Being evil - what does it really mean ?

a reply to: DJMSN

What if said person was Proven Mentally Retarded ? Who now is reasonable for evil? Sorry for not being PC Mentally Ill just covers to much.

a reply to: Gargoyle91

But isn't that a dangerous thought road to travel?

When you start saying that a certain individual is at the mercy of their biology, then you remove free will. What if their moral decisions they have constantly made throughout their life has rewired their mental structure and changed their biology? I could get behind that reasoning. But to say that a person's biological makeup is the starting point and all decisions follow that makeup is a huge disservice, especially to those in similar situations that face a very difficult road but continue to do the right thing even if it means their death. That to me is the beauty of the human soul.

Just a quick story. I was selected for jury duty on one of our first ever trials where the defense was going after a non guilty plea (act of murder) due to insanity. When the attorneys were asking the beginning questions for the final jury selection, I was eliminated in the first round. They asked that wonderful question, if biology can make someone do something against their will. Almost everyone raised their hand except for me. After 4 more pointed questions I was dismissed. I basically just laughed at them for what they were trying to do. To me what they were trying to do was EVIL.

a reply to: Perfectenemy

We outnumber them roughly 100 000:1 but we just sit back and watch. A civil society would hunt down gang bangers by themselves and not just wait for the police.

I think society would hunt down criminals "IF" it were allowed. If the Police gave the green light and open season was declared against criminals, many would do just that. But I guess "evil" would have to be clearly defined first.?

a reply to: Discotech

These are good questions. I believe in order to answer them you need to have a moral guide. And as most people reject any moral guide beyond their-own-selves, the world in general can be a very evil place, but the people in it judge themselves as good and righteous.

Consulting a Bible dictionary for the definition I got this:

EVIL That which results in pain, sorrow, or distress. In order to convey the correct thought in English, the very comprehensive Hebrew word raʽ is variously translated as “bad,” “gloomy,” “ugly,” “evil,” “calamitous,” “malignant,” “ungenerous,” and “envious,” depending upon the context. (Ge 2:9; 40:7; 41:3; Ex 33:4; De 6:22; 28:35; Pr 23:6; 28:22) The Greek word ka·kosʹ may be defined as that which is (1) morally evil and (2) destructive; among the ways it has been translated are: “bad,” “evil,” “hurtful,” “injurious,” “wrong.” (Ro 7:19; 12:17; Col 3:5; Tit 1:12; Heb 5:14) The Hebrew verb qa·lalʹ means “call down evil upon.”—See MALEDICTION. As first used in the Scriptures, the word raʽ is the very antithesis of good. Adam was commanded not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and bad (raʽ) and was also warned of the consequences for disobedience. Hence, it is evident that God sets the standard as to what is good and what is bad; it is not within man’s prerogative to do so apart from God. Although Adam transgressed God’s express law, this transgression is not chargeable to Jehovah, “for with evil things [form of ka·kosʹ] God cannot be tried nor does he himself try anyone. But each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire.”—Jas 1:13, 14; Ge 2:16, 17; 3:17-19.
- Insight Vol 1. p. 772.

So if we are to go by God's standards anyone involving themselves in anything going against God's will is considered evil in his eyes, and thus it would be appropriate to call them evil. They may not even know they are evil. Like you said, they may be brain-washed by religions, or by someone else to think that their bad conduct is good.

Scripture tells us that there is a generation that thinks it is pure, but that has not been washed from its own excrement. And that many evildoers will denounce and call good bad, and call bad good. Notice, they delude themselves, and imagine that their wrong-doing is good.

Many people in religion do what is wrong, but they do not know it. But that does not mean they are not considered evil in God's eyes. God has a standard of conduct of right and wrong. And if one does not keep it they are evil in his eyes.

False religion is evil, and everyone who are a part of it are evil in God's eyes. They worship false gods who are really demons, they practice unholy "holidays" and have unholy dogmas, such as the immorality of the soul, and hell-fire dogmas; all which dishonor God and are evil. And those who believe in such unholy doctrines and adhere to such false teachings are evildoers in God's eyes.

Scripture calls the person who denies that God exists evil:

(Psalm 10:4) . . .In his haughtiness, the wicked man makes no investigation; All his thoughts are: “There is no God.”


And those who disobey God by their conduct are evildoers. Such conduct as the following:

(1 Corinthians 6:9, 10) . . .Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God’s Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, 10 thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God’s Kingdom.

It also shows us that evil people will conduct themselves according to the desires of the sinful flesh:

(Galatians 5:19-21) . . .Now the works of the flesh are plainly seen, and they are sexual immorality, uncleanness, brazen conduct, 20 idolatry, spiritism, hostility, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, dissensions, divisions, sects, 21 envy, drunkenness, wild parties, and things like these. I am forewarning you about these things, the same way I already warned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit God’s Kingdom.

And it also shows you the dominant mental bent, or attitude of evil people and these things are:

(2 Timothy 3:2-5) . . .For men will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, disloyal, 3 having no natural affection, not open to any agreement, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, without love of goodness, 4 betrayers, headstrong, puffed up with pride, lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God, 5 having an appearance of godliness but proving false to its power; and from these turn away. . .


This world we live in is overflowing with badness and evil of all sorts.

It is so confusing to ask who an evil person really is, because basically everyone on earth today is evil to a certain extent in God's eyes. Yes there are varying degrees of evil. For example, stealing is evil. But a person stealing bread to eat is not as evil as a person murdering a family because they broke into their house to rob it. While the former person can be understood, his conduct is still evil. The latter is more condemned.

But really everyone is a sinner and thus we are all evil before God. The only way to come into a clean and righteous standing with him, is, if we practice sin, stop...do what is good and right. Be honest. Uphold justice. And exercise faith in Jesus' shed blood. Only then can one really be considered righteous before God.

a reply to: Discotech

But let's take terrorists, are they all truly evil, do they all commit their disgusting acts because they actually enjoy it ?

No they do it because according to their religious texts God enjoys it.

I think it's a grey area when it comes to free will and people with mental disorders, because serial killers that don't have the brain development/chemistry to feel empathy can't really be considered evil, right? Maybe somewhat, but they're broken people.

Same goes for children that don't have the brain development to really know right from wrong. Childhood bullies and things that were possibly victims of abuse themselves shouldn't count.

True/pure evil can be measured in adulthood authority figures. People that push for/create wars with profit as a motive. People that destroy the lives of many, such as a lot of Wall Street players, with profit as a motive. People that poison the water of a city with profit as a motive, or pollute the environment that effects everybody just because they want to save costs. People that molest/kill children, even if they were victims themselves as children. They should know better than anybody.

Fully matured adults that know they're doing something wrong and don't care as long as their pockets get a bigger buldge, even if they're not sticking people with knives or shooting people, are evil.

a reply to: Discotech

Is it the act that makes a person evil, or the motivation to commit the act that makes them evil ?

People choose to do evil or not. Doing evil doesn't make one evil. Its the act itself that is evil (whatever evil is), all those choices are our own, all those choices add up over a lifetime...

a reply to: Tinystarlight

False religion is evil, and everyone who are a part of it are evil in God's eyes. They worship false gods who are really demons, they practice unholy "holidays" and have unholy dogmas, such as the immorality of the soul, and hell-fire dogmas; all which dishonor God and are evil. And those who believe in such unholy doctrines and adhere to such false teachings are evildoers in God's eyes.

I am glad that you finally admitted that YOUR god is wrong and MY god is right. That clears up this whole argument and discussion. It is nice that people are finally awakening to the evils of the OT & NT.

/sarc

I can tell you one thing, using religion to justify morals is why we are at this point in history.

The answers that will lead us forward as a human race will be free of religion. I get hopeful to see that day, but we are probably 1000's of years away from that awakening.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Discotech

Is it the act that makes a person evil, or the motivation to commit the act that makes them evil ?

People choose to do evil or not. Doing evil doesn't make one evil. Its the act itself that is evil (whatever evil is), all those choices are our own, all those choices add up over a lifetime...

Amen brother.

a reply to: Discotech
To simplify-
Being evil is to treat others the way you would not want to be treated.

Because you know how discomforted you would feel if treated that way...

So if you are treating others a certain way that causes discomfort, due to your religious belief systems for example and you know you would not like others treating you that way but still choose to do so, to 1 is evil...

It's a religious related umbrella term that even make an excuse for an action that can be explained otherwise(ie "she is evil because she is possessed"). It can vary depending on who is using the term. One person's evil is other person's good and vise versa.

Another question might be, how those at the top and in the media and the famous, feel protected or that they are unaffected by consequence to ritual murders and sacrifice? Why they feel so certain they're off the hook? What kind of universe they think they're in?

a reply to: Discotech

This is a question without a clear answer that depends...so it is an excellent philosophical problem.
Forget books and beliefs about good and evil. Accept that there is no right answer unless you couch it in an enclosed criteria. To show that there is no simple answer than can be carried to lofty heights to aid humanity in its struggle to know itself I present the simple details of a old biological film clip. It features the nest of a fairly large bird. The parent is missing from the nest that holds two eggs. In the clip, one is presently being hatched and the struggling chick emerges. With eyes closed, it immediate moves to the other egg and with great difficulty pushes it up and over the side of the nest to crash to the ground.

How do you apply the human construct of good and evil to what that chick did to its sibling? We can't. We must allow that Nature is Nature and leave it at that. As brain functions interceded over instinctual behaviors, with animals carrying for their young, new principles of behavior started to go beyond the simple rules of nature.

In humankind, the sky is utterly the limit for these new principles to end. There is no argument but what these are new principles as they are, are simple to discern: Right and Wrong. They begat Good and Evil. No deity is required to make the distinctions. What is required is one cardinal rule of order. Life (consciousness and the individual identity that goes along with living, breathing creatures) is sacred and to be safe-guarded if not cherished. For higher order beings, life should not be ended or created without due consideration of the effects of such moves with a resulting net positive outcome for all. But collateral damage will occur.

Evil is that which is harmful or detractory in nature; or that which puts one person in a position of power over another involuntarily; or betraying power that was voluntarioy given. We judge this primarily by whether or not the "victim" can be classified as such, the main sticking point being if the potential victim is capable of registering their disadvantage or not. Not saying it's okay to take advantage of someone who is severely mentally handicapped or otherwise unaware but to say that you wouldn't call it evil to slice a rock in half. Even if you later found out that the rock had in fact been conscious, you were not aware if this then; and the very fact that you feel guilty about it in my opinion resolves you of the need to feel guilty because it shows were you given that same option again you would choose differently. That does in my opinion also swing the other way in that if you demolish the hell out of a tree while imagining someone else, that is an evil act because you would otherwise have.

I think if we are all being intellectually honest we can out an end to the motive vs actual result debate, in the case of the misguided individual or even the rock slayer. You don't punish someone for not knowing about the alkali metals combustion to water and accidentally killing 50 people. It was an accidental.

When we get to cases like the crusades and deathcamps and the like, the line starts to get a little fuzzier but not much. If you get ordered to slaughter people and you do you are just as evil. But see that gets complicated because what if said commander had your family locked away? In such a case, most people would cooperate and only a few wouldn't, we call them heroes. So I really would draw the line at whether you meant to and whether you enjoyed it or not. With the enjoying being the heaviest factor, being able to outweigh even the intent, in the case of being forced.

Because when you are forced or not able to see the evilness of the action, then it gets negated. Because you don't punish someone for ignorance, you educate them- it's only when they know better that you punish them.

Evil as applicable to human relational experience is anything that causes unjust pain or suffering to anyone by anyone, including a group or individual.

On another level outside of human input evil is relative and perspectival.

The great rains in the south will cause hardship and suffering for the Native Americans but be a boon to the farmers.

Here one man's evil is another’s salvation.

Or as the classic aphorism avers:

What one man consumes another regurgitates

On a metaphysical level evil is corruption of a state or a station of consciousness or a world.

It’s the classic conundrum of the impure elements that can invade something and thereby pervert its reality…and cause existential suffering.

It means being an oppressor, that is one who uses power / intelligence to harm someone less powerful or intelligent

a reply to: firefromabove

Oh? So it's not evil to cut someone's hamstrings because they are beating you in a race? Or to kill someone because they are smarter than you?

The real evil is making our bed of evil, laying in it, thereby justifying our condemnation of each other.

Evil only exists because mankind has come to believe that "good" or "right" exists. You could easily placate this misconception by replacing the idea of "good" and "evil" with "what I am" and "what I am not" or "who I am" and "who I am not". If we were to make the much more powerful statement of who we are and who we are not, soon the world would have to admit that "good" and "evil" were the colloquialisms of children, invented to disassociate ourselves from who we are and what we've become.

The only "evil" that exits are the concepts we continue to play with, out of context.

a reply to: Aedaeum

While I do agree with you that asking who am i(not) is a very beneficial question, evil is a concept we use, just like the concept of i. I could very easily make up an argument that there is no self and that all there is is oneness, but like yours my argument wouldn't negate the fact that self does at least seem to exist and we aren't unified in oneness consciously, just like the fact that I will and others will continue to, correctly, call the cold-blooded murder of a child "evil". Nothing out of context about that.

I'm not particularly religious, but I have put a lot of thought into this question and I believe that something is good if the result is to make the world better for others. It is evil if it makes the world worse for others. If you think about it, this accords with commonplace examples. Imprisoning a criminal is bad for them, but makes the world better for others. Stealing an apple to survive is neither good or evil, because it isnt the sellers only apple and makes no real difference to him. Stealing his car would be a different matter.

It follows that most of what we do is neither good or evil, just necessary. As a rule, you have to try to be good or evil, which is where choice comes in. It's easier to be evil because evil acts are invariably for your own benefit, whereas good acts usually involve some sacrifice on your behalf.