The Numbers Say That A Major Global Recession Has Already Begun

a reply to: Jonjonj

I see. So you're ignorant.

Since you're not in the US let me explain this to you slowly. Few people like obamacare. It seems to only benefit insurance companies. Perhaps collusion between them and government via lobbying. I've heard very few people talk about how their situation improved as a result of obamacare. People usually get reductions in benefits and raised costs if they join. Businesses that are already struggling have even more possibility of going too far under. It's a lose lose for most parties involved.

So this smart ass realizes you're focusing on details due to some false belief. It has little to do with "profits" and certainly the poster gave no indication of that being his only focus.

That young MIT economist shown that wealth inequality and hence high rent is due to nimbyism. A combination of regulations, rent seeking by .gov via permits, and then general nimbyism via zoning, ordinances, homeowner associations.

This makes it not possible to build nice low income houses because the cost due to nimbyism are too high. high rent is a direct result of nimbyism.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: Jonjonj

I see. So you're ignorant.

Since you're not in the US let me explain this to you slowly. Few people like obamacare. It seems to only benefit insurance companies. Perhaps collusion between them and government via lobbying. I've heard very few people talk about how their situation improved as a result of obamacare. People usually get reductions in benefits and raised costs if they join. Businesses that are already struggling have even more possibility of going too far under. It's a lose lose for most parties involved.

So this smart ass realizes you're focusing on details due to some false belief. It has little to do with "profits" and certainly the poster gave no indication of that being his only focus.

You would hear a lot more stories about Obamacares success if 24 states didn't reject a fully paid for Medicare expansion, just on the basis of "f# the poor people", which has resulted in several million being too poor to pay for insurance and not having a safety net. People in those 24 states were hit the hardest, because now they have to take a penalty for not having care, or buy care they can't afford, when it was supposed to be provided to them.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: Jonjonj

I see. So you're ignorant.

Since you're not in the US let me explain this to you slowly. Few people like obamacare. It seems to only benefit insurance companies. Perhaps collusion between them and government via lobbying. I've heard very few people talk about how their situation improved as a result of obamacare. People usually get reductions in benefits and raised costs if they join. Businesses that are already struggling have even more possibility of going too far under. It's a lose lose for most parties involved.

So this smart ass realizes you're focusing on details due to some false belief. It has little to do with "profits" and certainly the poster gave no indication of that being his only focus.

You would hear a lot more stories about Obamacares success if 24 states didn't reject a fully paid for Medicare expansion, just on the basis of "f# the poor people", which has resulted in several million being too poor to pay for insurance and not having a safety net. People in those 24 states were hit the hardest, because now they have to take a penalty for not having care, or buy care they can't afford, when it was supposed to be provided to them.

Except that 24 states didn't reject a fully paid for Medicare expansion. Those 24 states rejected the Medicare expansion system and federal money to pay for it because the federal money was only going to pay for the first two years. After that, the states were on their own. The 24 states that rejected this expansion had enough brains to realize that if the expansion survived the first two years, it would fail in the third year due to lack of funds, because there was no more federal footing of the bill.

Of the 26 states that did accept federal money, and built their healthcare exchanges, more than half of them have collapsed - within the first three years.

But the liberalized news doesn't say that, does it? It just says "Oh look at these idiot conservative states who didn't expand..." without going into the reasons WHY those states didn't expand, and that over half of the expanded states have wasted billions of dollars and collapsed.

a reply to: Aazadan

You're probably correct, we would hear more Obamacare success stories... if they existed. Fact is, they don't and the rest of us would just be paying even more if those 24 states had signed on... it's a steaming pile of horsesnip and needs to go in its entirety. Nobody making enough money to logistically provide for their own family should be drug into not being able to even afford to do that thanks to being strongarmed into paying for a bunch of strangers.

a reply to: Ameilia

"But the liberalized news doesn't say that, does it? It just says "Oh look at these idiot conservative states who didn't expand..." without going into the reasons WHY those states didn't expand, and that over half of the expanded states have wasted billions of dollars and collapsed."
So what happened to the great Conservative Cut,Cut,State of Kansas:
www.usnews.com...
New, more pessimistic Kansas revenue forecast forces immediate budget changes to avert deficit

Buisness booms in hidden places. The USA and China rule, however there are huge money movers in the world that most do not even know about.

Good place to research:

MIT's Observatory of Economic Complexity

a reply to: MOMof3

Kansas is a oil and Natural Gas producing state. They also have a lot riding on aerospace, the energy sector is scraping the bottom of the barrel and aerospace has dropped considerably thanks to federal cuts. Kansas woes would be happening regardless of what their state decided to do at this point. They're a good indicator of coming troubles for the country as a whole.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Sorry. But I don't believe that because I don't believe in coincidences.

a reply to: MOMof3

It's isn't a coincidence, every major oil producing state is hurting right now. Alaska is in far worse shape that Kansas.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: Aazadan

You're probably correct, we would hear more Obamacare success stories... if they existed. Fact is, they don't and the rest of us would just be paying even more if those 24 states had signed on... it's a steaming pile of horsesnip and needs to go in its entirety. Nobody making enough money to logistically provide for their own family should be drug into not being able to even afford to do that thanks to being strongarmed into paying for a bunch of strangers.

It depends on how you want to define success. If you're going by cheaper care, then there is no success, but Obamacare wasn't written in a way to make care cheaper, it's a giant corporate giveaway and proper insurance is damn expensive when our health care system costs so much. It doesn't help matters one bit that prior to Obamacare most people didn't actually had proper insurance, they had something but in any field outside of health care it wouldn't have been considered insurance.

On the other hand there are 26 states worth of success stories where people who weren't covered are now covered. To balance that out you have a few where people had coverage and now are going without and paying the fine instead, but those are all situations where people have the option of making lifestyle changes in order to afford care now and choose not to. Which is really a bigger statement on the fact that the cost of rent is spiraling out of control rather than a testament to Obamacare.

Overall Obamacare is far from perfect but it's better than what we had, but so far no one had put forth a competing idea that will actually work other than single payer, but there's a lot of resistance to that because people don't want socialism. So we're back to a question of money. Lets assume the $15/hour minimum wage goes in, and then lets assume prices don't increase as a result of that increase (something we both know won't happen). That's an income of $26,250/year (15/hour, 35 hours/week, 50 weeks/year... yes I'm giving people unpaid vacation time). A low end rent+utilities is going to run you $1000/month in a city, taxes are going to run you about 26%. Proper food is going to run you $150/month to lowball it. Cars average $50/month to own (or to save up for a new one), $50/month in gas (if you live in a small town like me and fill up once every 2 weeks), another $50 for minimal insurance, and probably another $75 average in repairs (if you're lucky, the true cost is likely higher). These expenses are necessary to actually get to and from work. So that's:
Income - +$26250
Shelter - -$12000
Taxes - -$6825
Food - -$1800
Travel - -$2700

That leaves $2925 annually or $243.75 for everything else.

The lowest cost plan, a bronze plan which doesn't really even cover anything is around $300/month. It simply doesn't work because we need something that can fully cover someone for no more than $243.75. No amount of tweaking insurance plans is going to change that, only changing what's actually charged so that insurance companies pay out less money can fix it.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

That is too bad, being the wife of a retired construction worker. I get hard times. Poor idea letting one industry have so much power. Now is the time for education and retraining and get Fed funds. I looked at the jobs listed in my area here in Washington state. Less than 50K population. Five pages of jobs. But we have a well trained work force, water, cheap power.

a reply to: Aazadan

See, here's where it's a failure... None of what you just posted is my problem or my responsibility. Life sucks, buy a helmet. Don't conduct a giveaway to the Kept Voter base and tell me I'm paying the bill for it.

Atlas is beginning to roll his shoulders... look out below.

a reply to: Jonjonj

It depends on what you local economy is. Where I'm at, the wage floor is $7.50/hour. A minimum wage hike to $15/hour would be a titanic catastrophe for our entire economy top to bottom. There are a lot of people who are paid at nowhere near minimum wage that would suddenly, by definition be minimum wage and get pretty hefty raises who are making an OK living now in our local market.

So think twice before you spout off.

So you wont mind if people pass you by and don't even bother to pee on you when you are lying in the street on fire?

reply to burdman

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: Aazadan

See, here's where it's a failure... None of what you just posted is my problem or my responsibility. Life sucks, buy a helmet. Don't conduct a giveaway to the Kept Voter base and tell me I'm paying the bill for it.

Atlas is beginning to roll his shoulders... look out below.

If you want to live in society, then it is your problem that heath care is quite simply unaffordable for most people. Not only do you have a social responsibility to make sure society isn't sick but it personally benefits you. Healthy people with money in their pockets can go out and purchase things, some of which will be at your business, which puts money in your pocket. When health care is affordable and a persons wages allow them to actually purchase it, it means that you aren't paying for it, they are.

When affordable health care doesn't exist there are fewer people since they're dead and they're less able to spend which means the economy and your business by extension does worse, and those who do have money have it taken to try and cover those who don't.

a reply to: pikestaff

DontTreadOnMe really ever see myself in that situation. I'll find my own way to get what I need... the dole is lucrative, until you realize that the gravy train eventually runs out of gravy and then you're left looking like Greece.

a reply to: Jonjonj

I am not American, just to be clear. BUT...every single thing you have said is related to profit, the only thing that seems to mean anything to you is profit. I would be ashamed if I were you, your world is falling apart but what?

Because profit means a company can stay in business. Being in business means more jobs. Having a job means having the ability to put food on the table. Really, it's about putting food on the table. It's a long stretch for people to think that far, but there you go.


You can't run a business forever on loans. We merged with 6 companies who tried to run their business on loans alone, not profit. Then when the banks said "no more loans" we bought them out.

Profit doesn't mean everything, but it's a start to helping people have basic necessities and being independent, instead of being children who rely on others for basics. The culture in the US is not the same as in Europe. Americans want to have jobs so they can be independent. We Americans already have plenty of experience being dependent on the gov't and the gov't screwing things up. This is nothing new. We already know our gov't doesn't work no matter what it does. That's why thinking people don't want any more gov't interference...in anything. We have several generations of experience with inefficient and failed gov't programs to draw from.

But profit is just a means to an end and shouldn't be the only thing a business looks at. Long term survival is what businesses, and individuals, should look at. Lack of long-term planning is a common failure point in business, individuals, and government plans. See Greece.

Here are a few links about Greece, and why it's a warning shot of possible further collapse in other similar countries.

All the "free" healthcare is great until you look at the debt per capita in those countries that provide socialized healthcare.