Putin Adviser Urges Dumping US Bonds In Reaction to Sanctions

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers


And who would buy US bonds from Russia knowing that the goal was to render them worthless?

reply to post by Indigent


If I were you I would stop hanging out with old immigrants who escaped communism in the 60s 70s 80s

Have you visited any Russian city in the last 10 years, they have EVERYTHING.

If you can't afford to travel the world, then maybe use google.

DJW001
Correction: It is Vladimir Putin who stuck his nose in. He will be lucky if his nose is not cut off and fed to the fish.

You really want to compare Putin with some banana republic president who CIA can do away with by giving them cancer.

It must be nice to believe in "easy things"

DJW001
And who would buy US bonds from Russia knowing that the goal was to render them worthless?

no there would be no buying, if no one stepped in FED would have to, when you sell US bonds you get US dollars for the value of bonds, you then convert US dollar into your own currency or Euro or Yuan or whatever.

Now when you do that, you always have a loss of about 5-10 % if you do it quickly enough, but if the goal is to hurt the US economy, they would not care.

AntiPrivateWestBankers

DJW001
Correction: It is Vladimir Putin who stuck his nose in. He will be lucky if his nose is not cut off and fed to the fish.

You really want to compare Putin with some banana republic president who CIA can do away with by giving them cancer.

It must be nice to believe in "easy things"

It won't be the US who removes Putin from office. In keeping with Russian tradition, it will be his successor who will denounce and replace him.

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers

no there would be no buying, if no one stepped in FED would have to

Why would the Fed do that? Just let Russia keep offering them. Eventually, they will offer them so cheaply that someone will buy them, but Russia stands to lose a great deal of money that way. Since everyone knows that the price was artificially depressed, the price would rebound instantly.

DJW001
Why would the Fed do that? Just let Russia keep offering them. Eventually, they will offer them so cheaply that someone will buy them, but Russia stands to lose a great deal of money that way. Since everyone knows that the price was artificially depressed, the price would rebound instantly.

Oh man, I gotta tell you, you don't know these things.

Do you have any idea what it would look like if world wide business headlines wrote (and with picture of Putin waving the bonds in the air) how they are trying to sell 200 billion worth of bonds, and no one is buying them, not even the FED.

FED would never EVER, allow this kind of credibility issue.

If you don't believe me, walk into your local bank, and ask anyone.

AntiPrivateWestBankers
Well, time to display my knowledge too since I used to be a financial analyst in Toronto.

You do not need to be a financial anything to understand that selling something below market value only hurts yourself and not the originator of the product/instrument.

If Russians sold 200 billion, it would cause FED to engage "circuit breakers" which would have the whole world ask, WHY

It would cause a crash that would be precipitated by other players who would be nervous about what's happening.

Considering the toolbag 'Putin adviser' announced their intentions it really would not be a shock if 1% of United States debt was dumped by Russia and as I stated earlier supply and demand would dictate that others would take advantage of the situation buy buying the below market bonds. 'Dumping' implies they are being sold below market value, to sell them you need a buyer, therefore the buyer is capitalizing on the fact that the bonds are being sold below market value and has made an instant profit.

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus


ok Mr. I have Masonic Elitist symbol as part of my avatar.

Then let me ask you this, now prepare yourself, I am pretty sharp guy so this question will not be an easy one for ya.

Then Why don't the western world (US, UK, Canada, France, Germany) go ahead and impose sanctions on Russian Federation.

If this is not a big deal, they why don't they do it.

And don't tell me because they want to be nice.

AntiPrivateWestBankers
Then Why don't the western world (US, UK, Canada, France, Germany) go ahead and impose sanctions on Russian Federation.

I have no idea since I am not privy to the various country's internal debates on how to handle Russia. Additionally, this has nothing to do with your and 'Putin Adviser's' inability to grasp basic macro-economics.

AugustusMasonicus
I have no idea

How nice that you were so honest in your first 4 words.

Everything else was fluff and you know it. For future reference, know that you are conversing with a 140 IQ individual.

You gotta do better

I am now logging off, which is your opportunity to have unchallenged last word

AntiPrivateWestBankers
Everything else was fluff and you know it. For future reference, know that you are conversing with a 140 IQ individual.

Is that so? Then use your massive intellect and explain how selling something below market value injures anyone but the seller, particularly when the product/instruments being sold account for only a fraction of the overall market value of said products.

AugustusMasonicusi]
Is that so? Then use your massive intellect and explain how selling something below market value injures anyone but the seller, particularly when the product/instruments being sold account for only a fraction of the overall market value of said products.

This was already covered in this thread, but to repeat, Ruskies would take the hit, even losing 20% if need be.

This has nothing to do with business, these would not be business decisions, this would be pure tit for tat kind of thing.

So Russia dumps 200 billion...so what, hell Obama can waste that much in a few months. Also, does anyone here think China would side with Russia? They really don't like each other, and if China dumped their trillion they would just be shooting themselves in the foot. Their economy would stop cold, wither and die a horrible death.

AntiPrivateWestBankers
This was already covered in this thread, but to repeat, Ruskies would take the hit, even losing 20% if need be.

This has nothing to do with business, these would not be business decisions, this would be pure tit for tat kind of thing.

That would be great for us....I bet China would love to dump all theirs and lose 50% plus value instantly as to what they paid for it.

AntiPrivateWestBankers

Then Why don't the western world (US, UK, Canada, France, Germany) go ahead and impose sanctions on Russian Federation.

If this is not a big deal, they why don't they do it.

And don't tell me because they want to be nice.

Well the first answer that comes to mind is that European countries are pussies...

The second one is that Russia supplies Europe with all their energy...

The third one is no one is going to dump bonds either...

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers


well if having the most gold= the most financially secure i think we win that one
www.businessinsider.com...

1. United States 1. United States Official gold holdings: 8,133.5 tonnes Percent of foreign reserves in gold: 71.7% The U.S. had its largest gold reserves in volume terms in 1952, when reserves totaled 20,663 tonnes. Holdings first fell below the 10,000 mark in 1968. Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

5. China 5. China Official gold holdings: 1,054.1 tonnes Percent of foreign reserves in gold: 1.2% Gold still accounts for a very small percentage of China's $3.7 trillion in foreign exchange reserves, compared with the international average of 10%. Building up gold reserves will be crucial to China as it moves to internationalize its currency, and hopes to make it a reserve currency, according to the Financial Times. Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

so the usa has roughly 8 times the gold of china at number five.

7. Russia 7. Russia Official gold holdings: 1,015.1 tonnes Percent of foreign reserves in gold: 8.3% Russia's central bank gold holdings crossed the 1,000 tonne mark for the first time in Q3. Read more: www.businessinsider.com...

comparable to china but unlike china they seem to be stacking up more gold then the Chinese at least recently but still combining these two nations you still only get about a quarter of usa gold reserves but i will have to agree that per citizen the usa has much more debt then either of those nations

www.economicshelp.org... link in case any one was interested in the numbers from 2011 usa is number 10 on the list russia (149)is almost at the bottom and china(119) a few ahead of it with japan taking the number one spot of debt to gdp ratio

www.economist.com... interactive map showing debt per citizen by each country and three slots to compare up to three nations at once but usa does loose this one badly

en.wikipedia.org... for what its worth

en.wikipedia.org...

Gold holdings peaked during World War II at 20,205 metric tons (649.6 million oz. troy). Today, holdings are 4,578 metric tons (147.2 million oz. troy) in 368,000 standard, 400 oz. troy (12.4 kg or 27.4 lb avoirdupois) gold bars. At the June 17, 2012 rate of $1,618.82 an ounce [9] it is worth $238.290 billion, while the World War II total of 649.6 million oz. troy would be worth $1.051 trillion. The depository also holds monetary gold coins. The 1933 Double Eagle was also a temporary resident after transfer from 7 World Trade Center in July 2001, until its sale in July 2002 for $7.59 million. Sometime in 2004, 10 additional allegedly stolen 1933 Double Eagles were transported to Fort Knox for safekeeping.

tldr usa wins gold reserves hands down but has much more debt per person then russia or china

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers

Guys. I am Russian and I currently live in Russia. It is in fact amazing here. The taxes are super-low, and the economy is growing steadily. Our shops are flooded with stuff. We have 1 gigabyte per sec internet here in Moscow and in some other cities as well.
Even though 60% of the country is still suffering from the USSR collapse, we are rebuilding everything. Everybody in Russia wants to become one with Crimea and in Crimea everyone wants to become one with Russia. Everywhere you have rallies with 10k people marching with Russian and USSR flags, both in eastern Ukraine and Russia. The USA and EU doesnt want us to have Crimea
since if we get kicked out, there will be a free naval base. Obviously the USA and the EU want a port in the Azov sea. There are 2 military "peacekeeping" USA ships not far away already ready to take the abanded base. The Russian soldiers in the Area (all of them are a part of the fleet, those on the streets are the Ukranian national self-defence force, but judging by the equipment they have ("AS-VAl", "Vintorez" elite weapons), they are probably sponsored by Russia) are called "PAM - polite armed men.
Also - Russia has a long-term relationship with China. We are cooperating with them in UN, and in case Russia vetos on something China is ready to follow. We have one of our major internet connections going through them plus huge supply lines. A lot of people think that there will be a Eurasian union with ex-USSR countries + China and others.

President Obama signed an executive order giving his administration powers to freeze U.S.-based financial assets and property 0f Russian officials responsible for the country's military intervention in Ukraine, the White House announced Thursday. Meanwhile, the State Department has expanded its effort to deny visas to those responsible for or complicit in Russia's actions in the Crimea region. Those include Russian and Ukrainian officials, the State Department said.

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers

www.washingtonpost.com...
well it looks like they freeze seize our assets after we allready freeze/seize their assets and the cycle continues

www.washingtonpost.com... 4-e59b1709222c_story.html seems like pepsi co will loose a good deal of cash

Top U.S. companies such as PepsiCo, General Electric and others have touted their involvement in Russia as central to their global strategy. That has involved aggressive investing — PepsiCo is now the largest food and beverage company in Russia, earning $4.8 billion in the country in 2012 — and joint ventures such as GE’s with two Russian firms to manufacture gas turbines in Rybinsk. Ford Motor Co. recently announced a partnership with the Sollers car company. Aerospace giants such as Boeing are among the top U.S. exporters to Russia.

well if they wanted GE to build their turbines that would be off the table and could in theory hurt russian gas production(i think thats what turbines do burn gas to power things)
few other links
insidetrade.com...

www.wsws.org... this one claims sanctions have already been inacted against russia so i guess we wait to see if he was bluffing or not

www.theguardian.com... i guess second round of sactions start tomrrow?

www.foxnews.com... fox's take on the matter for what its worth

I think he [Putin] is making a mistake,” Taylor said. “The sanctions that we are considering and already imposing … will have an effect. I don’t know if they will have an effect on Vladimir Putin, but they will have an effect on the people around him.”

www.washingtonpost.com... 4-e59b1709222c_story.html

www.mondaq.com...

reply to post by AntiPrivateWestBankers


The true test of how good a country is doing is the cost of food as it compares to disposable income. The US is under 10%. Russia is 25%.




Russia is making idol threats hoping our currently weak leadership buys it. Putin is trying to be Hitler 2.0 and if he continues he will end up with the same fate in the end. Polish people had better wake up and smell the coffee history just might be repeating itself.




If I was in charge I would go all out defend the Ukraine. Just imagine how many lives could have been saved if we crushed Germany 5 years earlier. Thankfully for these new fascist scumbags the current US and EU leadership is weak and fearful.