Cartels in Colorado? Duh !

In the link provided below, USA Today does a short video and ask are there Cartels in Colorado. The blasted Cartels are in every state with major distribution hubs if what I have read is to be believed. 70% of all murders come from 3% of the nations geographical areas.. Chicago, Detroit, New Orleans are usually right at the top of the 3% list..Mostly Gang related and their turf wars on distribution.

With the typical government cash cow thinking they will tax and regulate weed so there will be a thriving black market where the stuff can be purchased at 1/2 the price of a government sanctioned store IMO. So instead of solving a Cartel problem they will actually make it easier to market their product. Regardless of how you feel about weed they are making this whole process one where the bad guys always win..

The same scenario happened to cigarettes; a store is selling a pack for $5.75 yet the black market has them for $2.75.. Create a void or an over priced product and someone will figure a way to beat the system every time. India and their farma drug manufacturing is another case in point... Pills that are sold for $15 a pop can be purchased for $3 from India and the Indian manufacturers are making a profit; big business overseas..
www.usatoday.com...

reply to post by 727Sky


You'll always have a black market. But there are a lot of people who will pay the taxes gladly as well. If the item is pricey through taxes, they'll pay to keep out of trouble.

Those that dabble in the black market will be punished when caught, just as if they were engaging in illegal activity before the laws. Maybe even more so. Tax Evasion, RICO, possession with the intent to sell and distribute, etc, etc.

Either way, it's a win-win for those who collect the taxes.

reply to post by 727Sky


Like in many competitive businesses, price will go down or stabilize. The main benefit, besides taxes, of Colorado's actions, are known quality. Guys in cars down the block will not be able to guarantee quality, or even content.

reply to post by 727Sky


I see parallels with prohibition era issues with alcohol.

Sure there were and still are "stills" and "bathtub gin" operations. But they are much reduced with the relaxed laws on booze.

Yeah, a black market in a legal environment is nothing like a black market in an illegal environment - its a much smaller market.

The reason I don't do certain things is because of legality. While I think it's morally wrong for some things to be illegal, I won't risk orphaning my child to do them or to make a point. I would also gladly support a small business vs someone that enables horrific things to happen somewhere in the supply line. I'd happily pay taxes on a product to do enjoy it legally.

I believe most law abiding citizens feel the way you do Kali.. I do realize I am spring loaded to a short fuse anytime people in this country do not think we have a growing cartel problem from Mexico. Having friends with ICE and Border Patrol along with some of their thoughts does not make me special just slightly more informed.. Furthermore, living on the border and having friends with family in Mexico is something that has turned me against the Narco Thugs and their idea of a business about as much as anything I can think of. My great consternation is TPTB will disarm everyone in the states so we can end up just like Mexico with the corruption and killings unabated.... which to me is the pinnacle of folly, but heck I am old, what do I know ?

So you read an article with old news in it and … what.

First of all, Lets look at some things that have happened since legalization:
The people in the country (who use MJ) have joined in the government in keeping drugs out of the hands of children. Win
They have offered on their own TAX and regulation=governance over the product- put money up so that they can contribute to their cities general welfare, infrastructure, education ect as opposed to sitting in jail or prison sucking up tax dollars.
In the process helped to begin the elimination of unfair arrests. Where one segment of the population ends up in jail or prison and others don't. WIN
The drug cartels have since invested in other areas of business knowing they would take a hit in sales if the US and Mexico both began their legalization and governance efforts. win
Medical patients HAVE to be facing less worries about raids and being pushed out of society. win
People have spoken up on this issue -getting involved and participating in government decisions-win
States have begun the process of ISOLATING drug cartel activity. They know the difference between a bud shop and a mafia style drug op. WIN
Mexico has stepped up their efforts in their own cities and the people are involved there too. win

Im not going to let these people destroy what has not even begun by continuously targeting mexicans or other minorities.
Sorry, that # won't cut it. Thats how we got here in the first place.

Just another of Nixon's over-paid, under-educated Drug Warriors fearing unemployment if folks are allowed the freedom of the founding fathers. Of course the cartels all have a presence in the US---the enormous corruption among LEOs as a direct result of Nixon's scheme has allowed them to flourish.
I've been an activist for cannabis since the day Nixon declared his war on drugs. That was the day that my father educated me on Hearst and cannabis. I've continued to study the issue and have come to see that he wasn't mad as a hatter after all. (Jack Herer's The Emperor Wears No Clothes tells pretty much the same story my father told to me.) He was right on target when he said that prohibition of cannabis was all a part of the military-industrial-petro-chemical-pharmaceutical complex. Hemp was one of the few cash crops that a poor sharecropper could raise without a lot of capital outlay. That option was removed in the midst of the Great Depression. How very kind of them...
Fighting the timber industry (much stronger in the 1930s than it is today), the alcohol industry and the petro-chemical industry proved to be too much for those small farmers who produced the hemp crops. Fast forward to the '60s; the bankers realized how profitable money laundering was and joined the Drug Warriors!
There was a time in the '70s when the outlook for sanity about cannabis was good---decriminalization seemed imminent. Indeed, the tobacco companies saw a bonanza just around the corner. I had friend whose first job when he came home from Nam was working for a major tobacco company doing graphic art for cannabis packages. Just recently he mentioned that he just might move to Colorado and supplement his retirement pay doing that again!
It's been a long fight but I see signs of hopefulness. When I think back to my great-grandmother's activism for women's right to vote, it gives me strength to fight on. She worked on that issue for over 40 years before her dream of casting a vote was realized.
I believe the latest polls on removing cannabis from the DEA's Schedule I category show that 7 of 10 Americans approve. That would end the war on cannabis and allow for real, honest research into its utility and a giant step toward ending the senseless war that has killed more innocents than the plant itself ever did.

reply to post by diggindirt


Nice work, and a nice story. Jack Herer was one of the good guys (I shared a stage with him a time or three), and his book one of the best. I figure the 2014 elections in the states should go a long way in solidifying the Colorado/Washington advance, and as California goes, so goes Catalina.

reply to post by Aleister


I might have come across looking like I am anti legalization which is not the case. I am anti taxing the product and making it so expensive that the black market and the Cartels have a price point advantage. Keep the price low and make it so their is no profit for the cartels.. hahaha you have to wonder how that would cut into certain 3 letter agencies funding from the profits they have enjoyed over the years ?

Even though the premise of this thread is faulty with a seemingly biased agenda the discussion is so full of good sense and straight talk about an issue that appears to be evolving in a positive way I am worried about our own censor squad shutting it down.

While Mexico itself is not quite ready to go the recreation route Mexico City is moving in that direction right now. The country's legislature does seem to be favorable to the medical solution as a starter though. Thank goodness the world seems to be coming to its senses, even while the prohibition profiteers are kicking and screaming at every turn on our road back to sanity.

www.borderlandbeat.com...

Hector Javier Villarreal Hernandez, the former treasurer of the Mexican state of Coahuila, appeared in a San Antonio federal court this afternoon to face one count of conspiring to launder money.
Prosecutors allege he laundered in Texas millions of dollars, the proceeds of drug trafficking, bribery, embezzlement and fraud. Villarreal faces up to 20 years in prison if convicted, but court documents in the case did not detail the allegations against him.

The U.S. Department of State's order to release a former Mexican government official from custody after a Tyler traffic stop has an East Texas congressman wanting an oversight committee to look into the order, which has now been reversed.

One day after being told to release 41-year-old Hector Hernandez Javier Villarreal, the former secretary executive of the Tax Administration Service of Coahulia, Mexico, and his 28-year-old wife, Maria Teresita Botello, authorities said they are once again searching for the couple.

"It's the kind of thing that I constantly worry could happen, but I was kind of surprised when it actually did happen," U.S. Rep. Louie Gohmert, R-Tyler, said Wednesday in a phone interview.

reply to post by 727Sky


You are worried about cartels infesting a market where any moron can grow their own? Seems a little short sighted imo.

uh oh...

Erongaricuaro
Even though the premise of this thread is faulty with a seemingly biased agenda the discussion is so full of good sense and straight talk about an issue that appears to be evolving in a positive way I am worried about our own censor squad shutting it down.

While Mexico itself is not quite ready to go the recreation route Mexico City is moving in that direction right now. The country's legislature does seem to be favorable to the medical solution as a starter though. Thank goodness the world seems to be coming to its senses, even while the prohibition profiteers are kicking and screaming at every turn on our road back to sanity.

edit on 17-2-2014 by Erongaricuaro because: (no reason given)

Yea I expect this thread to be shut down as well. Can't have positive talk about this here on ATS. But get it in while it lasts.

Other countries still have to overcome the United States' treaty that the US strong armed the rest of the world into signing. This thing: Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs

So that could be why Mexico as a whole hasn't started the legalization process yet.

www.articlesbase.com...

Phoenix papers report that 6 Mexicans killed a Phoenix man who was found dead by police in a local neighborhood home riddled with more than 100 bullets. Google or click on:They're known as "Los Zetas

The WorldNetDaily is reporting that some are calling a Mexican drug cartel hit performed by members of the active Mexican Army.

According to early and sketchy reports a Phoenix Police Special Assignments Units heard shots coming from a nearby neighborhood and began to drive toward the noise Sunday. Detectives said once police gained entry into the home, they found the body of Andrew Williams, 30, shot numerous times, according to Arizona Daily News.
We have seen an increasing amount of these type of violent crimes in the past five months," Phoenix Police Sgt. Joel Tranter said. "We want the public to realize that these types of crimes will not be tolerated in Phoenix."

Former Rep. J.D. Hayworth, R-Ariz., said Tuesday on 550 KFYI-AM that he had acquired an internal memo identifying one of the suspects as a former member of the Mexican military, and he interviewed Mark Spencer of the Phoenix Law Enforcement Association. The men were said to be wielding AR-15 assault weapons and wearing full body armor and black assault gear similar to uniforms worn by military and police tactical teams.

www.articlesbase.com... 5336.html

EL PASO — A Mexican Drug Cartel member arrested by El Paso police last Monday is accused of hiring a U.S. Army soldier and two juveniles another man to kill Jose Daniel Gonzalez Galeana a Mexican drug cartel lieutenant who was cooperating with U.S. authorities was himself a government informant.

According to court documents Ruben Rodriguez Dorado hired Pfc. Michael Jackson Apodaca, 18, and Christopher Duran, 17, and a un-named 16 year old El Paso juvenile, to assassinate El Paso resident and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement informant Jose Daniel Gonzalez Galeana. The three were arrested Monday and the 16 year old was arrested Wednesday and charged with capital murder in the May 15 slaying of Gonzalez, who was shot eight times outside his upper scale El Paso home with in ear shot of El Paso Police Chief Greg Allen's own home .

If people do not think the Cartels are active in the USA all I can say is you have not been looking at what goes on every week in our cities and states.

Mexican drug cartels move deeper into United States to maximize profits

An Associated Press review of federal court cases and government data finds that drug groups south of the border have been deploying agents into non-border states. ‘It’s probably the most serious threat the United States has faced from organized crime,’ said Jack Riley, head of the Drug Enforcement Administration’s Chicago office.
Read more: www.nydailynews.com...

Chicago recently named a Mexican drug lord, who has never set foot in the city, as its Public Enemy No. 1
From an article in USA Today which quoted the AP 12:46 p.m. EDT April 1, 2013

CHICAGO (AP) - Mexican drug cartels whose operatives once rarely ventured beyond the U.S. border are dispatching some of their most trusted agents to live and work deep inside the United States - an emboldened presence that experts believe is meant to tighten their grip on the world's most lucrative narcotics market and maximize profits.

If left unchecked, authorities say, the cartels' move into the American interior could render the syndicates harder than ever to dislodge and pave the way for them to expand into other criminal enterprises such as prostitution, kidnapping-and-extortion rackets and money laundering.

So like I said "DUH"! Anyone can do a search and find several hundred pages/articles on how the Cartels are expanding and moving their distribution networks into the USA
Mexican drug cartels "have their tentacles in Canada," reports Montreal newspaper

A quote from SinEmbargo's redaction published yesterday:

"More and more, Canadian crime groups prefer to deal directly with Mexican drug cartels, eliminating the middleman so they can enhance their profits. There are lawless regions in Mexico, despite the efforts of authorities to put a brake on the violence, but that actually helps the Canadians make direct contact with criminals. Many Canadians involved in trafficking have been traveling to Mexico for years as tourists, so they already know the territory well. And the intense drug war being fought in Mexico, coupled with increasingly tight security along the U.S. border, have motivated Mexican traffickers to set up their own local operations in Canada. At least nine Canadians with connections to Mexican cartels and organized crime were killed between 2008 and 2012. Canadian public security could be affected if the cartel influence continues unchecked."

727Sky

Phoenix papers report that 6 Mexicans killed a Phoenix man who was found dead by police in a local neighborhood home riddled with more than 100 bullets. Google or click on:They're known as "Los Zetas"

The WorldNetDaily is reporting that some are calling a Mexican drug cartel hit performed by members of the active Mexican Army.

The men were said to be wielding AR-15 assault weapons and wearing full body armor and black assault gear similar to uniforms worn by military and police tactical teams.

If people do not think the Cartels are active in the USA all I can say is you have not been looking at what goes on every week in our cities and states.

Funny you should make reference to the CIA-trained and backed Las Zetas. People would do well to find out more about them. In a way they are like the Muslim extremists groups that were created in similar manner and unleashed onto the world by our own 'black operations' people who are supposedly acting in our best interests way behind the scenes.

Las Zetas gained a foothold during Mexico's Drug War campaign during the 2006-2012 Administration's period by usurping territory from local 'cartels' after the US-advised raids weakened local structures. As a result they now have a stronghold throughout much of Mexico and now seem to be becoming more and more active up north of the border as well.

The US now seems to be well-experienced with going onto foreign soil and creating monsters then seeing them terrorize the American people on their own homeland. One might begin to suspect that result could be part of a larger and more sinister agenda.

Many 'old-money' interests got their start during the opium trade with China centuries ago and know the value of maintaining an off-the-books underworld economy and the value proactive substance prohibition efforts do to enhance that trade.

We were a time without prohibition of that sort until former US President and Chief Supreme Court Justice William Howard Taft reinstated that policy as McKinley's appointed Governor-General of the Phillippines. Interested folks might want to read up on the background of that well-connected Bonesman and statesman of that era when the black drug economy was once again rearing its ugly head and lead us to where we are today in our struggle with oppressive government and a well-financed drug underworld of power brokers and thugs.