Attitudes may have to be forced in the beginning...

I posted a thread earlier where a response to someone was being forced to provide a service for someone else against their personal belief system. While I did expect a measure of pro and con on both sides of the issue there was one particular comment by a member that boggled my mind and inspired me to rant. This member made the following statement...

Attitudes may have to be forced in the beginning, but over time and multiple generations, those attitudes DO change.

I didn't know it was within the purview of Government or anyone to 'FORCE' attitudes on people. I found that statement horrifying and frankly I was shocked that anyone would think they have the right to 'FORCE' their version of morality on others. It sounds like something a Muslim or Christian extremist might say, but I wouldn't have expected it from this far left leaning liberal member of ATS.

Is THIS the liberal philosophy of freedom or just this members opinion? Does anyone else agree that we should be 'FORCING' people's attitudes and opinions through legislation?

Anyway, I am aghast that someone could think this way and I hope it isn't something that most members agree with or support. If it is then maybe I am in the wrong place because I don't think anyone should be forced to do anything against their beliefs or will.

a reply to: Metallicus

That has honestly got to be one of the most disturbing statements I have read here. Absolutely dumbfounding. No one, anywhere, ever has the right to force anything on anyone.

a reply to: Metallicus

What happened to businesses having the right to refuse service at their whim?

Since when can you force someone to provide you services?

That went out with slavery btw.

I would tell the judge to toss himself, then demand he come and do work for me.

What is the difference?

I have never and will never be forced to work against my will, this is retarded.

It's in the Progressive standard operating procedures.

a reply to: Metallicus

I don't think anyone should be forced to do anything against their beliefs or will.

Based on this statement, you are extremely liberal. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

a reply to: Metallicus

Yep. The guberment forced white and black kids to attend school together and them G men forced coffee shop owners to serve black people at their counters too, just like the white people! Outrageous!

a reply to: Metallicus

Gotta love those who say they love their freedom, YET! they think it is okay to force their views and way of thinking on the rest of us?

Yet the thing that I find most disturbing, is that those you are referencing in your rant, most likely hate Christianity, for doing the same thing that they are doing in the name of "Globalism"?

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Metallicus

Yep. The guberment forced white and black kids to attend school together and them G men forced coffee shop owners to serve black people at their counters too, just like the white people! Outrageous!

You are right it is outrageous.

Open a coffee shop that serves blacks also and put them out of business for their stupidity.

Dont enslave a business owner to provide services.

The best one I saw today was about putting "mind reading helmets" on cops to weed out cops with racist thoughts and such.

When I asked if this person really thought the government would stop at cops, or if it was most likely to wind up that everybody would be wearing these helmets soon rather than later, the response I got was, essentially, as long as it STARTED with cops, well whatever no big deal.

Mind = blown

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Metallicus

Yep. The guberment forced white and black kids to attend school together and them G men forced coffee shop owners to serve black people at their counters too, just like the white people! Outrageous!

Where in the hell in the OP does it even reference what your bringing up in this thread?

I mean, vaguely maybe, but it is the quoted ideology that is the most disturbing.

I guess using race is a great way to sway the disturbing statement that the OP is ranting about?

a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

The Founders were Classical Liberals. But they believed in freedom of association, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, private property rights, self-defense etc.

In short, they believed in a lot of things that modern progressives only believe in as it benefits them to believe in them. As soon as you take that belief in a direction that the modern progressives deem to be against their party line, those freedoms are no longer for you.

a reply to: infinityorder

Right, because providing the service that your shingle says that you provide, equally and fairly to all your customers, is akin to slavery.

a reply to: seeker1963

Yep they'll rail long and loud against someone forcing their morality right up until it's their turn to force their morality on you and yours and refuse to see the hypocrisy.

But then, you have to understand that they are simply "right" and we all ought to just know better.

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: infinityorder

Right, because providing the service that your shingle says that you provide, equally and fairly to all your customers, is akin to slavery.

It is if you have no choice about when, where, and how you provide it once it gets around that you offer it.

You all claim that all business is about is the almighty dollar, that businesses have no heart, but when business owners do operate by other motives and rules ... then how dare you do anything other than try to earn a profit?

originally posted by: seeker1963

originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Metallicus

Yep. The guberment forced white and black kids to attend school together and them G men forced coffee shop owners to serve black people at their counters too, just like the white people! Outrageous!

Where in the hell in the OP does it even reference what your bringing up in this thread?

I mean, vaguely maybe, but it is the quoted ideology that is the most disturbing.

I guess using race is a great way to sway the disturbing statement that the OP is ranting about?

The thread from which the quote came, QUOTE , did refer to the Civil Rights Act that had to be FORCED onto Americans, just like some Americans seem to have to be forced to accept gay individuals as equals in the secular world.

ETA: And here: QUOTE

a reply to: windword

Do we? Or do you just have that perception?

The government (ultimately following orders) has always forced attitudes and beliefs on people. Conform or die. Now it's much more in your face. Conservatives have been replaced by liberals, except they're much worse. Because they play a game of "if you don't agree you're stupid/bigoted/xenophobic/against progress/somethingphobic".

Imo both "parties" are doing it but one is more pervasive than the other.

Government will always force people to do things, either through force or through subtle campaigns. They're not the only ones to blame though, billions willingly follow this nonsense.

a reply to: ketsuko



It's just our imagination, I'm sure.

a reply to: windword

Likely is. The only difference lies in the bedroom and most of us can't fathom why that aspect of their lives has to be paraded on constant public display. Are we going to be forced into accepting BDSM next? *eyeballs 50 Shades of Gray* Forget I said that.

I got slammed in another thread a while back for saying "It's their business, they can refuse service to anyone they want". And I still stand behind that statement. It may cost them business, it may cost them customers and money, but It's. Their. Business. No one should be able to tell you who to serve and who not. How about the restaurant that doesn't serve kids? How're they doing? Just fine it seems. Why? Because it"s nice to have a quiet dinner out, without someone's 5 year old screaming in your ear. Why isn't someone throwing a fit over that?