Groom Lake October 2013

AFewGoodWomen

weavty1
Wow, whoever says that "Area 51 has relocated or is now an inactive base" clearly has no idea what the hell they're talking about...

There is TONS of new construction going on!!!

Actually...it may just be an "extension" of 29 palms...as we have soooo many troops coming back and need a larger base out there...29 palms is only a few clicks away from Groom Lake.

Not even close. Groom isn't used for that, first of all. And secondly, 29 Palms is about a couple hundred klicks away.... Lol, not "only a few clicks away"

jaspercomp
files.abovetopsecret.com...

Here's a pic that we took leaving on the Groom Lake road, near the Mailbox cutoff road, not sure what it was but it was fast!

Maybe a F-16. Not enough pixels. ;-)

weavty1

AFewGoodWomen

weavty1
Wow, whoever says that "Area 51 has relocated or is now an inactive base" clearly has no idea what the hell they're talking about...

There is TONS of new construction going on!!!

Actually...it may just be an "extension" of 29 palms...as we have soooo many troops coming back and need a larger base out there...29 palms is only a few clicks away from Groom Lake.

Not even close. Groom isn't used for that, first of all. And secondly, 29 Palms is about a couple hundred klicks away.... Lol, not "only a few clicks away"

Well if you use the secret underground bullet trains....... ;-)

Note that Groom Lake isn't for grunts. (No offense to grunts intended.) Groom Lake is a test and development facility. That said, I am really baffled why they are building soooooo far south of the main base. The first Tikaboo viewers start in April, but the ones I am thinking of don't haul a telescope to the peak. It will probably be May before we see what they are building unless Google Earth comes to the rescue.

I've done Tikaboo as late as November, i.e. after the Nellis Expo. Bring your balaclava. The interior of my tent was covered with condensation from my breathing. So you want to make sure nothing is exposed to the open air if you leave it in your tent.

Even April is too early for Tikaboo in my opinion. I've seen photos that show the peak looking like a ski resort.

I recall someone did a post on ATS about staying on Tikaboo for a full year. Well the wind has gusted to 51mph tonight. Could be tough to keep your tent on the ground under such conditions. ;-)

Tikaboo weather station data

gariac
I recall someone did a post on ATS about staying on Tikaboo for a full year. Well the wind has gusted to 51mph tonight. Could be tough to keep your tent on the ground under such conditions. ;-)

Tikaboo weather station data

Lol, that was me

Due to work and family-related constraints as of late, that's been pushed back to my bucket list, for the time being.. Lol, but soon!

weavty1

gariac
I recall someone did a post on ATS about staying on Tikaboo for a full year. Well the wind has gusted to 51mph tonight. Could be tough to keep your tent on the ground under such conditions. ;-)

Tikaboo weather station data

Lol, that was me

Due to work and family-related constraints as of late, that's been pushed back to my bucket list, for the time being.. Lol, but soon!

The good news is the BLM makes you move every two weeks, so the occupy Tikaboo for a year could be tricky. My understanding is they want to see a receipt from a merchant to prove you actually moved from the spot within two weeks. Now I suppose the schmuck that climbs Tikaboo with your food and water supply can leave you the receipt.

In one of the photos I shot later in the day, there is a thing in front of one of the hangars.
blurry thing
I'm not sure I would declare it is an airplane. The resolution is pretty poor. It does appear to be something with a tail, but it is quite small. Maybe 15ft long.

reply to post by weavty1


Couple of hundred clicks???
I don't understand.
I did a CAX out at 29 palms in 93...
We were wayyyyyyy far away from mainside...about an hour and a few more minutes...say 15 or 20.

We had to get a few things from "Neighboring" groom lake facility...(I was a supply and logistics specialist)
It didn't take too long to get there. About 45 minutes...all dirt (sand...) roads...went through two ridges to get there.

THe topo map we had for our "backyard OPs" listed Groom Lake as 5-6 clicks to the North of where our command was set up...

Of course...our CAX objective is/was classified and all...it was all about specops...I say we were Beta-testing the Iraq/Afghanistan War...or "Desert Storm Part Deux"...

...(shrugs)...maybe I wasn't actually at 29 Palms...maybe we were just told we were, who the hell knows...most of us didn't even know what our clearance was...we didn't need to know.

Damn, where the hell was I then???

If this helps...we were only about a 1000 to 1500 yrds from a runway in the middle of nowhere...jets would do touch and goes on the ridge about a two miles to the north...carpet bombing. SO AWESOME.


Wherever it was...I was given a Meritorious Mast by the Commandant for the operational supply ratio being so awesome...%98!! Yay me.

I had a blast out there...wherever "out there" was.
\
(scratches head...goes to Google Earth)

reply to post by AFewGoodWomen


Touch and go is mutually exclusive with carpet bombing. While I'm at it, just who practices carpet bombing? Such bombing is a WWII tactic. Today the goal is precision bombing.

If one iota of what you say is true, you would have seen cluster bombs in use. That the US still does. But nobody bombs from an altitude consistent with touch and goes. You need a little room for the retarder to work, else you catch your own flak.

If you don't know where you were, I question your situational awareness. ;-)

reply to post by AFewGoodWomen


29 Palms and Groom are roughly 300 miles apart.

reply to post by AFewGoodWomen


One (1) 'klick' = one (1) kilometer

gariac
While I'm at it, just who practices carpet bombing? Such bombing is a WWII tactic. Today the goal is precision bombing.

The US Air Force.

Zaphod58

gariac
While I'm at it, just who practices carpet bombing? Such bombing is a WWII tactic. Today the goal is precision bombing.

The US Air Force.

Hint: youtube videos of carpet bombing! = carpet bombing practice.

Go out to a range see how bombing practice is done. Since I have done this, I assure you it is all precision bombing. They get the target, bomb it, then do BDA.

Carpet bombing leads to collateral damage.

reply to post by gariac


And I've talked to bomber crews that as recently as under 10 years ago were still practicing carpet bombing. There are times when it will be useful, and when it will be required. And there are times when precision is required.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Be specific. Where do they practice carpet bombing? Even more entertaining, how is it scored? What is there to practice. ;-)

Think basic to all missions post Vietnam. Even freakin' Panama was precision bombed.

You fight like to train.

reply to post by gariac


And you're telling me that if you catch a group of targets in the open, in a B-52, you're going to precision bomb them and destroy them one at a time? Of course not, you're going to carpet bomb the hell out of them.

You are both correct.

A B-52 dropping its entire payload of CBU-105 (upgraded CBU-97) cluster munitions over a single target area would be considered "carpet bombing" with precision guided weapons and is a mission the B-52 crews still train for.

"With a cluster bomb like this," says Pike, "a single B-52 can destroy an entire armored division, whereas in the past you had to send out dozens of airplanes that might have to drop hundreds of bombs to achieve the same effect."

Targeting Tanks with Smart Cluster Bombs

The Sensor Fuzed Weapon [SFW] is an unpowered, top attack, wide area, cluster munition, designed to achieve multiple kills per aircraft pass against enemy armor and support vehicles.

After release, the TMD opens and dispenses the ten submunitions which are parachute stabilized. Each of the 10 BLU-108/B submunitions contains four armor-penetrating projectiles with infrared sensors to detect armored targets.

At a preset altitude sensed by a radar altimeter, a rocket motor fires to spin the submunition and initiate an ascent. The submunition then releases its four projectiles, which are lofted over the target area.

The projectile's sensors detect an infrared signature and an explosively formed penetrator fires at the heat source.

If no target is detected after a period of time, the projectiles automatically detonate (self-destruct) after a preset time interval, usually on the ground, to leave limited unexploded ordnance (UXO) on the battlefield.

CBU-97/CBU-105 Sensor Fuzed Weapon/
BLU-108/B Submunition

The B-52H carries 30 internal/external.
B-52 Stratofortress Current Upgrade Activities

gariac
reply to post by AFewGoodWomen

 

Touch and go is mutually exclusive with carpet bombing. While I'm at it, just who practices carpet bombing? Such bombing is a WWII tactic. Today the goal is precision bombing.

If one iota of what you say is true, you would have seen cluster bombs in use. That the US still does. But nobody bombs from an altitude consistent with touch and goes. You need a little room for the retarder to work, else you catch your own flak.

If you don't know where you were, I question your situational awareness. ;-)

lol...I may not have used the correct technical term...all I know is that me and a few others could sit and watch them fly pretty low and blow some crap up (old tank carcasses and the like)...we were far enough from danger...but close enough to feel the heat at times...

What you are saying about them flying too low is correct...the jets never dropped so low that it looked as if it could land...
It was a great way to end a long day in Death Valley.

I understand that Groom Lake and 29 Palms is a good ways apart from each other...
As I said...it took at least an hour of traveling dirt roads in the backside of 29 to finally reach our CAX area...from there, another 45 minutes or so to reach Groom Lake.
It could have taken longer, but it's been 20 years man!

I always suspected that our area had a lot to do with a neighboring Air Force Base...we were also working with Canadians during this exercise.

I know that when we went to mainside...it was always 29 palms..., but if you turned down another dirt road, you ended up at another base...there were LOTS of back dirt roads...they seemed endless...

So...we have death valley...an area with about 8 permenant hooches and two bathroom facilities, a rec hall quanset hut...a runway about a half mile away...the rest of our Command was CP tents and concertina wire.

As far as situational awareness...you just might be right about that, I am blonde after all>but seriously, I wouldn't at all be surprised if a lot of us weren't aware of exactly where on the map we were...
this CAX was a little off the radar. Some of us weren't even aware that we had clearance above the level we usually had...prompting me to think that there was more to this exercise than just routine run of the mill stuff.

Anyway...any insight would be great.

So, if you guys have any other tid bits to add to answer this question, I'm all ears

Zaphod58
reply to post by gariac

 

And you're telling me that if you catch a group of targets in the open, in a B-52, you're going to precision bomb them and destroy them one at a time? Of course not, you're going to carpet bomb the hell out of them.

That last video you posted was right on the money. The only thing is that it seemed like the jets were more akin to F-14's...so maybe they were doing precision...however, the ridge looked exactly the same, but I know that the narrator said it was Minot, ND???

Or, was it just that the plane was out of Minot and just bombing at another location?

All I know for sure...is that I was there. Gariac...I don't need you to believe for it to have happened.

reply to post by AFewGoodWomen


The plane was out of Minot, it was at Nellis.