Your Going To Hell?

Satan seems to be winning the ball game, and God isn't even on the playing field....

*sighs, and wonders when humanity will grow out of this worshipping of gods stage....*

If you want to go by the commandments that i've broken, then yeah, to the firey pit of no ice cream I am headed.

Im with You buddy! Save me a seat, will ya?

heaven hardly sounds like a place id wanna hang out for eternity. A bunch of old people in wings, robes, and harps, praising an egomaniac god for all eternity> thats my reward for a life of no sex, drugs, anger, or Ozzy Osbourne?

No thanks .

Besides, all the fun people, according to Christian myths, burn in hell. So i guess the convo will be better down there.

I need not apologize for what they've done either, but I may one day find it in my heart to walk into a southern baptist church again. Why the hell not?? Hey..everyone deserves 20 or more chances to prove worthy right?
Magestica

No you don't need to apologize and you don't need to give them any more chances.

Religious teachers who preach with the most anger, or instill the most fear, or incite the most judgment, or vocalize the most fervently about condemnation and "hell, fire and brimstone," are the most deficient in wisdom and have the greatest misunderstanding of their own definition of "God."

So unless they radically change their ways, you should avoid them at all costs.

Just like the Muslim faith has its radicals, so does the Christian and Jewish faiths.

I do attend Church with my children every Sunday. I have changed from a Roman Catholic to a Covenant Congregationist and it was the best move I ever made. We have a wonderful Church and extremely loving Member's that would drop everything if you needed them. No one ever tells you that you are going to Hell. It isn't their place to say it and it isn't the Pastor's place either. As someone here stated before, only God can be the judge, so don't involve yourself with those that judge you before your time.

JHAustin

And the con game begins.

I crack up whenever I hear about people talking about "Satan" or "The Devil".

If you were to take the time and do some serious research, you would soon realize that the whole concept of The Devil is a relatively new idea, biblically speaking.

The Old Testament / Torah mentions Satan very infrequently. In most cases, he is portrayed as a servant of God who is sent on unsavory or mundane tasks. One might speculate that he is/was a member of an angelic order. He is never described as the anti-God. How can he be, when God himself must have created him?

The modern concept of The Devil was slowly imported into modern (100 BC and forward) Judeo-Christain teachibng from the writings of Zoroaster. The ancient priests needed a bogey man to keep the uneducated massses in line. 95% of what people believe today about Satan is based on Zoroasterism and John Milton. Its mostly bunk.

Interestingly, Jews today mostly discount the existance of the Devil. As a Catholic, Ive have been taught that while certainly evil exists, the likelyhood of a dude in a red satin jumpsiut with a pointy tail and a pitchfork is pretty low. Hell is not fire and brimstone. Hell is to be removed from God's grace and presence. Hell is oblivion. Satanists are really anarchists and nihilists (sic), who are just trying to yank people's chains.

If there really are people out there trying to worship some dude named Satan, then they might as well be worshipping me. After all Satan and I enjoy many things in common: we are both created by God, we are both sinners, and we both like to cheat people out of their valuables (I am notorious at cards - watch me closely! :roll

Churches and religions are nice if you can find one that suits you, but as this threat clearly shows folks seem to have their own ideas about YHWH and how to pay your respects to him/her/it. Just remember that churches and religions are comprised of people, nothing more.

Well said.

regards
seekerof

Originally posted by KKing123
*has nothing to do with what is posted*

you know i always found it amusing when Christians walk up to Satanists with this hateful look and go "you're going to hell"

If i was a satanist and that happened i'd laugh and be like "well yeah and?"

"ditto"
How many satanist hve you seen that happen to?
Right......

Originally posted by JHAustin
Religious teachers who preach with the most anger, or instill the most fear, or incite the most judgment, or vocalize the most fervently about condemnation and "hell, fire and brimstone," are the most deficient in wisdom and have the greatest misunderstanding of their own definition of "God."

...As well as being quite deficient in knowledge of the very scriptures that they claim to venerate as well. Do they ever tell you (even if you *ask* them) what kind of time & effort they've put into the actrual *study* of the scriptures? I've asked a few of those "fire-n-brimstone" types what they've actually *studied* of the scriptures & I've been able to dazzle them with their own *lack* of knowledge that it's pitiful...The usual response I've gotten is more "fire-n-brimstone" rubbish but precisely *two* of them have decided to get back to cracking the Books before talking with me again...
One good resource I've found on the 'net is: what-the-hell-is-hell.com...
I've found it's own sources & variety of links to confirm much of what I've learned from more conventional sources; They've done a pretty good job of linking & cross-referencing information that took me over a year to confirm on my own. There's quite a bit of ammo to be found at that website that can set those "fire-n-brimstone" types on their backsides!

I've also found a quite interesting viewpoint about the Christian religion to be found in Anne Rice's book: Memnoch, the Devil...I've done some personal research on many of the points she brings up in that book & I've not been able to find any proof of contradiction so far! She's an author of fiction, to be sure, but the viewpoints whe wrote about are based from logical extrrapolation from facts as I've been able to confirm from other sources. To write that book, she must have done some *serious research* herself!

It just seems so sad that so many people get so hung up on faith in & of itself that they seek to blind themselves to actual knowledge about that which they claim to believe in...

I dont think hell should be something to joke about, though I dont like those preachers scaring people they will go to hell.. definitely not a way to make people believe.

This are some stories from hell,
from bible:
"So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.'

and what st. Faustina saw, very interesting:
"Today, I was led by an angel to the Chasms of Hell. It is a place of great torture; how awesomely large and extensive it is! The kinds of tortures I saw:
The First Torture that constitutes hell is:
���� The loss of God.
The Second is:
���� Perpetual remorse of conscience.
The Third is
���� That one's condition will never change.
The Fourth is:
���� The fire that will penetrate the soul without destroying it. A terrible suffering since it is a purely spiritual fire, lit by God's anger.
The Fifth Torture is:
���� Continual darkness and a terrible suffocating smell, and despite the darkness, the devils and the souls of the damned see each other and all the evil, both of others and their own.
The Sixth Torture is:
The constant company of Satan.
The Seventh Torture is:
Horrible despair, hatred of God, vile words, curses and blasphemies.



These are the Tortures suffered by all the damned together, but that is not the end of the sufferings.

Indescribable Sufferings
There are special Tortures destined for particular souls. These are the torments of the senses. Each soul undergoes terrible and indescribable sufferings related to the manner in which it has sinned.

I would have died
There are caverns and pits of torture where one form of agony differs from another. I would have died at the very sight of these tortures if the omnipotence of God had not supported me.

No One Can Say There is No Hell
Let the sinner know that he will be tortured throughout all eternity, in those senses which he made use of to sin. I am writing this at the command of God, so that no soul may find an excuse by saying there is no hell, or that nobody has ever been there, and so no one can say what it is like...how terribly souls suffer there! Consequently, I pray even more fervently for the conversion of sinners. I incessantly plead God's mercy upon them. O My Jesus, I would rather be in agony until the end of the world, amidst the greatest sufferings, than offend you by the least sin." (Diary 741)

Greetings all,

I posted this somewhere else on a thread but I will post some of it here.........

Why would G-d have a need to seek some sort of revenge, or punishment, for our failings?

Wouldn't it be a simple matter for G-d to just dispose of us for our 'evil doing' or 'wrong doings'?

What vengeful part of G-d would require that He subject us to eternal sufferings of a type and at a level beyond description?

There are those who say that G-d hath given us free will or freedom of choice, yet these same people claim that if you or I do not obey G-d, He will send us to Hell.

What kind of free will or freedom of choice is that?

Does this not make a mockery of G-d---to say nothing of any sort of the true relationship between He and us?

IMHO, there is NO such experience after death as we have 'constructed' in our fear-based theologies. Yet there is the separation from G-d; there is the experience of the soul so unhappy, so incomplete, so less than whole, so separated from G-d's greatest joy, that to our soul's, it would be Hell. We create our own Hell's whenever we deny G-d.

Hell is the experience of the worst possible outcome of our choices, decisions, and creations. It is the natural consequence of any thought which denies G-d. It is the pain we suffer through wrong thinking. Hell is the opposite of joy. It is unfullfillment. Yet it is not eternal; it cannot be, for, in truth, it is not G-d's plan that we should be separated from G-d forever and ever. Indeed, such a thing is an impossibility---for to achieve such an event, not only would we have to deny who we are----G-d would have to as well....it is not His plan nor his goal for us.

If one should answer that the need for justice or fulfillment of THE word as a requirement for Hell, I postulate this: Would it not be easier for G-d to simply deny us communion with Him in Heaven or simply deny us further 'existence' period; would this not be justice enough; would this not be Word fullfillment enough? Is the unending infliction of pain really required?

Think about it. Fear is the motivating factor in removing many from G-d and keeping those away from G-d! Fear does not keep one 'in love' with G-d...it is love that does the opposite.....Love unites, binds, heals, brings together......


regards
seekerof

Everyone on Earth has freedom of choice.
Freedom to choose either GOOD or EVIL, right or wrong.
It's that simple.
If God asked you, "why should I let you enter my heaven?" what would you say?
God sent his son to save those who believe, because he loves us. But people still choose death.

Why should God give someone eternal happyness if he never acknowledged God?
Or why should he let someone who made terrible sins go unpunished? Do you see serial killers walking around free or are they in prison? Do you think those who tortured innocent and Gods people on Earth, and went unpunished here, will be unpunished on other world? No, that would be unjustice.

Hell exists because SIN is terrible insult to God himself.
Every single soul in hell knows it deserved it with its sins.
Our sins are more destructive and terrible then we think.

Well said Megaquad......I guess the ultimate answer will only be laid to rest when we finally die won't it?


regards
seekerof

According to quite a number of biblical scholars (Some of which can be referenced through the URL link I gave above) stress that the torments of Hell will *not* last throughout eternity for those who get there. For one thing, God wants us *all* to be with Him & the torments of Hell are His means of "spanking" us for naughtiness...After which, when He knows that we've learned our lesson, He'll take us up with Him. Eventually, *all* souls in Hell will learn their lesson to not ever even consider sinning against Him again & Hell will be emptied, then destroyed.

Those "fire-n-brimstone" types seem to either be woefully ignorant of their own faith (by not even bothering to find out *why* God even has a Hell in the first place), or perhaps get some kind of sick thrill out of thinking about the perpetual suffering of human souls (And, of course, never believing that he'll be one of them someday...After all, the scriptures themselves say that *all* human souls will deserve at least *some* Hell before getting to Heaven).

Some people experience way too much suffering for it not to be right here..
Going to heaven to me, has nothing to do with who you are here in the flesh..and some of the things people do is not soley by choice. Alot of things in life are forced unto us..we are born into a certain family and brought up a certain way and some paths we go down are not by choice. I have read alot of true stories about murderers and evil doings of people and reading their life before they did such terrible things-I can see alot of the paths they took were not by choice..it's actually quite sad, some of the things I've read about people. Of course there is NO excuse for committing terrible crimes, especially unto others who just happen to be at the wrong place at the wrong time..but I still feel a tremendous amount of saddness for the perpertrator as well as the victim *sometimes*

So because someone was born into a life of hate, and they continue down that road because that's all they know..does that mean they are going to hell? Not to me..this IS their hell. And this is one of the reasons why I think God has pretty much stepped out for a while and given the upper hand to Satan. We are all living and breathing a certain amount of hell right here and now..and maybe we have been since life formed here on earth..remember, there really is no time..only we feel the affects of time. Thousands of years could simply be a blink in Gods eye to Him.

Well I have no clue of my point..I tried making one, but fear that noone may see it..Oh well. Some of you though have some very valid opinions-and in reality, that's all we really know or have..is an opinion or thought about heaven and hell..
Magestica

I see a touch of Gnostic influences there, Magestica...Also some resemblance to the old Persian religion based around Ahura Mazda.

Originally posted by MidnightDStroyer
I see a touch of Gnostic influences there, Magestica...Also some resemblance to the old Persian religion based around Ahura Mazda.

*Welcome home BTW*

Now could you please explain? Old Persian religion?? What's that mean? Were you being a little *sarcastic*?
I seriously think you underestimate me..
Magestica

Originally posted by Gazrok
Satan seems to be winning the ball game, and God isn't even on the playing field....

*sighs, and wonders when humanity will grow out of this worshipping of gods stage....*

I think alot of people have grown out of it, they seem to worship each other and themselves even more and more each day.

Originally posted by magestica
Now could you please explain? Old Persian religion?? What's that mean? Were you being a little *sarcastic*?
I seriously think you underestimate me..

Well, the basic premis beehind that old religion is that Ahura Mazda was the god of light, spirit & good...Arimahn was his opposite, as Satan is to God. However, the two deities were pretty much equal in power because worshippers could be good as well as evil; Basically, it was a dualistic religion. Arimahn was the tempter in the ways of the flesh, similar to how Ahura Mazda represented the pinnacle of the spirit; Arimahn created the material world, which is what makes life on Earth so hellish...

As for underestimating you...Well, I have a tendency to do that to some people...

Greetings,

Interesting discussion...

In my humble opinion, I don't feel that Hell is a place. Hell is a state of disconnect from the creator and love (God is pure Love). I also don't feel that God will send us away from his presence if we truly desire to be with him. However, it is our thoughts and actions in addition to words that will determine our relationship with God.
God gave us free will. God gave us the ego and sense of self if we choose to explore through it. The dangerous side of this is that it is easy to stray too far and become lost. Choosing the path of the self (which I believe is what Satan represents) is the choice of separation from God. I've gone that road and it's a lonely, lonely path. The GOOD NEWS is that at any time, "ANY time" we can become reconciled with God through accepting the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Acceptance is achieved through love, Faith (trust) and repentance from your sins. Once your heart is open, the holy spirit can perform the transformation and wipe away the sin.
After that you have to work, like an alcoholic or a drug addict to change your life one day at a time. It isn't easy, but most things that are have little value. You're not changed from a goblin to an Elf so to speak so don't expect that. The change is in your heart, but you have to keep the commitment. Being "Saved" as some like to call it does not mean you can just do whatever. It just means that as you work to try to be as God will's you to be, He's there to catch you when you stumble.

As for the devil, I believe that if he asked for forgiveness that God would forgive him. I don't find that very likely however

As for the church... The church is made of people who are imperfect. Hypocrisy? I'd expect nothing but. Don't put your faith in the church, a book, people, etc. Put your faith in God and his Son. Everything will fall into place as he intended if you allow it to.

In God's Love,

~Jammer

Good to have you here at ATS jammer, hope you enjoy ur stay at Hotel Addiction and check out time is: NEVER.

Good post. Welcome

regards
seekerof