UFOs - Military style?

Long time, no post.


Let me start by saying that I'm not here to debate (as I hold no position) to whether aliens have visited us ever or are now. Now that's clear...


I want to put the reader of this thread in my shoes, a sound minded skeptic, whom I became after an actual UFO experience. May sound strange to some but that's how it happened. This is not that much about the sighting details rather than how it changed my views and some questions which it raised and I still struggle answering after three years of looking for the solid explanation.


If you asked me four years ago if I believed that aliens are visiting us I would automatically reply yes, without looking further into it. Well, since that night I haven't been as convinced anymore and nowadays I would evade the conversation by simply replying "We all know too little about everything around us so I just don't know about this, too" bearing in mind how complicated this issue is, actually. Thing is I faced so many questions in the morning after the experience, that I was in a shock for probably another month and I have been looking for the answers and weighing the probabilities ever since. Just shouting by default "aliens" didn't do it for me (at least after the fifth hour into the sighting). Obviously no green men came down to shake hands with us.


I'll leave the sighting details for the end of the post as I assure you - we are not talking about a mis-identification of any kind, we are talking about physical crafts with distinctive shape and some mind boggling capabilities too. In short, I'm sure we are either talking military, private sector, alien, or any of the other out-there explanations that don't exclude a real physical (or holographic or whatever) craft being present there.

I don't want this discussion to have anything to do with whether aliens have visited us or the cliche question if they are out there at all (come on, we all know they are). Now lets proceed with an assumption - lets say what we saw was either military or private sector black ops. It is not definitive in this assumption if the technology which the upper mentioned developed is from extra-terrestrial origin or have been either the behind-curtain child of Hitler's projects or an end result of Tesla's work. So this is a question which is also in the equation and begs an answer. Now logic led me to asking these questions:


1. What purposes might these UFOs be serving their creators in both cases - military and private sector?

2. If it's military - why don't they use this technology in war?

3. Again - if it's military - who is the most likely culprit - the USA, Russia or China? Keeping the geographic place of the sighting in mind that is (Eastern Europe - Bulgaria). And are they allowed to make dangerous low altitude maneuvers over other countries while testing unconventional aircraft? It is a good time to mention the US has several bases in Bulgaria but they're nowhere that advanced (or at least on the outer looks of it). There is hearsay about at least two 10 story underground secret bases who I am not sure if are Bulgarian, Russian or US, or if they exist at all. I still find this possibility likely, though. Also, a good note to be kept in mind is NATO has it's first line of anti-air shield against the middle East located alongside the Balkan Mountain Chain where the sighting actually happened, supposedly.

4. Why do they still keep these behind closed doors? They kept the B2 bomber and the Blackbird a secret for a much shorter time. In other words, why is revealing the flying saucer or the flying triangle such a huge thing for the DOD as it can easily invent some story to cover up aliens, if there are such visiting, yet, verify their own story?



These are questions I'm pondering on... Now a bit about the sighting.


As this is not supposed to be a rehash of an old thread which I already posted awhile ago and the information is easily available so I will keep it straight to the facts here, if anyone is interested in reading more I can easily put a link to the wall of text I wrote back in 2010.

So this is basically what we are talking about:

- two witnesses
- distant mount area (no vehicle)
- duration of the sighting from around 11:00 PM until sunrise (5:20-5:30 PM)
- continuously appearing and disappearing objects, constantly numbering 20 and above throughout the sighting
- distance between objects and us - from 300 meters up to several kilometers
- most of the objects consisted of lights, no craft body could be seen due to distance and darkness. However, two crafts - a saucer shaped and a triangle shaped were observed clearly due to close distance and background of village lights in the triangle case. No sound whatsoever.
- note that there have been multiple witness reports happening in this very same area. Since 2009 I have found info on at least 8 sightings, most during night, one during the day. The national TV even spent 20 minutes on this interviewing a witness, not that I have known about prior to my experience.

Now, ladies and gents, your input will be very welcome and I'm curiously looking forward to the discussion. Also, any further information that you may require, I may provide.

1. For military, it would be more of a territorial thing. A craft able to go atmosphere to space, with out a problem could be quite a versatile weapon. It would be like a sniper in space.

He who control the heavens control the ground and the skies. Air to Air superiority.

Private sector...who knows, maybe they are just MEGO-manical and just want one. I would too.

2.It would like tanks in world war 1, difference being the air capability. Plus everyone would want one.

3. Idk.

4. It always good to have an Ace in the hole is it not.

There's absolutely no benefit to releasing this information to the public. They can gain far more intel from trying to sneak it around and reading reports on people who say they saw something. It helps them determine a part of the crafts capability for not being detected.

Private companies would of course keep them quiet so the competition doesn't copy them, that's a given.

They aren't used in wars because there's simply no reason to use what we can assume is very expensive weaponry, when conventional does the job just fine.

Specimen
1. For military, it would be more of a territorial thing. A craft able to go atmosphere to space, with out a problem could be quite a versatile weapon. It would be like a sniper in space.

I agree, however, I do believe that not only the US but China, Russia and less likely UK, Germany and Australia already have such technology, be it stolen from one another or developed on its own.

4. It always good to have an Ace in the hole is it not.

To be very honest, I believe the military already has technology far more mind-blowing than the saucer which we as laymen could easily consider ace (or aces) in the hole.

reply to post by ch1n1t0


Your questions about the military actually provide the answer... No!

And as to physical space aliens who have never stopped to actually say hello... No!

Are people seeing something.... Yes!

ch1n1t0

1. What purposes might these UFOs be serving their creators in both cases - military and private sector?

Wow, what WOULDN'T you be doing with it? For fun, let's say military, and for exploration and colonization. Nothing like having the Murkin flag waving happily over places far and strange. Also nice to have viable colonies if something goes grievously wrong here.

2. If it's military - why don't they use this technology in war?

Who says they haven't? But if you DID have that sort of ability and the other guys didn't know (except, say, a European coalition of our best buddies), then you wouldn't want to show your hand.

3. Again - if it's military - who is the most likely culprit - the USA, Russia or China?

USA. China knows it exists and is working towards it but they're something like 70 years behind.

4. Why do they still keep these behind closed doors?

The technology is such a sweeping change that you don't get a whiff. Also, it's inherently dangerous in ways that are immediately obvious to the casual observer, so if you had a bunch of po'd folk that liked to engage in mad bombings, you could really up the ante if it was common knowledge. Besides, everyone would be pissed off they weren't able to buy a ticket to fabulous Planet Dirt.

In other words, why is revealing the flying saucer or the flying triangle such a huge thing for the DOD as it can easily invent some story to cover up aliens, if there are such visiting, yet, verify their own story?

You got it backwards. Roswell was a coverup for the first manned flight that failed right after takeoff.

2. If it's military - why don't they use this technology in war?

Who says they haven't? But if you DID have that sort of ability and the other guys didn't know (except, say, a European coalition of our best buddies), then you wouldn't want to show your hand.

And, yet, they are that bold by testing it out on European soil? A lot of things could go wrong in such a risky operation. What would they be doing on the Balkan peninsula in the first place? And it wasn't like they were headed somewhere, rather than they were doing some sort of an operation in the area, be it a test or a mission of sorts. Why there?

In other words, why is revealing the flying saucer or the flying triangle such a huge thing for the DOD as it can easily invent some story to cover up aliens, if there are such visiting, yet, verify their own story?

You got it backwards. Roswell was a coverup for the first manned flight that failed right after takeoff.

The one explanation that is sound enough to have roamed in my mind a lot for the recent months. And it's a good cover up - *hey, it's aliens.*...*hey, it's just a balloon*... now everyone thinks it's aliens and not us doing what no one should know we're doing.

What doesn't jive with me is the continued expenditure of budget monies on the more publicly known conventional warfare technologies.

How much did that new class of aircraft carrier cost?

Sure, there's the keeping up appearances argument, but, with such technologies, and conventional warfare superiority already in the clench, Budgets could be cut back, and pumped into making the more and better "invisible" military full of the supposed spooky flying saucer stuff.

A large military footprint presents logistical expenses, as well as a bigger target.
Sure, there's a bit to be said for making a showing in areas as a police or security presence, but, similar could be affected with empty shells of boats crewed by servicemen tasked to bluff.

Meh.
It just seems a little silly to continue dumping money into 'obsolete' conventional obvious-tech that's only just a bit better than what everyone else has if there's already tech near equivalent to 'magic' compared what's on the public consumer market now.

Then again, maybe that's the point.
Money no longer means anything with the availability of the resources in the Asteroid Belt, so, why not just dump worthless values into obsolete toys?

Still, seems all a bit far fetched.

reply to post by ch1n1t0


I'll give you some comments mostly based upon personal experience and thinking.

Unless you discard every bit of evidence for UFOs collected since 1947 (if not earlier too,) you must accept that they are legitimate phenomena from some existence other than our normal reality. That translates down as being ETs from another planet or another dimension.

Not to discount what that knowledge means to humanity, but to the military-industrial complex, it is the greatest secret ever kept. More specifically, that translates down to the realization that the type of physics that UFOs use is the greatest development since the invention of the wheel.

What that exactly means is that the people that hold the secrets of recreating that capability in earthly devices have the best war weapon and deterrent ever developed. It surpasses the invention of gunpowder and is far more functional as a useable weapon of war than is the atomic bomb--not to mention as a commercial wonder tool for civilization in general.

The triangles are our version of the circular UFOs. I suspect the triangle shape is due to our relying on the old airplane manner of a three-axis control.

The triangles are frequently seen in areas where they really shouldn't been seen, but I see that has serving two functions. When witnessed by the startled public in low-level operations, they, of course, are called UFOs because they display the same characteristics as a typical UFO and they obviously are not normal aircraft. Because of their strangeness, they are lumped with typical UFO sightings, therefore mostly dismissed by media and government and not never reported in the media as possibly a new type of domestic craft.

I buttress that opinion with these facts. In 1998 I was attending a well-know UFO conference in Laramie, Wyo. After the lectures of the evening I and about twenty others were standing outside in the June evening when a tremendous object of a triangular shape came from the mountains in the west to move directly over Laramie very low, slow and silent. The city lights of Laramie were reflected from its underside. In addition, it has an array of strobe lights, all incredibly bright, some impossibly so, that were flashing in a random fashion, but yet typical strobe lights. It took a full 20 minutes for the craft to move out of sight to the east toward Cheyenne. As I said, about 20 of us witnessed the encounter. It was videoed with a 8mm camcorder.

Was that an alien UFO that at incredible odds of chance just happened to come by that evening? Or was it a ship from our Space Force that decided to make one of their public appearances over us UFO "nuts" to get us to call it a UFO and not think of it as something domestic?

No one takes these sightings,aka, military or say terrestrial based to a logical conclusion. Facts, USA is the only power with the military money and muscle to construct such vehicle. Russia? Owned already by high level mafia types same as China. No other country in the world can match these three for money or power. Now take it as given that these vehicles belong to the US. Why in this whole world would they be developing these weapons for terrestrial use. Who have they to fear so much to want highly developed weaponry. Russia? Naw. Russia can only just look after itself. Do not believe Mr Putins sabre rattling go look at Russia yourself and see that it's just coping with its own problems. China. Naw. If China wanted the US it would just buy it, take it over monetarily no loss of life no war. Now look at who the US is now fighting, people barely out of mud huts that have to use IEDs made of fertiliser and old Kalashnikovs. Talk about using a sledge hammer to crack a hazelnut is not in the vocabulary. More like using a nuke to crack a hazelnut. So who are the US so afraid of that they are spending billions of dollars developing this advanced weaponry. Assuming, of course that it is the US. Unless its whose got the biggest dick on the block scenario. Who the hell is in a position to do anything if these vehicles are made public? It makes not the slightest difference to an enemy whether they are killed by a conventional weapon or a high tec super secret weapon. Dead is dead. So now tell me why spend so much money (on developing super high tec weaponry) when the expenditure does not warrant the cost. NO enemy on the planet can hope to match the weapons available now never mind weapons that are "tens of years in advancement to what we have now".

If these are military craft they might be something that's like a "swarm" of drones. possibly designed to disorient ground based light-tracking systems.

reply to post by crayzeed


A lot of truth in your words. Aspects I haven't considered yet in depth, so thank you for the valuable contribution to the thread. This is why I've started this.

However, I can't fully agree on a couple of points (but I don't disagree as well, rather I'm speculating) - first, don't forget that the Cold War hasn't only ended, but has mutated to such a degree it is mind boggling if attempted to be grasped. A lot of the secrecy surrounding UFOs could be a result and a mixture between wildly complicated mindgames between the West and the East, true unexplainable phenomenon (not saying ET though, but not what we would consider natural as well) and quite a lot of bogus stories. So. Taking that in account - don't underestimate Russia since we can only speculate how much they would be capable of.

Another thing is I don't think they have to be developing UFOs because of fear. An example from the tip of my mind on why else they would do it - "We will be the first to visit an exo-planet before anyone else even suspects we have the tech to do it already!". Add to the soup all the mind games and psyops and down you go the rabbit hole. But fear of something? If there's any fear involved it's on instinctive level and from the unknown. If it was fear of something specific (say alien race coming to rape our women) the panic among the "In-The-Know" would have bursted out by now.

NonsensicalUserName
If these are military craft they might be something that's like a "swarm" of drones. possibly designed to disorient ground based light-tracking systems.

edit on 25-11-2013 by NonsensicalUserName because: (no reason given)

The unknown "light-no-craft" objects we witnessed - could be as we couldn't judge the size or distance (although drones would make at least some detectable noise). The two other we saw were the size of a two-three story building making no sound. A bit huge for a drone I suppose and for only serving disorientation purpose.

Yes, USA would have the technology.

But dont discount The UK, Germany and France from that list.

After all, it is England/Scotland/Wales/Ireland, Germany and France that has taught America EVERYTHING it knows.......EVERYTHING, from Steam engines, to V twin Harley Davidsons (two English chaps btw), to rockets to computers to cars....EVERYTHING!!

Europe (Anglo/Franco) have some very sophisticated triangle shaped UAVs in service.

Having seen a black triangle, I believe they are primarily a recon/surveillance bird, not meant for military engagement.

Flying saucers I have no clue about, or seen one.

I still cannot fathom that some "Alien" species would fly/travel many light years in 30foot diameter discs.

It makes more sense, to me, that they would have bases on Earth (or sea), the Moon, Other planets or a large space station, that have existed for many Earth years.

Of course, our knowledge of the Physics of the Universe is still at the infant stage...so there may be some "Key" to it all, we are not aware of.....yet.

reply to post by ch1n1t0


Was one witness more religious or spiritual and the other one not so much that way?

my opinion, for what its worth:

aliens have travelled here, and either crashed(unlikely) or got shot down(very likely). then, the military scavenged all that they could from the wreckage, and have since learned to duplicate that technology,the whole time releasing stuff to the public 10 years after the fact.

mind you, this is a general idea of mine, not an epiphany

Today they are wonders of technology and engineering. Where they are in more demand and dreamt about then a Lamborghini to anyone who has the money.

Next couple 100, to a millennium they get made in China.

One reason to keep it secret would be the power system.

It could be the system used to power those UFO's is a disruptive technology for the establishment.

(Free, cheap or abundant energy is not something the real power brokers would like to see available for everyone. )

There's been lots of similar threads, search for black triangles.
There's nothing completely revolutionary about lighter than air vehicles since if you think about it they have been around before aeroplanes. The black triangle is probably some type of heavy lift aircraft due to it's large size and extra lift from helium. They seem to operate at night for camoflauge purposes and may have a very long range. This is all guesswork on my part. They appear near air bases and in NATO countries.
Probably uses some type of electric propulsion, again nothing amazing about using batteries and motors.

They haven't been revealed to the public because there has been no reason to reveal them to the public. Simple as that. They also seem to have some good camoflauge systems and/or a testbed for these technologies.
They've been seen in the US, Belgium , Australia, UK etc...NATO/US bases. Very few sighting reports elsewhere.

ch1n1t0

I agree, however, I do believe that not only the US but China, Russia and less likely UK, Germany and Australia already have such technology, be it stolen from one another or developed on its own.

Yep, you're absolutely right! This technology exists and IS being used today.

Hard to fathom "why" it still secret.




Here is the science from the European Space Agency.

The science here is 10 years old, and relatively easy to implement; it should be possible that both civilian and military machines exist.