A Teesside Taxi Firm refuses to Take Disabled Passengers, Over Fares Row

reply to post by dam00


I do understand what you are saying....and when I said that local authorities should pay for the extra costs incurred to disabled travellers it was a bit tongue in cheek. At a time when all local authorities have cut services and in some instances stopped some services all together I realize this is something that wouldn't be subsidised.

As I mentioned in my previous post those eligible for DLA for mobility needs get extra money for this help. It is my personal opinion that it is fair for those people to use this money as intended and incur the extra costs. For those people who are in real need of help to be mobile but for one reason or another can't/ don't get DLA payments then I can see how it would be a dilemma.

Now I also understand that these DLA payments are funded by the taxpayer ultimately. But I will say one thing....when the stance of today's government is that the people can't expect to get something for nothing and that services have to be cut ( and yes that also includes services to disabled people).....then why should taxi drivers feel like they have a moral obligation to be out of pocket to help certain sections of society? At the same time that this government as targeted the disabled and made it harder to get benefits, introduced a "bedroom tax" that means that those with disabilities who have been assessed as needing an extra bedroom because of health requirements have to "pay" for it. And also when Universal Credit as fully rolled out disabled people will no longer have the service charges on their home adaptations reimbursed. Oh and many people receiving DLA will lose essential income when they are assessed for the new PIP.

So the local authority of this taxi firm wants to talk about equality? How about we talk about the inequality of this government making it harder for disabled people to live independently? But yet people want to moan about a few extra quid that taxi firms charge to reflect service and running costs?

Another point is that all the taxi firms I know the drivers work for the firms on a self employed basis. And where I live in the North I don't see many taxi drivers "living the good life", infact they work very long hours often anti social hours. If drivers can't charge extra to cover their time and outgoings then it wont be beneficial to minibus drivers to operate....which will mean no minibus service for disabled customers.

This is just a deflection...the disabled are getting screwed over the length and breadth of the UK, but hey lets all make the taxi firms the big bad wolf.

Ask the taxi drivers that bought mini buses that have ramps why, I will tell you why to get on the money train that social services run, taking disabled kids to centres etc.

Its a gravy train, yet the ones that make the most out of it with special vans that have ramps etc, ignore disabled people sitting in the rain or cold because its only worth £3.

The next time you are at hospital, take a look at the person in the wheelchair sitting in the cold waiting for a taxi, and then remember that a lot on this board think its ok for a guy who has a special taxi to ignore the call and say he is busy because he want more than the metered fare.

Out Of everything I have read on hear Im shocked that some people think its alright to at more to people misery, do you think they enjoy being in the wheelchair.

I think we have lost our humanity.

reply to post by Logos23


Anyone who has a special adapted Taxi for wheelchairs make a lot more than most of us paid for by the rest of us through local authority contracts.

He wants more from the people that generate his income, because they just want to go local.

This is up there with greed of MPs and bankers

pavmas
Ask the taxi drivers that bought mini buses that have ramps why, I will tell you why to get on the money train that social services run, taking disabled kids to centres etc.

Its a gravy train, yet the ones that make the most out of it with special vans that have ramps etc, ignore disabled people sitting in the rain or cold because its only worth £3.

The next time you are at hospital, take a look at the person in the wheelchair sitting in the cold waiting for a taxi, and then remember that a lot on this board think its ok for a guy who has a special taxi to ignore the call and say he is busy because he want more than the metered fare.

Out Of everything I have read on hear Im shocked that some people think its alright to at more to people misery, do you think they enjoy being in the wheelchair.

I think we have lost our humanity.

Trust me' the make their money from the disbled with contracts' without the disabled they would all be bankrupt'

Ask any taxi driver ( just walk down the rank) ask them how much is his contract worth a week, I bet its enough to cover his car radio and insurance so any other fares he picks up is wages in the pocket

reply to post by pavmas

I think we have lost our humanity.

But why should businesses be forced to placate another person's view of humanity.

That is a platitude.

It's totally subjective.

This is a slippery slope. It's no different than forcing a baker to make a wedding cake for a gay couple.

Why do you feel the need to force your perspective on others?

Have you ever read 'Island'?

In the book when someone is disabled and they do not contribute, at all, to the greater good of society and everyone is forced to cater to them then a government individual is sent to their house to tell them this harsh truth and give them the option of suicide.
Should that be illegal as well? What about the rights of those who have to completely change their schedule to cater to someone?

Is that not discrimination?

Should it be illegal for, let's say me... for me to have the opinion that the disabled are a complete drain on society and of no use?
Sure... it's heartless, evil and immoral, but should it be ILLEGAL?

Where do you draw the line?

Im finishing with this
The guy who has the minibus with the ramps wrote it.

Bear in mind I was a nurse / care worker before I was a taxi operator so I see it from both sides. Even when I go to a care home for somebody the care workers bring the person out in the wheelchair and then stand back and wait for the taxi driver to load the passenger into the taxi. They are getting paid to stand and watch and yet I've not to get paid for doing the work.

So he was a care worker and he said the care worker stood there while he loaded the wheelchair.

So he admits that the care worker was getting paid to stand there and watch him.
So its fair to assume he did the same, so we were paying his wages for standing around while other did the work, now he wants extra than what he is entitled to because he is having to push a wheelchair up 3ft ramps.

Now he is a taxi driver he is complaining about the care workers.

2 jobs dealing with the disabled and you don't want to deal with them

I think you are choosing the wrong profession and I think you should not be allowed with 100 feet of disabled people as it seems you only see them as cash cows

Having to deal with the public as a taxi driver is his chosen daily job. Boo hoo! he has to occasionally work a bit harder for his cash but that's life. - anyone else expect their work to never require any extra effort at times? Get real, work for most is hard at times and whether we like it or not we do have to put in extra effort occasionally, but most accept it with grace, especially when it comes to someone less fortunate than ourselves.

Is Mohammed Basher expecting that other firms should pick up the work he deigns unfit because it damages his profits? He knew the good and the bad sides of the work he chose when he applied for a license to operate a taxi firm from the Local Authority, so he was patently aware of his obligations concerning discrimination. As many disabled can't drive and their bus services don't always take them near where they want to go, their only means of transport may be taxi. I suspect were a member of his own family disabled and discriminated against he would be the first to cry.

Many taxi firms benefit from lucrative contracts taking and collecting kids to/from school who for some reason or another are unable to use public transport or walk. He could quite easily compromise himself and his drivers over some of these contracts which make up the bread-and-butter income for some firms.

Mr Bashir obviously thinks he should rewrite his contract as he sees fit and discriminate against a sector of our society which is actually vulnerable. But taxi firms today seem to be able to employ unskilled drivers who clearly have never done their local knowledge exams, some can't speak English clearly or understand English well enough to enter the destination required on their Satnavs so the 'fare' might as well drive the taxi themselves. The wheelchair fare is hardly a new phenomena so how come other firms aren't whinging and have been picking up these fares, as part of their regular service to the public since taxi's began? I dare say other firms will be grinning at this because the public, especially the disabled and their friends will probably boycott his firm and his meanness of spirit may well bite him on the back.

He should console himself that when the fare is in a wheelchair, the fare can't on arrival at their destination leg it and not pay

We should pride ourselves on the way we care for our vulnerable because its a great part of our society and when personal greed starts to undermine this principle for me its a slippery slope. He is hardly likely to have a huge number of wheelchair customers and I dare say many of them, conscious of the extra trouble the driver takes are likely to tip extremely well and, if making a regular weekly journey are likely to ask for the same driver every time, which is good for business and recommendation always helps public service companies like taxi's.

reply to post by Shiloh7

Having to deal with the public as a taxi driver is his chosen daily job. Boo hoo! he has to occasionally work a bit harder for his cash but that's life. - anyone else expect their work to never require any extra effort at times?

But why do you want to FORCE him to do something that he doesn't want to do.

The entire idea behind capitalism is that if he chooses to do a poor job then he will not have customers.

The free market can decide this... the government doesn't need to do this.

It seems to me like this is more about forcing a perspective than about actually solving an issue.

Because business owners will simply close up shop and then no one will have a taxi.
And then everyone goes crying to the government for help.

Why not just solve the problem.
Pull up the proverbial boot straps and be a man.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Ok well let me put it another way.

In the summer when its a nice hot day and people are walking and he is sitting in the rank for 3 hours without a hire.

I guarantee that he is quick to answer the call then and is all smiles when he arrives chatting away with the disabled passengers.

You see' disabled have to use the cabs all year round, and the disabled are his bread and butter in the summer, its just in the winter and at christmas when its busy that the disabled then become a hassle.

I guarantee that they will sit on disabled hires going to hospital and you will have 3 or 4 cars competing for the hire in hot weather

look at your local press in the summer, no call out charges, we have specai wheelchair vehicles etc.


They all want the disabled when no one wants them that a fact.

reply to post by pavmas


But you don't seem to be answering my question about why do you want to force him, by government statute, to engage in a practice.

That is what I don't understand.

If he is that much of a poor businessman then he will be out of business, but if not, then it seems to me like this is simply about forcing others to see your point of view under government mandate.

I am not debating the ethics of this.

I am debating the reality that we do not need big brother to tell us right or wrong.

The whole point of a free market is to bypass the need for a master.

reply to post by Shiloh7


Well said mate thats what I have been trying to say and in the summer when its dead, they love the disabled because thats their bread and butter.

I hope disabled now ask low paid workers to do the work, many people would be glad to run you round the corner for £3

reply to post by pavmas


How many people on here would be willing to run disabled people less than a mile for £3 min fare, you could do 40 a day no problem which you would clear £100 profit.
Stuff the overpriced taxis who want more.

reply to post by Shiloh7


Exactly he is taking the law into his own hands and the local council is pussy footing around him

Wheelchair access In some areas (mainly larger cities), licensed taxis have to be wheelchair accessible. To find out if there are accessible taxis near you, contact the taxi licensing office at your local council.

Reporting problems As well as the rules on wheelchairs and assistance dogs, all taxi and minicab drivers must make sure they don’t discriminate against you and can’t treat you less favourably than other customers. They should also make any ‘reasonable adjustments’ to their service for you to make your journey easier. You should report any problems to the taxi licensing office at your local council.Reporting problems As well as the rules on wheelchairs and assistance dogs, all taxi and minicab drivers must make sure they don’t discriminate against you and can’t treat you less favourably than other customers. They should also make any ‘reasonable adjustments’ to their service for you to make your journey easier. You should report any problems to the taxi licensing office at your local council.

Transport if you're disabled GOV.UK

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Because thats the law he cant take who ever he pleases, it was the law I had to give up my license, Im happy for a free for all, I never said I was not fit to drive the DVLA did undr the law, If taxis dont want to take me I'll drive myself.

Im forced to use taxis, if they do not want to take me for the same price as everyone then hand in his license and give it to someone who will not discriminate, he stated he got his licence only on condition that he had ramps fitted.

Thats because there is enough taxis on the road and he found a back door to get a plate by getting a vehicle for carrying disabled.

Now he is ignoring them and only wanting able bodied passengers,

This guy is stealing from other taxi drivers, he is ignoring disabled passengers and taking able bodied where other drivers are not equipped to take wheelchairs, so he has the best of both worlds.

I bet he take the disabled in the summer no problem and I bet he has a local authority contract carrying disabled kids.

reply to post by dam00


Any contracts that company has carrying disabled people has to be removed and all licences where drivers have overcharged disabled people

reply to post by pavmas


I dont want to force this guy to do anything, there is only a limited number of plates allocated in any area.

He got one going down the disabled carrying route, but he ignores disabled callers.

His fellow drivers will be complaining about him as well, he is stealing money from them, in the summer its cut throat in the taxi business, but this guy will still have the disabled passengers.

The guy does not just want to rip off disabled he wants to cheat fellow drivers,

I worked as a driver for 10 years and met many like him, other tricks are applying for private plates and picking from the streets in the busy times, stealing money from other drivers.

reply to post by pavmas


You are completely missing my argument.

I am not saying that the law does or doesn't require anything.

I am asking you WHY should your opinion that he should do this be law?

I am an American. I am not from across the pond. I don't know your laws and I am not here to debate them.

This is a question about perspective and statute.

I am asking you why any business should be forced to take cater to someone.

Please understand this. I am not discussing if he should or should not have his license revoked.

Why should a business be forced to cater to a select group of people to whom they do not wish to cater?
If it's because he makes money off of them, so he should have to take the good with the bad...

Then stop giving him the good!

That is the point of a free market. I am asking you a basic question pertaining to free market fundamentals.

reply to post by pavmas


I don't condone disabled people left waiting for a ride because it's too much trouble. I have a disabled daughter but fortunately these days I have my own car. I can honestly say that in the two and half years my daughter had to to make very frequent hospital trips for treatment and admissions, she was treated no differently by the taxi drivers whether the journey was funded by one of the contracts you talk about or whether it was a local 3 quid journey out of my own pocket. And we have never been treated with anything but kindness.

My only argument ( if you can call it this) is that taxi firms and more importantly the vast amount of drivers that are actually working for them on a self employed basis don't drive people about out of the goodness of their hearts they do it to make money. They don't offer a community service as such.
And whilst this government advocates " you can't expect something for nothing" mentality and get behind policies that target the disabled and create inequality and make it harder for them to live independent lives without causing distress.....then I don't see how individual businesses can be blamed for not having a moral conscience when the very people we allow to run our country advocate against it.

If we are talking about taxi firms wanting the right to charge more money for a trip involving a minibus that costs more to run and has greater overheads I think that is fair. If a taxi firm can't be arsed with disabled customers because they don't want the hassle I think personally that is morally wrong. But I also think the way this government treats the disabled in many instances is morally wrong....and we allow it.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Say you are a taxi driver' your area is at saturation point and you are struggling to make a wage.

A guy buys a new fancy van to take wheel chairs and the local authority hand him a plate.

this guy is taking hires that you used to cover , but refusing to take the hires that he got the plate for in the first place.

He will get preference treatment for local authority contracts because he can take wheelchairs, but the guy who had been doing them for years gets over looked because he has a saloon car.

And now this guy says he ignores the disabled calls

pavmas
reply to post by kyviecaldges

 

Say you are a taxi driver' your area is at saturation point and you are struggling to make a wage.

A guy buys a new fancy van to take wheel chairs and the local authority hand him a plate.

this guy is taking hires that you used to cover , but refusing to take the hires that he got the plate for in the first place.

He will get preference treatment for local authority contracts because he can take wheelchairs, but the guy who had been doing them for years gets over looked because he has a saloon car.

And now this guy says he ignores the disabled calls

Instead of forcing him into a compelled behavior... why not lobby the government to take away his contract?
And if they don't then why is it his fault?

Don't hate the player.

Hate the game.

Equity as law is a horribly slippery slope.
Equity being the enforcement of contract as law.

Simply take away the contract. Compelled behavior is currently criminal and if we take that away then we lose our right to self-determination.

This is a slippery slope mate. That is my point.