Better the lives of ten cops than one innocent

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

Better 10 police die than 1 innocent

Total Rubbish.

originally posted by: tinner07
I work in the construction trade and we probably get paid better than the cops.

Maybe it would be better to say 10 law breaking thugs die instead of 1 LEO.

You say 320 people killed by LEO in 2013 and 34 LEO killed. We are a nation of 300 million so 320 is like what? 1% or .1

Of 320 killed how many were productive members of society?

Of the 34 Officers killed how many of those were productive members of society? I guess all of them.

Personally I would rather have a cop as a neighbor than some law breaking thug that is going to find his demise at the end of a gun barrell....
Wouldn't you?

Did you ever notice they only show how many were killed in the line of duty, but not how many were shot at by criminals?
They have training on how to defend themselves and bullet proof vests, so they deaths should be low. I want to know how many are the target of a gun to.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

Maybe the police of a large city, say chicago, should not show up to work for one week.
We should know by the end of that week if the cops do more harm than good.

In that week, we'll see a more equitable distribution of resources than Chicago has ever seen.

320 people isn`t a lot when you consider that there were 1,163,146 violent crimes committed in the U.S. in 2013.
the point is that there are a lot of violent people out there could become a statistic of being killed by the police.
In fact I would say that with so many violent people running around that the police have been very conservative in the number of people they kill.

That`s only 1 death by cop per 3,634.84 violent crimes committed, that`s a very admirable record for law enforcement.
To put that in perspective there were 14,196 murders in the U.S. in 2013, that equals 3.90 deaths by criminals per 3,634.84 violent crimes committed.

originally posted by: theyknowwhoyouare

Although I get the sentiment groups of vigilantes "keeping the peace" will be far worse. There would be a lot of gang wars and such

But who's to say that's less preferable to the situation we have now? All it really is now is a gang war anyway. The names of the gangs just change and their territories move around a little. So what?

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

Maybe the police of a large city, say chicago, should not show up to work for one week.
We should know by the end of that week if the cops do more harm than good.

In that week, we'll see a more equitable distribution of resources than Chicago has ever seen.

"Looting".

Even the anti-Cop brigade I think will disagree with you OP...


& rightly so.



Unbelievable day on ATS so far.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

"Looting".

That's what happens when you brainwash a society into glorifying material success, all the while categorically denying it to them through economic barbarism. Then the lights go out and they set about fulfilling the petty ambitions they've been programmed with by the very system preventing them from doing so.

Sounds like an insidious trap to me.

Again, for whom are the cops a necessity?

a reply to: NthOther

Again, for whom are the cops a necessity?

Pensioners?
Rape victims?
Child abuse victims?
Domestic abuse victims?

A whole host of others?


Perhaps...

a reply to: cleverhans

That's a fact, Jack! There are a few bad police officers and the OP makes it sound like they are all bad. 50% by his guess. Hey OP read this guys post I'm commenting to and take a personal assessment to rethink your stance. Police are human and I'm all for bad officers to be held accountable but I'm not labeling them all bad. It's not 50%. The best we can do is call out bull# so some crazy doesn't get any bright ideas and shoot more police.

How many times have the police beaten you? I'm sure the answer isn't daily if at all. Look at reality. These guys do put their lives on the line so you can live in a half way normal society. Give them the credit they deserve. You don't have to accept bad officers to do that. Just know the MORAL majority are good men and women.

originally posted by: lonesomerimbaud
a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

Better the lives of zero cops and zero innocents.

Life is not cheap!

I'd agree with that, now how do we get the overzealous power hungry out of control steroid abusing thugs with badges to agree?

You know the one's the OP seems to be referring to...

originally posted by: tinner07
You say 320 people killed by LEO in 2013 and 34 LEO killed. We are a nation of 300 million so 320 is like what? 1% or .1

In a world of billions, all it takes is the death of one person close to you for that world to disintegrate.

Glad statistically, we can all just ignore it.

I don't think that cops are expendable. They have a job and if they are in a situation where they can be hurt, they should have a right to defend themselves. Sure, an occasional innocent individual will die, but if crooks knew they could get away with things without getting shot, they would possibly commit more violent crimes.

I don't particularly like when any individual that is not doing a crime is hurt whether it is a police officer or an person mistakenly shot by a cop. Never point a gun, even a realistic toy gun at a cop and don't be pulling out a knife or gun in a fight or when approached by a cop. Ninety five percent of cops are good guys.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
Even the anti-Cop brigade I think will disagree with you OP...


& rightly so.



Unbelievable day on ATS so far.

I actually see his point. If you go into a job that you know has a very high risk of dealing with violent people, you better be of a disposition that allows you to handle that, and not start shooting at anything that moves. That is why we have innocent people killed. They are cowards in uniforms and have no staunchness about them. They intimidate smaller weaker people, they abuse their power, they over use force, they get away with it.

What happened to wanting to protect the public, instead of fearing them? Why get into that line of work, if you fear the people you opt to protect, and worse, why enjoy it so much when you do get to play cowboy?

I'd rather err on the side of the thug with a badge being the one copping strife, than the innocent civilian simply going about their day, who happens to spook the timid man with the weaponry and judicial system to support him throughout.

originally posted by: rickymouse
Sure, an occasional innocent individual will die

And that is utterly unacceptable. Absolutely and unequivocally.

It means there is a problem somewhere, Innocent people should not die at the hands of the people employed to protect them.

And if they do, there should be hell to pay, not the gang in blue rallying to support the murderer and thumb their noses at the public. It should be worse if there is negligent death at the hands of an officer. not desk duty or paid leave.

If these three things can be proven under tort law, the murderer should be charged accordingly.

First, the plaintiff must establish that the defendant was under a legal duty to act in a particular fashion. Second, the plaintiff must demonstrate that the defendant breached this duty by failing to conform his or her behavior accordingly. Third, the plaintiff must prove that he suffered injury or loss as a direct result of the defendant's breach.

Not simply "Sure it happens, but it's only 1 person, come on guys, one person out of millions..."

a reply to: sn0rch

While I do agree that your assessment paints a picture of a large percentage, even if a minority of police Worldwide...

Does that then mean a good Cops life is worth less?

In a world of billions, all it takes is the death of one person close to you for that world to disintegrate.

I also want to add that this is without a doubt, one of the most beautifully profound & philosophical things I've ever heard...


But now, if you will, apply it to a Cop who saved a Life, perhaps the Life of a Child?

All it takes is the survival of one, to regain the World...

Sorry to part-plagiarise your profoundness, but I always try and see both sides of things.

a reply to: sn0rch

Nirvana doesn't exist.

a reply to: theyknowwhoyouare

So I'm thinking this through.

Imagine 10 cops make 10 traffic stops of suspected thugs. The cops patiently wait while the thugs reach for a gun under their seat and shoot the cops dead.

We have the 10 dead cops, with 10 thugs running loose. Then we send 10 more cops out, and the thugs kill those 10 cops.

Pretty soon all we have left are millions of criminals and zero cops.

OR....

We have what we have now.

About 2 million violent criminals arrested per year.

450 suspects shot while being apprehended.

A handful of cases that are questionable.


Yeah, great idea.

You should run for President. Or at least mayor.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs

Pensioners?
Rape victims?
Child abuse victims?
Domestic abuse victims?

A whole host of others?

Perhaps...

Cops don't prevent any of that from happening. They simply go after the people they think are responsible and bring them to some warped sense of what people call "justice".

Well, anyone can do that. And far more efficiently, I might add. Just because it's state-sanctioned doesn't mean it's a superior (or more legitimate) way of getting things done.

Again, it's mob rule any way you look at it. I'll take my chances with the people who aren't getting a paycheck to keep others "in line" with a gun.

originally posted by: NthOther
Cops don't prevent any of that from happening. They simply go after the people they think are responsible and bring them to some warped sense of what people call "justice".

Well, anyone can do that. And far more efficiently, I might add. Just because it's state-sanctioned doesn't mean it's a superior (or more legitimate) way of getting things done.

Again, it's mob rule any way you look at it. I'll take my chances with the people who aren't getting a paycheck to keep others "in line" with a gun.

Well..since you have it all figured out why dont you come spend a few minutes in the badlands of any major city and when the "innocent men" show up to do the inevitable come tells how that all works out.

I love the naive cop haters here on ATS. So oblivious to how the real world works.