Descent of the Dragon Queen

I was looking more into the stylized flutes and whistles of Vera Cruz classic culture from around 500 AD trying to put into context their apparent representation of a Lizardman on a flying machine when it became apparent through finding subsequent examples that in some cases it is a female figure that is seated upon the artifact though surrounded by the trappings of the cult of the feathered serpent, my conclusion being that this must represent the sister of Quetzalcoatl, namely Quetzalpetlatl.


In all the images of similar artifacts i've managed to source there is never any information on what is involved, if you're lucky it may be indicated that it is a monster or dragon on top of flute, but really it seems nobody has any idea or has even given any thought as to what is involved.


Yet they should, because otherwise there are no known representations of Quetzalpetlatl and she is only mentioned in the Post-Conquest narrative related on The Death of Quetzalcoatl.



There has always seemed something of an inbalance in the importance of Quetzalcoatl as Venus the Morning star with very little seeming concern with his sister as the Evening star, yet here they are probably seen together;



She looks very friendly there and is always seen with her arms outstretched and seemingly welcoming, her suggested associations are with wine and fertility but that's not based on much.



The name Quetzalpetlatl translates as 'the feather mat', in the mythos that is the only item that the pair are considered to have sat upon regarding the intoxicated downfall of Quetzalcoatl and thus there may be some association with what they are seen sat upon with regards to the flutes, though it doesn't seem much like a mat or to be made of feathers.

But such a mat must have had magical associations and in it's lightness could have been understood as a floating or flying mat, much like the magic carpet tradition, given also the association with the dragon which transported the avatar of the sun God across the Heavens in its jaws this seems likely.


There is also some similarity with Meso-American calendar configurations in the schematics of the artifact they are seated upon which again suggests the Heavenly cosmological aspect.



Quetzalcoatl as a magician harnessed the power of the dragon, the power of fire and the wind, and descended to Earth in a bird like manner, the feathered serpent, in this example a pair of birds can be seen to the fore of his flying device;



And again in this example a pair of birds in conjunction with the dragon;



Similar to the example i found earlier involving the dragon.



I came across an example which is supposedly Mayan and like the first examples of these i posted in that it depicts a classic lizardman upon a rudimentary clay pipe;



There are differances in style between the lizardman whistles and the more elegant styling of the flutes, though they must involve themselves with the same basic subject matter.



It's possible in these examples that the female figure seen on the prow would represent Quetzalpetlatl



So there we are then, the cult of the flying Lizardman, and his sidekick sister.

Flying lizard men and dragons, whistling,roaring and belching fire and thunder?

a reply to: intrptr

That would be a very magical flute, but never under estimate dragon power...

a reply to: Kantzveldt

Very interesting, thanks for sharing.
I just finished reading "Aztec", great book, if you're looking for some good entertainment.

a reply to: Kantzveldt

A very interesting read. Thank you. This needs a deeper look.

a reply to: Charismagic

It cannot be readily understood and thus it is entirely ignored, the oldest versions are probably the one's with the Lizardmen mounted upon them as Quetzalcoatal gradually went on to be depicted as human with only symbolic reptillian trappings.

a reply to: Peeple

although Piers Anthony is known for fantasy...Tatham Mound is a fantastic book. It deals with indian peoples in the southeast, right as the Conquistadors showed up.

I don't know if I buy the 'flutes as models of flying machines', but then again...

...I was struck by the fact that the decorative figurines are positioned facing toward the mouthpiece of the flute - which seems odd to me -

- I mean, wouldn't it make more sense for decorations on an instrument to face outward so as to be more visible to one's audience?

Then I had a strange idea about a very unlikely reason for this:

Maybe the juxtaposition is so that as the flute is played, the air flowing out the back is meant to 'model' the exhaust that would have come out from the (supposed) 'aircraft'..

Ridiculous I know, but thought I'd share anyway

a reply to: Specimen

Yes the dragon skin as a costume and the magic of the feathers...

Wise Son squatted by the fire. All remained quiet for some time. The men gazed at Wise Son constantly. Finally, their Chief arose and lighted his pipe. After smoking four times, he passed the pipe to the stranger. Wise Son smoked the magic number of times that seemed to please the Chief and the others. They then greeted him in a friendly manner, as if he were one of their own.

In return for their warm welcome, Wise Son gave to each man a prayer stick tipped with special feathers made by ancient Hopi nations men. "Now it is time to put on our snake costumes," announced the Chief. Wise Son observed that skins of enormous serpents were suspended from the ceiling, around all four walls. He was asked to face about, so that he would not see how the warriors got into their snakeskin costumes.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Thanks, i'll check it out, because i was really sad when aztec was over.

I know the Aztecs would make banners from feathers that would flutter and unfurl in very slight breezes.
Perhaps this was the motivation (along with birds actually flying) for implicating them in flying machines.
It seems a logical extension anyway.

Gary Jennings novel Aztec is my favorite!
It's like 900 pages long and you are disappointed it eventually ends.
Mind blowing is my only description for it.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Right? I mean: right. It's phatatsic from there i know that with the feather banners too.

AZTEC

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Magic through feathers is a huge part of the cult of Quetzalcoatl and widespread among other American tribes both in Northern and Meso-America, cult objects associated with Quetzalcoatl in the vaults of his palace were a jade, gold and feather mat, thus it's a strong possibility that what he is seen sat upon here is such a magical mat, and the association with Quetzalpetlatl literally implies feather mat.

There are going to be obvious shamanic connections in ascending into the spiritual realm while seated upon such a mat though the basis of the tradition could be even more intriguing, after all they don't look much like mats, though they do share the cosmological motifs that could be found on such.

I believe it to be a key that unlocks a door via specific frequency.

originally posted by: 0001391
I believe it to be a key that unlocks a door via specific frequency.

on which planet ?