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Philosophical question regarding US military resolve brought on by YT video

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posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:29 PM
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I was watching this documentary on the Cromwell tank when I came open a description of a beach landing of armor with wounded friendly troops lying in the path of his tank. He had to give the command to keep driving dooming the men in the way to be crushed under the track to Martin the offensive and not make the tank a stationary target.

This really got me thinking with all this talk of the U.S. and Russia not shying down from butting heads which is leading to a "cool" war that even with a miscalculation could go warm very quickly, is the average U.S. Servicemember able to make that kind of decision for the greater tactical good? Can he knowing submit a fellow troop to a gruesome death to avoid becoming combat ineffective? I know that the our troops are battle hardened and trained extremely well but I think it's going to be a whole 'nother ballpark than what the average troop is mentally prepared for.

Here is the clip in question it starts at 34:56 and goes to 35:54

youtu.be...

I'm having trouble figuring out embed on mobile so maybe someone could embed it in the thread.

What do you think the average trooper would be able to do to achieve military success in the face of adversity?




posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:41 PM
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a reply to: BigDave-AR

There's no rationalization that can really answer that.

Can an individual after making some big life changing decisions justify to man and his idea of God , be ok with said decisions and why...etc

Then we have the law of the land, some don't question.

Neat that you put it in this forum.

Cheers



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:44 PM
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a reply to: BigDave-AR

It happens ALL the time. On both sides.
THAT is the job that you agreed to do.
Honor ONLY is what makes you actually DO it.
Forward elements have a job for those behind them,that takes precidence.
edit on 14-9-2015 by cavtrooper7 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: BigDave-AR

I was in the artillery, we get what are called " danger close" fire missions....

This means our rounds might kill our own guys, in the FDC, so we flinch, or call the gun line?

We call the gun line and make it hell on earth as the " steel rain" kills by the hundreds and thousands without hesitation.....

Because we know our guys wouldn't call for this without great need, and they know we would never hit them on purpose.....

War is hell man, shtf hard..... And it splatters where it will

Sometimes a bad option is the only option, because the other option is automatic death to our guys.



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:52 PM
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originally posted by: Treespeaker
a reply to: BigDave-AR

There's no rationalization that can really answer that.

Can an individual after making some big life changing decisions justify to man and his idea of God , be ok with said decisions and why...etc

Then we have the law of the land, some don't question.

Neat that you put it in this forum.

Cheers

On top of whether they could physically and mentally make that decision on the spot influenced by fear for their own lives. How is that going to effect him mentally when he has time to process the repercussion of his action on his mental state?

Honestly wasn't sure where to post it, this was my best guess as military projects doesn't apply and it's not quite WW3 forum material IMO but if I'm wrong let me know.



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:52 PM
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originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: BigDave-AR

It happens ALL the time. On both sides.
THAT is the job that you agreed to do.
Honor ONLY is what makes you actually DO it.
Forward elements have a job for those behind them,that takes precidence.


Exactly!!!

War ain't pretty, or black and white like the op wishes to have it explained , it is all a giant Grey area and real folks die for no other reason than saving 25 was more important than saving 1.....



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:52 PM
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Mission Accomplishment then troop welfare, sad but true fact of war I think.

Hopefully you have officers that are able to make such a decision on a last resort bases.

Man you can see that man get somewhat choked up about it when describing it...



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 05:59 PM
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I hope no one feels that I am underestimating my home country of the U.S's military prowess or the bravery and strength of our men and women in uniform because that is not at all the case.
edit on 9/14/2015 by BigDave-AR because: Grammar-



posted on Sep, 14 2015 @ 06:46 PM
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a reply to: BigDave-AR

Well the philosophy and metaphysics forum probably would not have been a bad idea.lol.

But then you would not have seen such perspective, I'm past military....means little...its perspective like another said.

How can one live with ones decisions? And he happy.? Many roads to the same place is my understanding and it's not in a building.

Cheers




posted on Sep, 15 2015 @ 05:30 AM
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originally posted by: johnwick

originally posted by: cavtrooper7
a reply to: BigDave-AR

It happens ALL the time. On both sides.
THAT is the job that you agreed to do.
Honor ONLY is what makes you actually DO it.
Forward elements have a job for those behind them,that takes precidence.


Exactly!!!

War ain't pretty, or black and white like the op wishes to have it explained , it is all a giant Grey area and real folks die for no other reason than saving 25 was more important than saving 1.....


Trust me I have no illusion when it comes to the terribleness of even modern wars. I know too well about blue on blue incidents my uncle was killed by friendly fire in Veitnam, while checking a NVA officer for papers another patrol came up and mistakenly fired upon him.



posted on Sep, 18 2015 @ 10:35 AM
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All the "battle hardened" and extremely trained are leaving and/or getting washed/pushed out. NCO corps = weak and not what it used to be.
Officers are paranoid butt kissers (for the most part), they will do as they are told IOT avoid getting a negative OER.
Also, "danger close" is ~600m depending on the ordnance. not as big of a deal (obviously depends on what you are calling for).

In shirt, new politically correct military is not mentally prepared/capable to do the sh** that needs to be done.



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