Revamping the Two Party system

Bernie Sanders said that voters have rejected the two party system in the mid-term elections. It isn't hard to see that people don't believe the two party system works when the left and right wing are both on the same bird. Either they flap together and fly in a direction the people don't want, or, they flap opposite each other and fly in circles. Either way - America loses.

It started becoming obvious that people have had enough with both major parties years ago. The end result of that seems to have been the division of both parties into sub-sets of the original, each extolling some of the partisan platforms of the parent organization. It is insulting to think the parties both split down the middle and offered us two new choices: we can either choose the half that lies, or the half that poops. But its still all the same animal and regardless of which end you support, you still end up going where the animal goes. In other words, they offered us nothing new.

So the question is this: is it still possible to change? Does Trump making waves show that the people are so fed up with the same choices that they would even vote for him actually proving anything? Or does that also play in to the hands of the same two party demon? It is becoming more and more clear that if Trump wins he will not have the support of either party. What does that say for his chances of getting anywhere with congress?

The two parties are more divided than ever before and the hatred and animosity is at an all time high between them. It is unlikely that either side would accept a really great idea if it came from the wrong side of the aisle. What chance does Trump, or anyone else have, in getting things done to actually benefit this nation and its people? The two major party ideologies have become so polarized that neither one is effective any more. Nothing so extreme can exist in balance and harmony and be effective. With both parties as deeply entrenched as they appear to be, what chance is there for real change? How do we make it happen?

In real world terms, can it be done or is it a pipe dream?

Three party deal....IDK........would it be the voting counting deally...
Hard to figure out a reliable system without exit polls.....that would work.....everyone vote on national T V.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

A President doesn't need Congressional support to do his or her job properly. It isn't the President's job to make laws, only to see they are enforced. Presidents and Congress have jockeyed to expand their powers since nearly the beginning of the Republic. What we need is a President who is content to exercise the powers authorized by the Constitution. Unfortunately, candidates running for office promise this and that, which often extends beyond the powers of the President.

Not to worry, though. You can rest assured that if banks or insurance companies need another bailout, if the NSA needs new spying authority, or if another Middle Eastern country needs a regime change, Republicans and Democrats will come together in a heartwarming display of bipartisan cooperation to get the job done.

The problem is our media. They don't report anything that would indicate that the two party system isn't good. They pretend that it's republicans vs democrats and why buy into it.

On, ATS, we're a little bit more informed, but still, if you look at the political threads, they're dominated with Obama was the worse, let's get a Republican in there sentiment. How many people even know who Jill Stein is or that there are other candidates and choices?

I was hoping that with Twitter, Facebook and social media, and more and more people getting their news from alternative sources things would have changes by now, they are, but way too slowley.

The two party system needs to be dissolved. Finally are seeing a time when these candidates are resonating enough to have people seeing that. It's time to go with it.

Asking about real change? Well, the issue would be that won't happen if even the elected is of the non establishment runners if people go back to ignoring the major issues at hand thinking the candidate will save everyone.

Good answers all...

Once the election is over, regardless of who won, it should be back to business for congress. When people, including congress, actually respected the office of President that is how it was. It seems like the President has to be more of a referee than a leader these days. That doesn't work in the long run.

One of the things I have concluded recently is that congress is no longer necessary. It seems all they do is take bribes, bicker, and go on vacation after voting themselves a nice fat raise. That isn't solving any of our problems, only their own.

In this day and age every man can vote on every issue himself. We no longer need representation, especially when those appointed to represent us completely and totally fail to do so. One man one vote can work. Each and every one of us can vote on every single issue and majority rules. Corporations and lobbyists would be rendered moot with no one to bribe.

Laws are proposed by the people, drafted, and voted on - with no piggybacks or paper clips attached. What would be really interesting is how some of the financial aspects could play out. Imagine someone proposing aid to a foreign nation. If the idea doesn't get the votes it needs, the people supporting it can still adopt it provided only the people supporting it are the ones who fund it. It is easy to be generous with other people's money. When you are ready to pay the bill yourself you can pass the law. Of course some things would not fall in to that category, but you get the idea.

This nation is dynamic. We can adapt to technology. As long as we maintain the spirit of the law of the land, that is what matters. No one likes change except wet babies, but not all change has to be bad.

Instead of just griping about it, how can we make it better? If these ideas wont work, what will?

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
Bernie Sanders said that voters have rejected the two party system in the mid-term elections. It isn't hard to see that people don't believe the two party system works when the left and right wing are both on the same bird. Either they flap together and fly in a direction the people don't want, or, they flap opposite each other and fly in circles. Either way - America loses.

It started becoming obvious that people have had enough with both major parties years ago. The end result of that seems to have been the division of both parties into sub-sets of the original, each extolling some of the partisan platforms of the parent organization. It is insulting to think the parties both split down the middle and offered us two new choices: we can either choose the half that lies, or the half that poops. But its still all the same animal and regardless of which end you support, you still end up going where the animal goes. In other words, they offered us nothing new.

So the question is this: is it still possible to change? Does Trump making waves show that the people are so fed up with the same choices that they would even vote for him actually proving anything? Or does that also play in to the hands of the same two party demon? It is becoming more and more clear that if Trump wins he will not have the support of either party. What does that say for his chances of getting anywhere with congress?

The two parties are more divided than ever before and the hatred and animosity is at an all time high between them. It is unlikely that either side would accept a really great idea if it came from the wrong side of the aisle. What chance does Trump, or anyone else have, in getting things done to actually benefit this nation and its people? The two major party ideologies have become so polarized that neither one is effective any more. Nothing so extreme can exist in balance and harmony and be effective. With both parties as deeply entrenched as they appear to be, what chance is there for real change? How do we make it happen?

In real world terms, can it be done or is it a pipe dream?

The two party system is there to make you and I think we have choice.

The two parties are just the two wings of the same bird-of-prey.

Remember; either way we vote we are choosing between two choices THEY give us.

After watching and trying to lean about American politics for 30 years I have come to the conclusion that both parties are often on the same side of the fence.

Like the situation all over the world these days, most politicians could feel quite comfortable standing for election with the other party anytime.

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
Bernie Sanders said that voters have rejected the two party system in the mid-term elections. It isn't hard to see that people don't believe the two party system works when the left and right wing are both on the same bird. Either they flap together and fly in a direction the people don't want, or, they flap opposite each other and fly in circles. Either way - America loses.

It started becoming obvious that people have had enough with both major parties years ago. The end result of that seems to have been the division of both parties into sub-sets of the original, each extolling some of the partisan platforms of the parent organization. It is insulting to think the parties both split down the middle and offered us two new choices: we can either choose the half that lies, or the half that poops. But its still all the same animal and regardless of which end you support, you still end up going where the animal goes. In other words, they offered us nothing new.

So the question is this: is it still possible to change? Does Trump making waves show that the people are so fed up with the same choices that they would even vote for him actually proving anything? Or does that also play in to the hands of the same two party demon? It is becoming more and more clear that if Trump wins he will not have the support of either party. What does that say for his chances of getting anywhere with congress?

The two parties are more divided than ever before and the hatred and animosity is at an all time high between them. It is unlikely that either side would accept a really great idea if it came from the wrong side of the aisle. What chance does Trump, or anyone else have, in getting things done to actually benefit this nation and its people? The two major party ideologies have become so polarized that neither one is effective any more. Nothing so extreme can exist in balance and harmony and be effective. With both parties as deeply entrenched as they appear to be, what chance is there for real change? How do we make it happen?

In real world terms, can it be done or is it a pipe dream?

The two party system is there to make you and I think we have choice.

The two parties are just the two wings of the same bird-of-prey.

Remember; either way we vote we are choosing between two choices THEY box us into.

After watching and trying to lean about American politics for 30 years I have come to the conclusion that both parties are often on the same side of the fence.

Like the situation all over the world these days, most politicians could feel quite comfortable standing for election with the other party anytime.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

I mean I'm not sure my opinion counts as I'm not american, But I can say that I feel like it must be frustrating as an american voter to feel like you have to fit under one of two umbrellas and hope it slightly represents you.

From far left to far right and everything in between there are so many different views and opinions. I mean having 20 people running for the Republican candidacy is evidence of this alone. Each candidate spouting something different, showing how much difference there is between opinion and whats important within the party itself.

I live in New Zealand, and we have several parties. About 4 or 5 make in in each year and get seats based on a percentage.
It feels like you are actually being represented more accurately.

a reply to: Vroomfondel

I think it can be done, but I think people go about it all wrong. 99% of our attention is focused on running for president, but that's not the office you need to look to in order to get third parties set up. If you want to break the two party system you have to start smaller, pick off local elections, identify weak congressional seats and offer an alternative, and so on. Ideally you do this in off year elections because too many people vote party line in presidential elections.

Third parties should focus on the House, get a few people elected across the country, and then build a caucus to elect a Senator or two. With those people, get an important piece of legislation or two passed, again preferably when no one is watching so you can avoid party politics, you can use it later to look like uniters. Once that is done and you have an actual base to give the party national attention (even 10 congressmen total is enough), that's when you put someone up for President.

With any luck you can accomplish this alongside 1-2 other minor, but established parties as well. There's strength in numbers and if there's 3 real candidates the general election debates are going to be more likely to include them rather than just R vs D.

This does however require changing majority rules from 270 EV to whoever gets the most votes (a hint for whoever is looking for that major piece of legislation to get passed).