Deputy clerk says he'll obey federal judge over Kim Davis

Kim Davis's deputy clerks have been busy since their boss was hauled to jail, issuing 10 marriage licenses, including seven to same-sex couples, her employee Brian Mason said Wednesday.

And if Davis tells him to stop after she returns to work, Mason said he'll tell her he can't obey her, and instead must follow a federal judge's order to continue issuing licenses to anyone who is legally eligible to receive them.

I and others have said this isn't over by a long shot, and we're correct from the looks of this article. Not only has Kim refused to say whether or not she will abide by the judges order not to interfere with her deputy clerks isssuance of licenses. She has failed to refute those who say those licenses that have been issued are null and void because they were not given under Davis's "authority"...

Staver said the licenses deputy clerks issued to same-sex couples last week are not valid because they were not given under Davis' authority. But the Kentucky attorney general's office said it believes otherwise.

"Kim cannot and will not violate her conscience," said Mat Staver, founder of the Liberty Counsel, the Christian law firm representing Davis. As for what might happen next, he said "You'll find out in the near future."

What conscience? As far as I can tell, she has no conscience toward anyone who doesn't belong to the same clique she does. She certainly has no regard for the rights of others. You would think the WBC would love this woman.

If Davis orders her deputies not to issue licenses after she returns to work, she would push them into their own thorny legal conundrums: Defy their boss, or a federal judge? Scott Bauries, a law professor at the University of Kentucky, suspects any deputy choosing not to issue licenses could be held in contempt.

Exactly. I recently said in another thread we might see a turnover in Davis's office. We'll see how this pans out.

Katherine Franke, a professor at Columbia Law School, said legislators should find the political will to remove her, since she has ignored her oath of office in favor of her religious conviction. "The claim she's making is a clear loser. It's a political claim, it's not a legal claim," Franke said. "That's why she lost on the district level and the circuit level and she will continue to lose. She's fighting for justice on the level of religious law. But we don't live in a theocracy."

No legislator is going to listen Katherine. They're scared of this woman and her brood, because this has become an election issue, and they're under scrutiny too.

It is unlikely the Kentucky state legislature would impeach Davis. The Republican president of the state Senate spoke at a rally at the state Capitol and filed an amicus brief asking Bunning not to hold Davis in contempt. Several lawmakers have already filed legislation for the 2016 session to exempt county clerks from having to issue marriage licenses.

And what have we learned about this method of resolving the issue? "Conscience Creep".

But a group of Columbia University law professors argue in a recent memo that these kinds of exemptions create “conscience creep,” in which government employees can refuse to provide more and more services that violate their beliefs. And what happens when no one wants to provide the service? “The exemption proposals would make the efficacy of same-sex couples’ constitutional right to marry contingent upon their being able to find a public official who has no objection to their having such a right,” they write.

Link

"We are hoping she is going to comply with it. We'll have to see," Canon said. "But if experience is a teacher, Ms. Davis just doesn't believe that court orders apply to her."

Obviously the constitution doesn't apply to her, either.
Article

I'll be alright with whatever the state says as long as at the end of the day, they keep religion and the state divided.

She shouldn't be punished just reminded of her job description.

(imo)

That chucklef**** is keeping her job? Seriously?

I'm sort of irritated with all the hate being directed this woman's way and her personal life being publicly shared, but come on. She shouldn't keep her job. I would be fine with her leaving the job based on her beliefs, even if I think they're backwards and retarded and an insult to what I believe her religion asks of her.

If she goes back and pulls the same nonsense I'm going to be super irritated (OH NOES!) if she goes back and just says screw these deeply held beliefs, I'm going to be super irritated. Kim Davis irritates me.

a reply to: Domo1

That chucklef**** is keeping her job? Seriously?

Seeing how she was elected into her job she has to be impeached she can't just be fired. Also seeing how Ky is part of the bible belt the politicians don't have the balls to call a special session just to get rid of her.

originally posted by: Domo1

If she goes back and pulls the same nonsense I'm going to be super irritated (OH NOES!) if she goes back and just says screw these deeply held beliefs, I'm going to be super irritated. Kim Davis irritates me.

She can't really win either way, unless someone does something to accommodate her.

That is something I hope doesn't happen.

OK, a question. Now that this has gone down does that make her a felon?

ETA: And if so does that mean she can't run again? Seeing as she won't be removed.

a reply to: intrepid

Contempt of court is not a Felony.

However if she persists she can be charged, Federally with violating Civil Rights which could be prosecuted as a Federal Offense, Felony or Misdemeanor - depending upon plea bargains and whatnot.

originally posted by: intrepid
OK, a question. Now that this has gone down does that make her a felon?

She was held in comtempt.

Wouldn't she have to be charged and convicted as a felon?

"Deputy clerk says he'll obey federal judge over Kim Davis"

Looks like the "Law" found a remedy and justice prevails afterall.

The 14th Amendment is finally enforced after more than 140 years !!



Now, about the death penalty for violators ....

Really, the best thing for the clerks to to is to follow the judges orders. If Davis fires them all for whatever reason she makes up, they have a very well documented and high profile case for wrongful termination.

originally posted by: Annee

She can't really win either way, unless someone does something to accommodate her.

That is something I hope doesn't happen.

The remedy is already in place.

The other Clerks do the "issuing".

a reply to: xuenchen

Her holy book calls for her to be put to death anyhow.

Anyone who shows contempt for the judge or for the priest who stands ministering there to the LORD your God is to be put to death.

Deuteronomy 17:12

So conceivably she keeps her job AND can be reelected it the people in that riding agree with her stance?

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: Domo1

That chucklef**** is keeping her job? Seriously?

Seeing how she was elected into her job she has to be impeached she can't just be fired. Also seeing how Ky is part of the bible belt the politicians don't have the balls to call a special session just to get rid of her.

Ahhh.

I don't get why this is so hard. Pretend she was a Muslim or some other religion and disobeying the law. You can keep your religion and beliefs and love your neighbor despite their faults and pray for them. You can also believe in God enough to realize He knows what He's doing better than you. I think the people that judge and demonize what doesn't hurt anyone are insulting, we weren't meant to judge.

They need to nut up. You can be deeply religious and still realize that not everyone should be required to live under the rules you believe in. One thing that's always chapped my sweet ass is people acting like being gay is somehow worse than murder. A murderer can repent, be saved and then applauded, but a gay person that never harms a soul, and just feels how they were born to feel is somehow terrible no matter what. But certain people know exactly what God meant a long time ago and feel it their duty to judge.

I think as long as a person isn't harming anyone else, they should be treated with love and respect. I went to a Catholic school and remember learning that everyone should be treated with love and respect, that you can love someone who does horrible things, but hate what they've done.

I also think it takes an incredible amount of hubris to believe you are capable of interpreting the word of God. I suppose I'm guilty of it too, but I'm glad my interpretation doesn't mean treating people poorly. You may dislike the Christian faith, but the Golden Rule seems like a great one, and I can't see Jesus approving of such hate.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: xuenchen

Her holy book calls for her to be put to death anyhow.

Anyone who shows contempt for the judge or for the priest who stands ministering there to the LORD your God is to be put to death.

Deuteronomy 17:12

There's also this...
Romans 13

Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves.

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: Annee

She can't really win either way, unless someone does something to accommodate her.

That is something I hope doesn't happen.

The remedy is already in place.

The other Clerks do the "issuing".

Per OP:

But a group of Columbia University law professors argue in a recent memo that these kinds of exemptions create “conscience creep,” in which government employees can refuse to provide more and more services that violate their beliefs. And what happens when no one wants to provide the service? “The exemption proposals would make the efficacy of same-sex couples’ constitutional right to marry contingent upon their being able to find a public official who has no objection to their having such a right,” they write.

originally posted by: intrepid
So conceivably she keeps her job AND can be reelected it the people in that riding agree with her stance?

I bet the Kentucky Legislature impeaches her eventually.

Otherwise, the law is the law.

Equal protection under the law and all that jazz.

a reply to: Klassified

An interesting dilemma isn't it.

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: intrepid
So conceivably she keeps her job AND can be reelected it the people in that riding agree with her stance?

I bet the Kentucky Legislature impeaches her eventually.

Otherwise, the law is the law.

Just not during an election year?

originally posted by: intrepid
So conceivably she keeps her job AND can be reelected it the people in that riding agree with her stance?

Conceivably. A conundrum to be sure. But not unlike the same thing faced during the Civil Rights movement. It would be very, very sad if we reached a point where National Guardsmen had to escort people seeking a marriage license into the office... just to ensure that their Civil Rights were not violated.