Australia sends navy to push asylum-seeker boats back to Indonesia

reply to post by Bassago


Just for the record, these people are cistiznship seekers, not assalyum seekers. If they were, seking assalym they would be happy with temporary protection visas.

Seondly, labour and liberal are just the two wings of the same bird of prey but I appalud the incumbent faction on this action.

I have nothing against genuine refugees, but these 'asylum seekers' that try and come to Aussie by boat are nothing more that queue jumpers that stop the people who really need help from getting it.

I mean these people pay to get one on these boats in the promise they will be brought to Australia by the smugglers. Sounds more like a leisurely cruise than a person in desperate need for help to me....

Here is a govt report on the people smuggling business; The people smugglers business



When these boats of freeloaders keep arriving, families in desperate need are rotting in UN camps in really bad situations like Syria are left therein limbo because they are making up a disproportionate number of the quota of refugees we accept a year. I have spoken to a few charities here downunder that help refugees settle and they point blank refuse to help boat people with their services as they share the same opinion. After all, if they can afford a few thousand dollars to get on a dodgy boat and come here, then they are probably not that hard up after all....

As we say downunder, 'it's just not cricket really.

I totally agree with pushing the boats back because I think Asylum-seekers should make application through an Embassy in a country next door to their own, their own or the closest country to their own country. Just turning up is emotional blackmail and it actually stops the real problems ever being sorted out within their own countries. We also don't know the identification of many of these people, especially single men with no documents.

Syria as the immediate example has been decimated systematically in parts by gung-ho thugs who simply love to destroy and kill. We know from bitter experience how, what starts out as a civil war in the ME/Africa suddenly attracts every gun toting thug that can get themselves over there as well as the home grown ones. Having experienced the taste of thuggery, murder, rape as well as the destruction of other people's homes and facilities and being totally unaccountability for your actions, are these people really safe to take in in the West or will this trait appear if they can't get their own way over something, however trivial. I don't believe murder and rape in truth comes under the excuse of the religious umbrella.

I do think that there are genuine asylum seekers but they should be going to nearby countries where they are likely to share a similar culture because in the UK we are already over populated and becoming underfunded for thge numberf of people here, loet alone more and incoming numbers of people need to be balanced with outgoing numbers.

Asylum seekers, immigrants, illegals, refugees ... call them what you will ... in the

end they are a 'people/body' count. All of them coming from 'poorer countries' to

(richer?) ones!! Which inspite of recessions etc. have a reasonably viable economy

and their citizens are reasonably well catered for when ill, out of work , housed, and

when old.


These same 'rich' countries give to the poorer countries that the 'people/body'

count are coming from - vast sums of money (often at the expense of their

own citizens)


Now I have this mental picture of the not too distant future .... where the

industrialised countries eg. (Australia, Canada, UK, France, Germany etc.) will soon

be over populated and bursting at the seams, indeed if land was able to sink through

over load I can see the UK going under ... lol (I'm sure you've all seen pictures of

Indian transport with people on roofs and hanging off the sides of busses and trains)

When that happens there will be vast swathes of empty, barren areas around the

world, in these lands left behind?


So I ask just where is all the money that the 'rich' countries are giving to the

poorer nations going to ???


IMO these 'poorer' countries should not receive money with no strings attached

but be given help with industry towards their own economies, creating work and a

reason to stay and flourish in their own countries.

reply to post by Bassago




Someone please do reminding this heartless piece of crap Mr. Australian PM that the whole bunches of Australians are freaking ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS…!

What’s the catch..?

amkia
reply to post by Bassago

 

Someone please do reminding this heartless piece of crap Mr. Australian PM that the whole bunches of Australians are freaking ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS…!

What’s the catch..?

When you say that a whole bunch of Australians are illegal immigrants, are you referring to the colonisation of Australia?

If you are, then i am sorry to say that we are not our ancestors. Our ancestors were British citizens who came to Australia and colonised it. Modern Australians cannot be blamed for that.

It's not Indonesians, but mostly refugees from middle east, burma, afghanistan, etc. They just pass through indonesia. (the skippers are indonesians though looking for a quick buck )

Indonesians are smarter. They come on a tourist or student visa to Australia and then just hide when the visa expires. Or they apply on cruise ships, and as soon the ship ports in Australia or USA, just "jump ship".

I am an Indonesian who studied in Australia, and know many Indonesians who did that. A friend of mine staying illegally in Australia got caught , interned for a month, and got send back. In Indonesia he just bought a new identity, falsified papers and bank account statements and came back to Australia a month later on tourist visa.

When looking at this topic, we must remember Indonesia's position. Indonesia has completely frozen bilateral relations with Australia in regards to the asylum seeker problem. As such, Australia is forced to take action unilaterally.

Considering Indonesia is unwilling to help, and even in some instances, continues to allow the smuggling, i will support the Prime Minister in allowing the Australia Navy to force the boats back into Indonesian waters. At least the Navy is being put to some good use.

I see so many individuals stating how Australia should take them because they are seeking asylum. I call BS, as even if they were seeking actual asylum (most are economic immigrants), they have traveled through numerous stable, and safe, countries. Under UN law, they must stop in the closest stable country. It is therefore illegal to travel through that country to get to another of which one desires.

I don't give a # what Indonesia says; if they won't help us, they should expect every boat to be turned back. It is the least we could do after their attempts to harm Australia through alternative means (such as trade relations, asylum seekers, economic factors, intelligence factors etc).

DAAS.

daaskapital


Considering Indonesia is unwilling to help, and even in some instances, continues to allow the smuggling, i will support the Prime Minister in allowing the Australia Navy to force the boats back into Indonesian waters. At least the Navy is being put to some good use.

Indonesia got 18,000 islands and maybe 50 sea worthy high-sea boats in their navy. According to indonesian law, they don't allow the smuggle and trespassing of refugees...Indonesia just doesnt have the resources.

on top of that individuals in army, navy and government are just corrrupt..so yea the individual officer for sure has his hands in, but Not "indonesia" as a state.

in regards to "freezing bilateral cooperation" maybe australia shouldnt have spied on indonesia, as announced by snowden

nagabonar

daaskapital


Considering Indonesia is unwilling to help, and even in some instances, continues to allow the smuggling, i will support the Prime Minister in allowing the Australia Navy to force the boats back into Indonesian waters. At least the Navy is being put to some good use.

Indonesia got 18,000 islands and maybe 50 sea worthy high-sea boats in their navy. According to indonesian law, they don't allow the smuggle and trespassing of refugees...Indonesia just doesnt have the resources.

on top of that individuals in army, navy and government are just corrrupt..so yea the individual officer for sure has his hands in, but Not "indonesia" as a state.

in regards to "freezing bilateral cooperation" maybe australia shouldnt have spied on indonesia, as announced by snowden

edit on 8-1-2014 by nagabonar because: (no reason given)

While Indonesia doesn't have the resources to allow the smuggling of refugees, i agree that it probably wouldn't stop some high ranking individuals in the government and military from doing so...

In regards to freezing bilateral cooperation, maybe Indonesia shouldn't act so hastily on something which happened under a previous government more than 4 years ago. Indonesia shouldn't be using the spying allegations as a means to damage Australia. This is especially so, considering Indonesia would obviously engage in similar intelligence gathering tactics against its neighbours, including Australia.

reply to post by daaskapital


Agree with your points.

One should also remember not to 'blame' all Brits because some of them were deported, against their will, to the penal colony of Australia for crimes such as poaching to feed a starving family.

Also it was the people who arrived before Australia was 'developed' who set up industry, farming, etc etc that worked for and built the foundations of the wealth Australians have today by their hard graft up to that of the workers today.

reply to post by Shiloh7


Completely agree!

Thanks to everyone who responded. So it seems that basically people aren't adverse to helping non-citizens so much as they are against people crashing their shores and borders. There also appears to be an undercurrent that the social services are set up to help outsiders more than citizens.

Interesting to note I don't believe a single Australian was against the use of naval forces to stop this. I'm in agreement with this sentiment and wish it were happening in the US as well. Obama, the democrats and some republicans seem dead set on throwing open our borders and welcoming illegals in with open arms.

This is not a simple or easy issue. Something like 5% of boat people drown and die on the way from Indonesia to Australia. I don't understand the Greens Party view which seems to be let them all in. So they are happy to let 5% or so drown at sea? Surely the people smuggling and deaths at sea must stop. What is more humane letting people drown at sea or trying to make them stay in Indonesia?

reply to post by JimTSpock


I do not think that is Australia's problem. If someone chooses to get on a leaky old tub and then drowns, surely it is largely their own fault. Stop giving boat people asylum and the boats stop coming. It has worked before and it will work again. As for the Greens, it is just grand standing, trying to make themselves relevant when they are about as useful as teats on a bull.

P

amkia
Someone please do reminding this heartless piece of crap Mr. Australian PM that the whole bunches of Australians are freaking ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS…!

What’s the catch..?

So are the aborigines.... even the yanks are boat people.

Bassago

Bilder
They are economic refugees, they pass through quite a few countries on their way here,they come for the benefits and handouts

So similar to all the illegals swarming the US southern borders.

Do you support stopping them with the navy?

Absolutely I support stopping them with the navy , nothing else save the Indonesians can stop them before they reach our shores

Here's an update, looks like Tony Abbott is indicating that Australia is in a war against the "people smugglers."

Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott on Friday likened the fight against people-smugglers to war, while defending the detention centres asylum-seekers are held in as effective and humanely run.

Indonesian officials say the Australian navy has turned back at least one boat carrying asylum-seekers to its shores, although The Australian newspaper said as many as five have been secretly returned.

“In the end, we are in a fierce contest with these people-smugglers,” he told a breakfast television programme. “And if we were at war, we wouldn’t be giving out information that is of use to the enemy just because we might have an idle curiosity about it ourselves.”

Australian PM compares fight against ‘people-smugglers’ to war

So if this is a "war" then ships may sometimes be sunk while in "battle." Wonder if he was just making a generalization or is this an indicator of things to come?

reply to post by Bassago

So if this is a "war" then ships may sometimes be sunk while in "battle." Wonder if he was just making a generalization or is this an indicator of things to come?

No! What he said was:

if we were at war, we wouldn’t be giving out information that is of use to the enemy just because we might have an idle curiosity about it ourselves

So he is simply saying he is not going to tell you what exactly is happening because Intel is critical at this point in time.

P

reply to post by pheonix358


Just my naturally suspicious nature peeking through. When someone says "we are in a fierce contest" and uses military naval vessels against other vessels I pretty much figure that's at a minimum "war-like" behavior. Couple that with the following and... well, like I said, I'm a suspicious guy.

Abbott’s conservative government has refused to reveal details of the incidents or other “operational matters”, sparking claims from the Labor opposition that it is overseeing a “Stalinist”-style media blackout.

“Stalinist operational matters” indeed.