Angry With Alternative Music Lifestyle Hypocrisy.

As an older punk, dressing to any one style, uniform or expectation rankles me... capitalistic robbery by the makers of said "alt uniforms" makes it exponentially worse.

I never looked like my 'tribe,' because humans are more complex than that... or darn well should be. When it comes down to it, maybe we should just wear white t-shirts with a label to tell others who we are trying to be?

Or not... lovely rant, tho.

a reply to: Baddogma

This is precisely why I did not go the traditional route with my jacket. I could have gotten some denim top or whatever, but it would not have been my thing, it would have been everyone else's... You know?

a reply to: TrueBrit

Yes... I do.

Agreed, sir.

Once an underground movement is co-opted by the mainstream, it eventually becomes acceptable and even popular. If you are truly a nonconformist, you would discard that and become involved in some other movement that doesn't conform to the new normal.

Of course this can lead to an exotic look taken from another culture (ear spools as example) or one that is too old to be remembered (swing dance movement as example) or on to a new and ever more outrageous one (trans-humanism perhaps). This seems to be the niche explored by people like Lady GaGa who would go as far as to wear an outfit made of raw meat, etc. At some point, nothing will be different enough or provide the social shock desired by the true nonconformist, the public eventually becomes immune to such attempts.

If you look like a complete freak of nature, or some sci-fi alien cyborg, unless it has some appeal or connection to a movement, then you just end up looking idiotic. Not that I believe that this is your goal. Its seems like you are more traditional than commercial/trendy or a fashion risk taker with the look you are talking about.

a reply to: MichiganSwampBuck

To be fair MSB, I usually look an idiot, and I really do not mind much!



If I had a problem with looking like an idiot, I would never have survived childhood!

a reply to: TrueBrit

I truly sympathize.

While I am not a Metalhead or "true" Punk....(I actually lean more to the alternative-grunge era)...I find it extremely distressing when fashion sensibilities are co-opted by those trying to score a cheap buck off making trappings over-hyped and overpriced commodities. Everything started spiraling out of control in the 90's with the infusion of the Grunge culture.

They adopted the fashion, but not the sustainable ethos.

I am disgusted that Doc Martens (a staple footwear for decades) are no longer made in England, but rather, in China and are so uncomfortable that they have been regulated to fashionista teenage girls taking "selfies" with brand-new-barely-worn boots that never see the pavement and just pile up as collectors items in their closets. The last pair I purchased from the website over seven years ago still haven't broken in, and I fear they never shall.

Also, Converse sneakers.....picked up my first pair in the late 90's at a military surplus store for ten bucks...now they're starting at $40 and hitting the high end at $120 depending on style. These particular shoes are still cheaply made, but the price and fashion demand has taken an inexpensive shoe and turned it into a status symbol.

Levi's 501's? Flat out forget 'em. Made everywhere but the States and so thin they aren't worth the price tag. The new fits are too tight and horribly uncomfortable and a complete eyesore. Don't get me started on the "vintage stores" that suddenly sprang up overnight charging prices that would have made Russian Black Market Era value seem reasonable.

To sum things up, my newsboy cap I've worn threadbare from over a decade of heavy use is non-replaceable. For no other reason than the "steampunk couture" tuned into it. To make things worse, the movie "The Great Gatsby" came out and now every cosplayer on the planet is wearing one....which means all available caps are either shoddily manufactured or pricing in at $45 a pop. Ten years ago, my cap was a reasonable $10 - and high quality for the asking price at that.

I know this seems like an endless rant, but I am one of those people who cultivates a style and sticks to it.....you sound like you are as well....and there is nothing more defeating than when "THEY" get ahold of the respective fashion sensibilities and gouged the hell out of the market - milking it for every ounce of worth it once had.

To make matters worse - the "punk kids" around my area are so lazy they don't even bother to properly sew their patches onto their clothing....they just use safety-pins because their "favorite bands" come and go so quickly as they all struggle to keep abreast of the current playlist.

(...and they wonder why Cobain shot himself...)

a reply to: TrueBrit

Sorry, but, jeans, t-shirt from fave band.

Done.

Oh, and my trusty Yes hat(not metal, I know, but I proudly display my prog) which is growing it's own life forms and will be replaced soon. I'll get a Rush hat at the show next month but I'd really rather have a Yes hat. I'd just rather have a prog band than a prog-metalish band. Just so happens I have been unable to find one online. A local shop in the mall says they might be able to create one but it's a copyrighted logo so that may cause them some problems. I didn't ask any further at that point as they were busy and I wasn't buying at the time anyway.

I do have a old Army type jacket with all my patches on it. It's got lots of wear, threads a hanging from it, but it's still cool. It's just cloth, not battle gear as you are describing. Not sure why you would want to weigh yourself down with all that but each to his own.

Up the Irons!

a reply to: TrueBrit

If your avatar is actually your picture, you look nothing like an idiot to me. Plus, reading your posts, I really like your personality. I'd never have guessed that you were into the 70s punk look, but heck, you may wear it quite well.

Personally I've been exploring senior citizen fashions as I'm quickly heading in that direction. Considering that the boomer population is quite large, I'd think that the fashion industry would be jumping on that one. On that note, I haven't decided what look could work for me. My step daughter has had a baby, so now I should really think about how grandpa is going to look. You have the tourist look, the old hippie Grateful Dead-Head look, the old farmer look, the suit and tie look, or just the tee-shirt and jeans look. There are more, but the subject needs more study for me to find the look that might work for me.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Isn't the point of alternative music to go against the mainstream? I mean I find it ironic that you are complaining about having to pay a lot of money to sport a style that has gone up in price because it has clearly gone mainstream. How about defining a new style for alt rockers instead of going with the flow?

What makes it easy for a musician to link to his fans is when they are both aware of how each other are struggling to support their hobbies. Being a musician usually doesn't bring in much money and their fans tend to be broke college age students (if they aren't in college). Seems to me it would make more sense to create a new fashion that isn't as expensive. Though you may end up being labeled as a hipster. Ah well c'est la vie.

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
a reply to: TrueBrit

If your avatar is actually your picture, you look nothing like an idiot to me. Plus, reading your posts, I really like your personality. I'd never have guessed that you were into the 70s punk look, but heck, you may wear it quite well.

Personally I've been exploring senior citizen fashions as I'm quickly heading in that direction. Considering that the boomer population is quite large, I'd think that the fashion industry would be jumping on that one. On that note, I haven't decided what look could work for me. My step daughter has had a baby, so now I should really think about how grandpa is going to look. You have the tourist look, the old hippie Grateful Dead-Head look, the old farmer look, the suit and tie look, or just the tee-shirt and jeans look. There are more, but the subject needs more study for me to find the look that might work for me.

Why not keep your existing look and just get older?

One of my closest friends is over 60 and still has long hair and wears rock tshirts and a leather jacket. He looks amazing and is true to himself.

On saying that I have noticed myself changing over the past couple of years, no more mohawks and my beard just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

I am going grey and actually no longer care, I think I will end up like a mountain man in a baseball cap and jeans and am pretty comfortable with this.

originally posted by: nonspecific

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
a reply to: TrueBrit

If your avatar is actually your picture, you look nothing like an idiot to me. Plus, reading your posts, I really like your personality. I'd never have guessed that you were into the 70s punk look, but heck, you may wear it quite well.

Personally I've been exploring senior citizen fashions as I'm quickly heading in that direction. Considering that the boomer population is quite large, I'd think that the fashion industry would be jumping on that one. On that note, I haven't decided what look could work for me. My step daughter has had a baby, so now I should really think about how grandpa is going to look. You have the tourist look, the old hippie Grateful Dead-Head look, the old farmer look, the suit and tie look, or just the tee-shirt and jeans look. There are more, but the subject needs more study for me to find the look that might work for me.

Why not keep your existing look and just get older?

One of my closest friends is over 60 and still has long hair and wears rock tshirts and a leather jacket. He looks amazing and is true to himself.

On saying that I have noticed myself changing over the past couple of years, no more mohawks and my beard just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

I am going grey and actually no longer care, I think I will end up like a mountain man in a baseball cap and jeans and am pretty comfortable with this.

Actually Nonspecific, what you are saying is let my ole lady pick my clothes out for me as I get older, as I pretty much do that now.

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck

originally posted by: nonspecific

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
a reply to: TrueBrit

If your avatar is actually your picture, you look nothing like an idiot to me. Plus, reading your posts, I really like your personality. I'd never have guessed that you were into the 70s punk look, but heck, you may wear it quite well.

Personally I've been exploring senior citizen fashions as I'm quickly heading in that direction. Considering that the boomer population is quite large, I'd think that the fashion industry would be jumping on that one. On that note, I haven't decided what look could work for me. My step daughter has had a baby, so now I should really think about how grandpa is going to look. You have the tourist look, the old hippie Grateful Dead-Head look, the old farmer look, the suit and tie look, or just the tee-shirt and jeans look. There are more, but the subject needs more study for me to find the look that might work for me.

Why not keep your existing look and just get older?

One of my closest friends is over 60 and still has long hair and wears rock tshirts and a leather jacket. He looks amazing and is true to himself.

On saying that I have noticed myself changing over the past couple of years, no more mohawks and my beard just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

I am going grey and actually no longer care, I think I will end up like a mountain man in a baseball cap and jeans and am pretty comfortable with this.

Actually Nonspecific, what you are saying is let my ole lady pick my clothes out for me as I get older, as I pretty much do that now.

You have by accident missed that by a country mile!

Mrsnonspecific would love me to have more dress sense but I simply no longer care.

I am currently wearing a jumper that we both agreed was actually made for an old lady but it is so comfortable to wear I do it anyway. Sometimes I see the sadness in her eyes but then I stroke my greyish beard and carry on regardless.

Every now and then I get drunk and decide to go back to my roots but in the morning I cannot be arsed, I thought this when I thought of truebrits OP about 500 studs on a jacket. I would give up at about 12 and then wear anything else.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Well that's the great thing about a battle jacket. Because each persons tastes are different, they end up with different patches, in different placements, and with different adornments, applied in different ways. Owing to that fact, a battle jacket, no matter how passé or cliche it might be to actually wear one at all, is always unique.

For example, since I love cold weather and black metal, I was thinking of getting lots of BM patches at the festival this year, and then going ahead and doing an icicle shaped placement pattern for my studs and/or spikes. By using gunmetal blacked studs, and chrome spikes for example, interesting effects could be achieved. Since black metal can tend toward the wintery in atmosphere, I figure that would be a good way to tie the theme together.

That would work for the back, at least. As a result of the huge number of pockets on the front, I was thinking that the pocket tops could be chrome studded, and the rest of the frontage patched and black studded.

There are others out there who would have chosen an entirely different base for their battle jacket, of denim or leather, and still others who would have placed the patches I have applied entirely differently.

In other news, I have been experimenting with methods of flattening out bottle caps, using a combination of light hammering, plier manipulation, and tissue paper impact dampening, and piercing the caps with a pin or tack, to make small holes, which can have a needle and thread passed through them. There is a possibility of a bottle cap jacket being made from something I have in my wardrobe right now, gathering dust! Perfect for ale festival season!

Oh, this thread brings back memories of the 1990s, and our local scene, which was essentially based around a popular night-club that filled up an otherwise empty Monday night with "Metal Night".
Once a few older band-mates took me there, and from the first moment I saw the hair savagely ripping though the fake smoke to "Orgasmatron" I knew that I had to be there every Monday.

Soon I traded anything for metal T-shirts, and the only shop that sold them was in town, although one only needed two or three tops for a wardrobe.
That subculture became pretty close-knit, and lasted a few years.
We moped about in black, even in the hottest days of summer.
Everybody else was "yuppie scum".
Only in Cape Town could one see real goths, hippies, skinheads and occasional punks.
The punks from Johannesburg and the Cape Town skinheads were in a war at that stage, and after witnessing one of their fights, it was best thought not to adopt their style of clothing.
Nobody had a problem with the metal-heads.

Thinking back a lot of it was an escape from a militarized white society in the grips of a religious hysteria.
People were very easy to shock with long hair for men, and the black clothes.
But it also reflected that militarism in a sense - I'm an individual and this is my uniform.
It was very much running with a male pack, and I'd have to listen to my Poison ("fake metal") let alone Boney M records in private, at the risk of being excommunicated.

Later, perhaps because people got girlfriends (and when in Town I'd sneak off to the gay bar around the corner for an hour or so) tastes broadened somewhat.
First the grunge and hippie looks became acceptable.
Just as well, because most head-bangers already had red and black lumber-jack shirts, which they originally tied around their waists, perhaps to copy a tribal tartan outfit while in head-banging posture.
It became more about an alternative scene against "commercial yuppies" in general.
But since most metal albums were far more expensive than regular music, I began questioning that label.
Then one ends up at a trance or rave party, and just black seems so drab.

Many years later I still have acquaintances who haven't changed their style at all.
Once I no longer faithfully dressed like that I was out of the scene however.
Last summer I wore some of old metal T-shirts I hadn't worn in years, and it's far more acceptable now.
Conversely, I also ended up at a metal concert one night wearing a floral shirt, and nobody batted an eyelash.
In the old days we faced such discrimination that if any "yuppie" tried to head-bang he'd get moshed off the floor.
I recall the one time some people actually disagreed and spoke against that.

I was strolling through one of those pet accessory supermarkets recently, and my mind wandered as I considered other uses for some of the items.
It would definitely be a cheaper place to get a stud wrist-band than the boutique.
It would last longer too.
And thank heavens - no slip knots.
Slip-knots work once or twice and then it's a constant nightmare.

a reply to: TrueBrit

I mean I know what a battle jacket it is. I've seen them before. It's just that it's STILL a distinctive style even if you can customize your flair. If I saw you walking down the street, I'd still know you were a metal head from the mere fact it is a battle jacket.

My point was to try to be a bit different and start a new style that isn't as expensive, but that's why I said you could be called a hipster, because to be honest, that's how trends start. I know its cliche to make fun of hipsters these days, but mark my words. The weird things they do will be mainstream in about 5 - 10 years. It's already starting. I'm not even really a hipster, but I see it.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Heh... Speaking of setting trends, I have a particular methodology when it comes to festivals. To prevent loss through theft, of things like my mobile phone, camera, and other valuable items, I like to have these things on my person at all times, even when asleep.

To this end, I started taking my personal effects around with me in an assault vest. This was about five or six years back I think. At the time, I had seen no one else making the same effort. Every year since then, the number of people taking the assault vest route to keeping their crap together at Bloodstock, has increased by a significant degree!

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Heh... Speaking of setting trends, I have a particular methodology when it comes to festivals. To prevent loss through theft, of things like my mobile phone, camera, and other valuable items, I like to have these things on my person at all times, even when asleep.

To this end, I started taking my personal effects around with me in an assault vest. This was about five or six years back I think. At the time, I had seen no one else making the same effort. Every year since then, the number of people taking the assault vest route to keeping their crap together at Bloodstock, has increased by a significant degree!

Are you at Bloodstock this year? I will keep a look out for you in your new battle jacket!

I will also say that after working the clear up of around 40 different UK festivals that the ammount of cash and valuables found inside left behind sleeping bags is beyond belief.

a reply to: TrueBrit

You're braver than me. I usually keep my personal belongings in my tent or locked in my car (with my keys left in my tent). It's so easy to get too wasted at a festival, not pay attention to your pockets and someone with slippery fingers slips in and takes something.

But your point is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Set new trends with cheaper clothing and everyone will follow suit if its catchy enough. Then you can get all high and mighty and tell them you were doing it before it was cool. Lol jk

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: TrueBrit

You're braver than me. I usually keep my personal belongings in my tent or locked in my car (with my keys left in my tent). It's so easy to get too wasted at a festival, not pay attention to your pockets and someone with slippery fingers slips in and takes something.

But your point is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Set new trends with cheaper clothing and everyone will follow suit if its catchy enough. Then you can get all high and mighty and tell them you were doing it before it was cool. Lol jk

I do not know if it's the same in the US but in England music festivals are a cashcow for anyone working at them.

I work as part of the recycling crew and although any personal belongings get handed in the amount of cash found on the floor is beyond belief, often more than the wages on a good day.

The amount of theft is nothing compared to the ammount of loss due to inebriation.

a reply to: nonspecific

I'm sure its similar in the states. I haven't worked any of the festivals I've attended, but they are a good gig. All the jobs are volunteer and the group doing it will reimburse you for the weekend ticket price for a few hours of work a day. I once watched a gate guard get high and drunk off his ass all day and it was totally fine. As far as cleanup goes, the festivals I attend have started handing out trash bags and have you consolidate the campsite's trash into a few piles for the clean up crews to pick up afterwards. Though I'm sure there is a fair share of abandoned goodies spread around. Usually though, I see that the campsites are well cleaned up before everyone leaves.