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Dutch Investigators Give Results of MH17 Probe to Families

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posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:44 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

This one looks like a transcript. So if people can't watch the video they can read what was said.




posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:45 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

Watch the press conference where they lay out their case / evidence.
edit on 28-9-2016 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:46 AM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Velatropa24

Neither is anything released by Russian intelligence, especially when Russia is one of the actors in the crime.

But thank you for proving my point.


This is your logic in a box:

Everything official russia says is a lie.
Everything official US or official pro US entity says is unquestionable truth.

Says a lot about your intelligence.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:48 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

Im just using your standard. I take it you dont like it when its applied to your own line of thinking. Not surprising.

Watch -



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:51 AM
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originally posted by: MongolianPaellaFish
Russian missile from an area controlled by pro-Russian Ukranian rebels.

Doesn't take long to join the dots on that one.


So true except for the programmed Russians they only believe what RT tell them and everything else is a lie.

Shame Shame more like North Korea every day. Poor Slaves. Tell some Truth FFS.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:54 AM
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originally posted by: Velatropa24

originally posted by: MongolianPaellaFish
Russian missile from an area controlled by pro-Russian Ukranian rebels.

Doesn't take long to join the dots on that one.


Prove it got fored from pro russian separatist areas. Ive heard the claim. Where is the proof? Saying that Duch investigators said so does not constitute proof.


I suggest you ask the Dutch investigators. They're the ones with the evidence.




posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:58 AM
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originally posted by: skywatcher44

originally posted by: MongolianPaellaFish
Russian missile from an area controlled by pro-Russian Ukranian rebels.

Doesn't take long to join the dots on that one.


So true except for the programmed Russians they only believe what RT tell them and everything else is a lie.

Shame Shame more like North Korea every day. Poor Slaves. Tell some Truth FFS.



I'd say the exact same thing, except put americans where Russia is. Saying that a whole nation watches only RT is utter ignorance - opinion with no knowledge. This is what I am dealing with here. Its like arguing with a monkey about nuclear physics.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 10:58 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

Russia never invaded Ukraine, they came to the aid of Eastern Ukraines who declared themselves Russian citizens who were subject to being murdered by Nazi's approved by the US

Russia effectively did to the Eastern Ukrainian rebels what the US are doing currently for the moderate rebels in Syria, also what they did in Libya, also what they did in Afghanistan



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:01 AM
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originally posted by: Discotech
a reply to: Xcathdra

Russia never invaded Ukraine, they came to the aid of Eastern Ukraines who declared themselves Russian citizens who were subject to being murdered by Nazi's approved by the US

Russia effectively did to the Eastern Ukrainian rebels what the US are doing currently for the moderate rebels in Syria, also what they did in Libya, also what they did in Afghanistan


It's no use. Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story...



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

I agree with you. I'm not buying it either. It's alarming how quick so many other people are to buy into it, though. The evidence so far does not point to Russia, and while everyone in America has been busy embracing their inner kindergartener with regard to the election drama, the seed has been quietly sown the whole time in the periphery that Russia is rapidly becoming public enemy number one. This is going to be very bad.
edit on 300211America/ChicagoWed, 28 Sep 2016 11:02:31 -050030am30271America/Chicago by tigertatzen because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:03 AM
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a reply to: Discotech

No they invaded and no amount of Russian lies can change that fact. The UN asked Russia numerous times to provide evidence of the "killing of ethnic Russians". To date, they have never provided evidence. Secondly that excuse for invading Ukraine was the same excuse Hitler used to invade its neighbors - the killing of ethnic Germans.

Secondly there are more Nazis in the Russian Duma than the Ukraine government. A fact pro russians seem woefully ignorant up, most likely for obvious reasons.

Using your logic dont the Syrians who dont want to be syrians under an assad regime have the right to fight for their independence?



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:03 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

While they may not all watch RT the simple fact is that their media is owned and operated by the Kremlin. That makes it kind of hard to news that isn't government approved. There's a reason why Russia is consistently towards the bottom of Reporters Without Borders' Freedom of Press Index.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:03 AM
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Okay for those who think Ukraine did this and it wasn't Russian nacked separatists can you explain how a BUK system made it's way well into separatist held territory shot the missile and got back out without being captured or destroyed before it alledgedly went back to government held territory?

Also explain where the separatists obtained the BUK they had, because of the one's they took from the Ukraine military were not operational...and yes we already know they had one operational in the area at the time thanks to the Reuters article I linked earlier in this thread...so where did it come from?

Also why would the Ukraine military have the need to use one against those who don't have aircraft flying in the conflict...which Ukraine did have and was pounding the separatists from the air...so why would they need tp use it?

You see simple things like that are what certain others are forgetting just so they can defend Russia and I find it amazing to say the least.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:04 AM
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originally posted by: Velatropa24

It's no use. Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story...


A perfect analogy for Russia who has provided the world with false story after false story on the shootdown while trying to malign the truth.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:05 AM
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a reply to: tigertatzen

It was a 2 year criminal investigation and the evidence was laid out in the press conference. No amount of wishful thinking can change facts - as Russia is discovering.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:17 AM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Velatropa24

While they may not all watch RT the simple fact is that their media is owned and operated by the Kremlin. That makes it kind of hard to news that isn't government approved. There's a reason why Russia is consistently towards the bottom of Reporters Without Borders' Freedom of Press Index.


The fact that you believe that says a lot about how successful the american media is at brainwashing you...



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:20 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

Yes or no. Most media outlets in Russia are owned and operated by the government. Yes or no. Russia consistently ranks towards the bottom of the Freedom of Press Index.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:26 AM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Velatropa24

Yes or no. Most media outlets in Russia are owned and operated by the government. Yes or no. Russia consistently ranks towards the bottom of the Freedom of Press Index.

I have a different question for you. Who is responsible for making such rankings? Or global credit ratings etc...? You are so simple, it's funny...



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:29 AM
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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: Velatropa24

Yes or no. Most media outlets in Russia are owned and operated by the government. Yes or no. Russia consistently ranks towards the bottom of the Freedom of Press Index.

I have never seen news as biased, un-neutral, as opinion filled as what is coming out of US. And in case you didn't know, we get most the US and European channels in Russia. Go figure.



posted on Sep, 28 2016 @ 11:32 AM
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a reply to: Velatropa24

World Press Freedom Index



What is it?

Published every year since 2002 by Reporters Without Borders (RSF), the World Press Freedom Index is an important advocacy tool based on the principle of emulation between states. Because it is well known, its influence over governments is growing. Many heads of state and government fear its annual publication. 2002
Year of the first edition of the ranking
The Index is a point of reference that is quoted by media throughout the world and is used by diplomats and international entities such as the United Nations and the World Bank.

What does it measure?

The Index ranks 180 countries according to the level of freedom available to journalists. It is a snapshot of the media freedom situation based on an evaluation of pluralism, independence of the media, quality of legislative framework and safety of journalists in each country. It does not rank public policies even if governments obviously have a major impact on their country’s ranking. Nor is it an indicator of the quality of journalism in each country.

The global indicator and regional indicators

Along with the Index, RSF calculates a global indicator and regional indicators that evaluate the overall performance of countries (in the world and in each region) as regards media freedom. It is an absolute measure that complements the Index’s comparative rankings. The global indicator is the average of the regional indicators, each of which is obtained by averaging the scores of all the countries in the region, weighted according to their population as given by the World Bank.


How the index is compiled

The degree of freedom available to journalists in 180 countries is determined by pooling the responses of experts to a questionnaire devised by RSF. This qualitative analysis is combined with quantitative data on abuses and acts of violence against journalists during the period evaluated. The criteria used in the questionnaire are pluralism, media independence, media environment and self-censorship, legislative framework, transparency, and the quality of the infrastructure that supports the production of news and information.

Click here for more information
The questionnaire

To compile the Index, RSF has developed an online questionnaire with 87 questions focused on these criteria. Translated into 20 languages including English, Arabic, Chinese, Russian, Indonesian and Korean, the questionnaire is targeted at the media professionals, lawyers and sociologists who are asked to complete it. Scores are calculated on the basis of the responses of the experts selected by RSF combined with the data on abuses and violence against journalists during the period evaluated.


The data on abuses

A team of in-house specialists, each assigned to a different geographical region, keeps a detailed tally of abuses and violence against journalists and media outlets. These reasearchers also rely on a network of correspondents in 130 countries. The Abuses indicator for each country is calculated on the basis of the data about the intensity of abuses and violence against media actors during the period evaluated. This quantitative indicator is then used to weight the qualitative analysis of the situation in the country based on the replies to the questionnaires.


The press freedom map

The press freedom map, which is distributed in print and digital versions, offers a visual overview of the sitution in each country in the Index. The colour categories are assigned as follows: good (white), fairly good (yellow), problematic (yellow), bad (red) and very bad (black).



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