Has there ever been a First Lady

a reply to: Mike Stivic

How do you know that PUTUS and FLOTUS are traveling and their Secret Service Detail is being paid for with tax dollars and not the those "General Election Funds" collected by the IRS and raised by the political parties?

Trump Flies With Gold-Plated Bathroom Fixtures, And You’re Paying Millions For It Secret Service payments to fly on his luxury 757 made up nearly 80 percent of the flight costs this summer.

a reply to: WeRpeons

Ok so show me the video of a candidate claiming to grope women... this i would like to see and HEAR...

a reply to: windword
Are you talking about trumps jet? That he owns? As in not paid for in our tax dollars...

In comparison to?


The spin is strong with this one..

Respectfully,
~meathead

a reply to: Mike Stivic

Are you talking about trumps jet? That he owns? As in not paid for in our tax dollars... In comparison to?

Sigh, I can link/quote an article, but I can't make you read.

The bombastic businessman has often bragged about the comforts of his ride, with its full bedroom, shower and 24-karat gold-plated bathroom fixtures. But because it seats so few passengers, Trump’s Secret Service agents appear to make up more than half of the plane’s flight manifests. And that means taxpayers are now legally required to pick up the majority of its staggering running costs.

Over the first three months of this year, after Trump asked for and received Secret Service protection, the agency’s payments to his campaign accounted for 48 percent of the $1.7 million that it paid Tag Air Inc., the candidate’s company that operates the aging jet.

Over June, July and August, as Trump became the GOP nominee and his security detail grew, the agency’s payments to the campaign made up 78 percent of the $1.3 million that it paid to Tag Air, according to The Huffington Post’s review of Federal Election Commission filings.

Politico, which first reported these payments, put the total the Secret Service paid to the Trump campaign at $1.6 million. But a closer look at campaign finance filings shows that the U.S. Secret Service covered more than $2.3 million of the $3.8 million Trump’s campaign has paid Tag Air in 2016.

That figure is on pace to top $3 million by Election Day on Nov. 8 – a total that would be nearly double what taxpayers spent to fly Secret Service agents around with 2012 GOP nominee Mitt Romney.

a reply to: Byrd

That would be exceptional in a perfect world.

Laura Bush has always been a strong, honest and wise woman.

a reply to: antar

WHAT? The bus video where Trump is claiming of groping and kissing women. It's only been in the news all week! Or are you alleging that this was a voice over?

originally posted by: antar
a reply to: windword

It is perfectly fine to chose to back your own political party and views for the future of America, however my point being is that when it goes against the better choice for ALL Americans, America for future generations then why join in the frenzy and emotional turmoil when you supposedly represent the highest position in the country?

Because this is America and people are allowed to have an express their own opinions regardless of which way they swing, for better or for worse.

I can read thanks for the toss up insult, clever.

He owns his own jet, he has gold fixtures, the secret service have a fund to allow them to travel with the CANDIDATE..

Thanks for clearing that up..

You mean he should have bought his own bigger jet so he would have more room to house them...

The thing is you can spin and twist but when it comes to actually replying with out deflection, at what point are you willing to admit this thread is not about trump, its about our first lady and her campaign for Hillary..

Sigh...

Twist, spin, deflect, low blow, ...
Rinse, Repeat..
Standard tactics that work unfortunately...

I am not into that, I have tried to be respectful and on topic,


~meathead

Has there ever been a first man?

originally posted by: antar
a reply to: Byrd

Many if not most First ladies have been known to dedicate their positions to aid their husbands become elected. Done with grace and charity, not at the expense of Tax payers at a historic time in disastrous economic history to ring in the next candidate preceding their POTUS husbands.

www.firstladies.org... f=FORID%3A11%3BNB%3A1

I typed into the sites search engine:
first+ladies+contributions+to+political+campaigns
Search instead for first+ladies+contributions+to+political+campains

Yes, done with grace and charity (as Michelle Obama does) but the US taxpayer still foots the bill for their transport and their security setups. In fact they get transport and security even if they're going on vacation or going out to visit grandchildren and the US taxpayer foots the bill. Lady Bird's home had high security all the rest of her life, and she was a gracious and blameless woman. We still paid for her security and her transportation.

And while the economy is bad in some places, it's not as bad as it was when Obama first took office. You can check the raw data on that.

a reply to: Mike Stivic

This is what you said: "It is wrong in my opinion for either a potus or flotus to campaign for any candidate on our tax dollars.

If Hillary is having an event and wants them there she should foot the bill.. Period."

So, it's okay for Trump to charge tax payers 2xs what their last candidate cost, so he can ride around in his golden money bleeding blimp? Okay

POTUS and FLOTUS have not lost their rights to free speech and free expression to campaign for whoever they like. In reality, you don't even know who's paying for the their travel expenses. But what I am saying is that there is a budget for that kind of thing, and it's not illegal, even though you might not like it! I'm pretty sure ALL the Bushes are still getting Secret Service benefits, regardless of where they travel or who they speak for.

a reply to: antar

Has there ever been a First Lady who uses her political position to further a partisan agenda for the incoming Nominee?

Virtually all of them, from Martha to Michelle, do in one way or another. Many of them have left behind letters and diaries that tell of doing just that. Usually it's from behind the scenes, rather than out where the nattering nabobs, and the great unwashed, can see them. That's a fairly recent phenomena. Elanor Roosevelt was the first truly "out there" First Lady. A remarkable lady.

The First Lady is probably the second most powerful member of the administration. No one has more influence than she does. In party politics she carries an immense amount of power as well. Some of them more than others, but all have huge amounts of clout.

a reply to: Byrd

As we should. Talk about a thankless job. ...and I can't think of one, right off hand, that hasn't performed her duties with grace. Can't imagine how hard it must be to watch your husband, or wife eventually, go from fairly young, full of energy, to old before their time.

I look at Obama, he and I are virtually the same age. Yet he looks ten, even twenty years older sometimes. That would be a tough thing to watch, and nothing you can do about it.

So caring for them, protecting them, for the rest of their lives seems a small enough favor/duty.

originally posted by: Mike Stivic
a reply to: Byrd

Byrd,
I have a lot of respect for you, I love your threads, I enjoy your devotion to research.
And appreciate it.

I am no fan of the bushes, in fact im not really a fan of bipartisan politics and the results they produce. It is to me divide and conquer tactics.

But,surely you do not believe two wrongs make a right?


With sincere Respect,
~ meathead

I think that we look at the situation differently.

You may be looking at it as a black/white choice or in terms of other absolutes. I see the whole thing as a superwicked problem (a more complex variant of a wicked problem). As an anthropologist, I'm also aware that the world is not America and America is not the world and try to clear a bias of thinking that what we think/say/do/believe is the mark by which the world must abide. And I'm also aware of who has the power to do what and what the President can actually accomplish even if everyone cooperated with him.

And I am in love with and am fascinated by the whole mess. What an amazing time to be alive!

So where you might go for one issue, the larger one I see involves who can play the Game Of Power with other nations. It's like a vast interaction on Facebook -- who can make allies and shut down the other person without losing the "moral high ground" - because the minute we lose that, we are open to others building a coalition and attacking. I know you've seen this on Facebook - the person who maintains their cool and keeps a civil tongue even in a tense situation does far better than the one who goes on constant rants.

So, yes, I want an expert politician that I can hire and fire [edited to add that our Constitution gives us the power to fire them.] They can be a powerful tool and far more effective than the Best Person In The World. An excellent example of this is Johnson and Carter. Carter's just the greatest guy ever - Johnson was a sleazebag politician (with an adorable wife... and I say this because one of my classmates actually knew them). But when it came to getting policies done and dealing with foreign countries, Johnson was far more effective than poor Carter.

...because the world is a superwicked problem.

...because simple solutions don't even change the nature of the problem (but complex broad spectrum moves can.)

...because even if my candidate doesn't win (I didn't vote for any of the Bushes), the world will go on and it will still be amazing and gloriously complex and I am honestly delighted to be living in these times.

Everyone else's mileage will vary.

a reply to: windword

Windword,

I feel like you don't understand what im saying

I definitely can not see your point here.

So we are at an impasse, and it is sad, because I am not your enemy.


This thread is not about how much Hillary or trump accrue in expenses for the secret service provided for them for this campaign.

It is not about presidential family vacations or how much they cost, or about any of that...

It is about the first lady campaigning for a candidate...

If I wanted to talk about trump I would go to any OF THE MANY threads available to do so..

And so I feel as though what we have here is a failure to communicate.

I don't want to get into an egg eating contest.

Good luck friend,

Respectfully,
~meathead

a reply to: windword

POTUS and FLOTUS have not lost their rights to free speech and free expression to campaign for whoever they like. In reality, you don't even know who's paying for the their travel expenses. But what I am saying is that there is a budget for that kind of thing, and it's not illegal, even though you might not like it! I'm pretty sure ALL the Bushes are still getting Secret Service benefits, regardless of where they travel or who they speak for.

No, they haven't. They are, one would suppose, expected to take care how they say whatever it is they have to say, as it does, for good or for ill, reflect upon the country in some fashion.

All former Presidents and their families qualify for that Secret Service protection. Not sure why anyone would have an issue with that, frankly.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: windword

It's because she is a woman. Women are supposed to keep quiet, smile a lot and make sammiches. They aren't supposed to have a brain of their own. Duh.

That is Debatable .



Michelle Obama, wife of the President and First Lady, was born Michael LaVaughn Robinson in Chicago, Illinois on January 17th, 1964, the second son born of Fraser Robinson III and Marian Shields Robinson. On January 13th, 1983, he underwent sex reassignment surgery at Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine.

a reply to: Zanti Misfit

By all means make those claims but back them up with something. Otherwise it looks like you have an agenda to spread misinfo to discredit someone you dont agree with.

a reply to: Pyle

You want Proof ? Look Between her Legs . Guess the Docs could not Hide that one .

a reply to: Zanti Misfit

What would we find there? You said sexual assignment surgery was done in 1983! Make up your mind, you can't have it both ways.