from the user. Also, the rest of the world doesn't know your proficiency nor any safety training you may have received. In fact, in most areas it is a crime and should not be confused with open carry.

Castilles situation is different. Given the facts are still out until there is some glimpse of all the evidence, suffice it to say, that I would have done almost exactly what you have. My hands would have been on the wheel until it was understood that the officer knew I had a firearm. In most cases, it's time to get out of the vehicle at that point. I'm not siding too far either way on this one until there is possibly more information. Regardless, it shouldn't have cost his life.

a reply to: JinMI

If I were in Mr. Crawfords shoes, I would not be brandishing a firearm in public. Real or not. I also doubt you would either, but that is my opinion.

He wasn't. It was an in store product still in it's packaging.

a reply to: JinMI
He was examining the product as sold on store shelves. Kids and teenagers do it everyday, most people don't think twice about it. At least they did not use too anyways.

It was not in the packaging.

He was also not in the section where the BB gun was sold.

a reply to: JinMI

It was not in the packaging.

You're correct I was working from memory when I made that statement. I stand corrected.

He was also not in the section where the BB gun was sold.

Why does that matter?

a reply to: projectvxn

It matters as he was not just checking it out or playing with it then putting it back or something like that. He took it through the store and there were reports of him pointing it at people etc (brandishing).

Just trying to see the perspective is all. Regardless, to shoot without asking/saying anything is wrong, but the deceased was far from just minding his own business.

a reply to: JinMI

He took it through the store and there were reports of him pointing it at people etc (brandishing).

What the neck beard told the dispatcher was that he was walking around pointing it at customers and children and making threats.

No eye witness testimony corroborated that report, nor did the surveillance video.

but the deceased was far from just minding his own business.

That's exactly what he was doing. When he was shot he was facing a shelf and talking on his phone.

a reply to: projectvxn

So there was nothing proving or disproving what he said he saw?

Reports said he was shot in the back, given the fact that I heard zero volume in the videos, do you happen to know at what point he was shot? Was it as he was running away or when he came back?

a reply to: JinMI

He was shot upon the police entering. He was shot again after he attempted to escape death.

Should have just complied with his own murder.

a reply to: projectvxn

You may get part of your wish.
www.nydailynews.com...

Small sentence for what lead to two deaths.

From that article, it is written as if he was shot twice from a distance. Judging from the video, he never got a word out.

a reply to: JinMI

Dude actually told the dispatcher that he was loading rounds into the weapon.

The police, in my opinion, share responsibility for this as the shooters who did not bother to assess before firing.

But Ritchie, the fat neckbeard POS, SWATed him in the hopes of getting a black man killed. He should be charged far more severely than he was. Not only did his actions kill John Crawford III, but they killed a woman who died of a heart attack as a result of the chaos that POS created.