It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Help ATS via PayPal:
learn more

At What Point Do False Accusations Trump Free Speech???

page: 1
3
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 05:48 PM
link   
With all the mud slinging in today's pooitical arena. It made me wonder , at what point do false accusations and free speech collide.

Shouldn't there be some accountability if you accuse some one of a horrible crime with little or no evidence.

Could a presidential canidate sue the other canidate for slander?

Could you be like "you said X. Now prove it."

Should their be criminal charges??

Say you falsely accuse some one of rape, is there no penalty?


It just seems crazy you can do things like that and then just "pass the the peas and potatoes..."




posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 05:56 PM
link   

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
With all the mud slinging in today's pooitical arena. It made me wonder , at what point do false accusations and free speech collide.

Shouldn't there be some accountability if you accuse some one of a horrible crime with little or no evidence.

Could a presidential canidate sue the other canidate for slander?

Could you be like "you said X. Now prove it."

Should their be criminal charges??

Say you falsely accuse some one of rape, is there no penalty?


It just seems crazy you can do things like that and then just "pass the the peas and potatoes..."





Yes, one candidate can sue the other for slander. They don't, simply because they would be counter sued.

Can they ask to prove X? I doubt it, not until the candidate has completed at least 1 term.

Criminal charges? No, these sort of things are dealt with through civil proceedings.

Accusing someone of something they didn't do is slander, something they print is libel.

Hope that helps.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 05:58 PM
link   
Free speech under the first amendment is one thing, but a liar has no credibility.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:00 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Thats why they call it politics.

Dirty, underhanded, slanderous, smear campaigns to ridicule and discredit your opponent. Hopefully enough of that sour sauce gets your opponent to say do things they then regret and be declared incompetent.

See, See?! I knew the other side were jerks. Just just look at what they are saying.

Can't wait till they get to do it live face to face on National TV.

I wanna see Hillary stutter, swoon and evaporate in a puff of mist.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:03 PM
link   

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
With all the mud slinging in today's pooitical arena. It made me wonder , at what point do false accusations and free speech collide.

Shouldn't there be some accountability if you accuse some one of a horrible crime with little or no evidence.

Could a presidential canidate sue the other canidate for slander?

Could you be like "you said X. Now prove it."

Should their be criminal charges??

Say you falsely accuse some one of rape, is there no penalty?


It just seems crazy you can do things like that and then just "pass the the peas and potatoes..."





Yes, one candidate can sue the other for slander. They don't, simply because they would be counter sued.

Can they ask to prove X? I doubt it, not until the candidate has completed at least 1 term.

Criminal charges? No, these sort of things are dealt with through civil proceedings.

Accusing someone of something they didn't do is slander, something they print is libel.

Hope that helps.



Thank you.

Man blows my mind the bigger charges arnt criminal..espeacially when obviously false.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:03 PM
link   


at what point do false accusations and free speech collide.


At the beginning, because "false accusations" are lies.
Some do not understand what free speech means. It means you can speak out your thoughts and not be prosecuted for the content... IF it´s the truth and not offensive against others. Simple as that.

Contrary to what most think, spreading lies and calling someone an asshole is not covered by free speech. Free speech does not mean you are free to say anything you like.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:05 PM
link   

originally posted by: Nickn3
Free speech under the first amendment is one thing, but a liar has no credibility.


True enough, and that's part of the issue. But the first amendment is vastly misunderstood. All the First amendment does is enjoin the government, and ONLY the government, from restraining your right to free speech in a public forum, and ONLY a public forum. ATS, for example, is NOT a public forum; it's privately owned. In fact, most places are not considered public forums. Not only that, the Federal government is the only entity who is restrained from governing what you say. That does not apply to anybody else, including companies and employers.

So when you;re in an argument and someone says they can say anything they want to because....free speech...they really don't know what they are talking about.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:12 PM
link   
I predict a busy overloaded court system in the near future with all the SJW millenials suing frivolously for micro aggressions. A smart youth would invest their time in a law degree, one could get filthy rich without ever winning a case.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:14 PM
link   

originally posted by: verschickter



at what point do false accusations and free speech collide.


At the beginning, because "false accusations" are lies.
Some do not understand what free speech means. It means you can speak out your thoughts and not be prosecuted for the content... IF it´s the truth and not offensive against others. Simple as that.

Contrary to what most think, spreading lies and calling someone an asshole is not covered by free speech. Free speech does not mean you are free to say anything you like.



Appearently so if it is only a civil matter. Meaning then your not suing for what they said. It is for your losses at that point .


Think about a false rape allegation. Your charged with "making a false report" not falsely accusing some one of rape..



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:15 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

I feel the same way-there should be consequences-especially when someone accuses someone of racism/being a racist.

I seem to notice that is left off of your list.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:19 PM
link   

originally posted by: Picklesneeze
a reply to: JoshuaCox

I feel the same way-there should be consequences-especially when someone accuses someone of racism/being a racist.

I seem to notice that is left off of your list.



That's not a crime in the first place. Your legally allowed to be a racist.


Now any accusations of actual crimes I agree with you.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:22 PM
link   

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
I predict a busy overloaded court system in the near future with all the SJW millenials suing frivolously for micro aggressions. A smart youth would invest their time in a law degree, one could get filthy rich without ever winning a case.







I'm not talking about political correctness nor the unprovable. I mean crimes. Like rape, murder, childmolestation , theft, exc..


Being a racist isn't a crime in the first place..



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:31 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox
No, that´s the stateattorney raising the charges about "false report". You are free to join him in a civil case and sue the crap out of the individum. It´s up to you to sue him and if there is already a case open, chances are great it will be granted.



Being a racist isn't a crime in the first place..

Correct. But let´s leave aside the "fellony" and "crime" markers and concentrate on a guy standing at the market, shouting racial slurs, you could be sued for disturbing public peace, at least. There is a point where this also becomes a crime, in terms of prison time.

At least that´s how it is in germany, don´t know about the US.
edit on 20-9-2016 by verschickter because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 06:44 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Look up the 2 words "libel" and "slander". However, once people are in the public eye (aka "famous"), it becomes a lot harder to sue for these. Famous people usually have to prove a material loss in order to win (such as, someone's slander caused them to lose an endorsement deal, hurt their public image and sales, etc).



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 08:39 PM
link   

originally posted by: verschickter
a reply to: JoshuaCox
No, that´s the stateattorney raising the charges about "false report". You are free to join him in a civil case and sue the crap out of the individum. It´s up to you to sue him and if there is already a case open, chances are great it will be granted.



Being a racist isn't a crime in the first place..

Correct. But let´s leave aside the "fellony" and "crime" markers and concentrate on a guy standing at the market, shouting racial slurs, you could be sued for disturbing public peace, at least. There is a point where this also becomes a crime, in terms of prison time.

At least that´s how it is in germany, don´t know about the US.


I'm not talking, being sued isn't commiting a crime. I only say that because you can sue for ANY reason. There is no burden of proof to sue, and damages are required.

Idk, I just find it horrible you can accuse random people celebrities of rape and murder and it's just cool...and if it catches own millions of people actually believe it...



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 08:41 PM
link   

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Look up the 2 words "libel" and "slander". However, once people are in the public eye (aka "famous"), it becomes a lot harder to sue for these. Famous people usually have to prove a material loss in order to win (such as, someone's slander caused them to lose an endorsement deal, hurt their public image and sales, etc).


That's why I think it doesn't count.its not the accusation, but the loss of money that is illegal. The accusation is free.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 08:44 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

We throw false accusations around here daily.

Would you want a censored ATS?



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 08:47 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

It´s horrible, I agree.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 09:23 PM
link   

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: JoshuaCox

We throw false accusations around here daily.

Would you want a censored ATS?





When it comes to accusing human beings of heinous crimes with absolutely zero evidence . Yea.

If your talking about conspiracy stuff that doesn't apply to an individual. No.



posted on Sep, 20 2016 @ 09:27 PM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

So if I accused you of being treasonous because of a political stance, you'd want my speech censored?




top topics



 
3
<<   2 >>

log in

join