German goverment warns of Windows 8

reply to post by RageAgainstFascism


Could someone explain how TPM allows the NSA to control your computer? Zee Germans may just not like MS. This seems a lot of "pile on the band wagon" type mentality that is short on facts. I thought it could be used to disable pirated software or "untrusted" software.

V

As a computer tech, I can't stand Windows 8. Microsoft always rushes out their operating systems early and then are mysteriously surprised when compatibility issues come up. I'd never use an MS operating system until the first service pack comes out. There are always tons of flaws right off the bat.

Originally posted by dlbott

Originally posted by antoinemarionette
reply to post by Ameilia

 

I didn't hear a shred of "ignorance" or "arrogance" in ManFromEurope's post.

So that's just not fair.

What he is doing is stating a series of undeniable facts that Americans need to wake up to.

Fast.

edit on 21-8-2013 by antoinemarionette because: (no reason given)

Then you are obviously not reading the same page or don't know any of us Americans. We are awake and fully

aware of what is happening

The Bot

What planet are you living on? In fact the majority of Americans are asleep to these issues and will not wake up, if ever, to what is happening until it is too late to undo it. They're too busy trying to keep their heads above water financially, feed their families, and keep a roof over their heads. Have you watched any of Jay Leno's "Jay Walking" segments. Watch a few segments and weep for the level of the average American's awareness of the world they live in.

Linux distro developers.....make your move.

/

Hey, any foreign country corp (which is NOT an enemy of my government please, gimme a break) which would like to create
a) an easily usable desktop software (one I don't gotta be a tech to figure out) to replace my Windows
b) which will run basic programs designed for windows (because it's too hard to steal mac s/w and I"m poor LOL)
c) a decently accessible international webserver farm for information (an alternative to my amazon cloudfront)

I will pay money to buy the stuff. Tons of my fellow americans would pay money for that.

Of course, how do we know that we are not merely trading the NSA, whom we hope has no reason to hate us and/or is so overwhelmed by the sheer quantity of BS they now have access to they're lucky to find anything useful in it anyway, for some other government's intrusion? I don't exactly trust Ch and NK for instance, even less than I trust my own gov't which is really saying something.

It is not acceptable and sucks, but as one of merely 300 million people, I haven't any idea what I can do about it besides stomp around, give myself stress, and not a damn thing is going to change about it anyway.

So that leaves me wondering if it's just a matter of the lesser of a few evils.

reply to post by RedCairo


The answer is very simple my friend ... The GNU license which governs Linux is a free to use , free to modify
license.
So anyone that has the ability can deconstruct the code and analyze it and/or change it suit their needs.

Ubuntu/Mint/many many others are arguably easier to use than windows and have thousands of free programs already for you to use under the same GNU license.

Give it a try

reply to post by RageAgainstFascism


And with Cisco laying off 3000 employees....

The Germans have become too numerous. We must deal with them shrewdly.

Originally posted by Silicis n Volvo
The very first mention of cloud services rung huge alarm bells inside my head and I've never used them.

why on earth would you ever want to give your data and files to someone else to hold on to?

I had exactly the same reaction the first time I heard about the cloud, but for a slightly different reason. It's bad enough to trust a huge multinational corporation with your data, but even worse, soon you will not be able to buy software. Instead, all software will be run on cloud servers, and you will connect to them as a dumb terminal. Why? because then you'll be forced to pay a monthly fee complete with 2-year contracts like the cellphone companies have.

This will be sold as a great convenience, but we all know the game.

Originally posted by ManFromEurope
The NSA/Snowden-affair WILL cost the IT-industry billions of dollars, and has already. All because foreign companies are not trusting the security of their data in the US-based cloud services anymore.

Hey, thank you, NSA.

We will save our data over here, because, you know.. your spying and copying of our companies valuable data as soon as it crosses into the USA!

And this will cost you dearly. Really, really dearly.

Maybe you people over there haven't realized it yet (NSA spying on other countries? Who cares?), but no *freaking* company in the world is trusting your cloud services anymore!

Have a nice one!

The IT Industry attempted to sell 'software as a service' in the early 2000's. It failed miserably due to the IT Industry roundly slamming the concept of giving up control of private, sensitive data.

This time around they re-coined it 'Cloud Computing' and unfortunately, it caught on. Having said that, they did primarily target younger consumers with the convenience factor which very quickly gained acceptance and inevitably crept into the workplace. (IT workers are consumers, too, after-all)

In my experience, a majority of over-35 IT workers still highly distrust cloud computing/storage/backup. But do not listen to us, we are paranoid and backwards.

As has been my mantra since the 90's : "The only safe server is the one that is turned off"

Originally posted by JameSimon

Originally posted by Thorneblood
So are we just all going to pretend that China hasn't been hacking us for years and stealing as much information as they can on almost every possible industry?

Are we gonna also pretend that the growing number of terror based hacking groups can't breach into systems and do what they want to get their message across?

I might not trust the NSA completely, but i trust them a hell of a lot more then i trust our enemies.

And here it comes... Your enemies are created by yourselves, nothing more, nothing less. Your desire to "bring democracy" to other countries has created countless wars and enemies. I weep for the americans that hate their consecutive war mongering conflict creating governments.

Says the poster that won't include his location in his basic account information.

If it weren't for us "warmongerers," half the world would be dead by now.

The little people from unimportant locations never seem able to grasp this basic fact.

Harte

reply to post by Harte


It occurs to me that this wasn't meant for me, cause frankly i totally agree.
Especially when it comes to Germany. Not only did we kick their ass, we helped free them from the very oppression that they would have enforced on many undeserving people.

Thorneblood you stated you trust the NSA more than our "enemies". I think they are one and the same.

Truly a global adversary we are facing there is no doubt.

The Germans do most things best, so methinks this is a warning that should be heeded.

reply to post by SuicideKing33


LOL Sure...

Ya know if you put Illuminati into a search engine backwards it brings up the NSA

But i still think this is blown way out of proportion....

reply to post by Thorneblood


I've heard that also but never checked myself. Odd coincidence? Who knows.

I just often wonder who is fighting who at the highest levels. No doubt everyone fighting each other for power. Do any of the world leaders truly have humanitys interests in their hearts? JFK comes to mind...MLK too. Lots of others and we all know how those end.

Originally posted by ManFromEurope
The NSA/Snowden-affair WILL cost the IT-industry billions of dollars, and has already. All because foreign companies are not trusting the security of their data in the US-based cloud services anymore.

Hey, thank you, NSA.

We will save our data over here, because, you know.. your spying and copying of our companies valuable data as soon as it crosses into the USA!

And this will cost you dearly. Really, really dearly.

Maybe you people over there haven't realized it yet (NSA spying on other countries? Who cares?), but no *freaking* company in the world is trusting your cloud services anymore!

Have a nice one!

I never trusted ANY "cloud services". ALL of them violate a basic tenet of data security - local control of data. Once it's "out there", it's fair game.

Sad that I couldn't read the article in English, because my German sucks, That second link purporting to be an English translation just took me to a mostly blank page with a single line of German at the top attempting to explain to an English speaker why it wasn't working - but explaining it in German Seems to be some sort of SNAFU, but I have no idea what kind, since again my German sucks.

This "trusted computing" concept has been around forever, and is the wet dream of control freaks every where. They gave it a nice, warm and fuzzy sounding name to lull the masses into a false sense of security that they could "trust their computers", but the actual meaning is that control freaks can trust YOU not to compute anything they don't want you to when you use such a platform. I thought the concept had been scrapped and had gone the way of the dinosaurs.

Then my mom bought a Dell sporting Windows 8.

Now, bear in mind that mom is 74 years old, not particularly tech-savvy, and wanted a computer that does what computers do, not a computer that does what cell phones do. She already had a cell phone, did not need a desktop version of one with severely truncated computer abilities.

Thus began an odyssey with Dell tech support. I wanted to simply wipe the drive and install an actual computer-functioning version of Windows, the last of which was Win7. I discovered that you can't do that, because of the TPM module. NO other version of Windows (or indeed any other operating system, such as Linux) could be installed without jumping through hoops. The computer is keyed to that specific copy of Win8 via the TPM module, and no other will boot. Not only will it not do computer things, it has a silly screen that has some lunacy called "tiles" that have no place in a computer environment, but look right at home when properly displayed on a cell phone. Not so much on a real computer. Said tiles present reams of useless information, and no computing functions. MS seems not to even have programs any more - they have "apps", which are cute little useless sub-programs - meant for CELL PHONES, rather than COMPUTERS.

The conversation with Dell tech support went like this:

Me: "I want to un-screw-up this machine. I want Windows or Linux or something on it. It's a computer, not a cell phone."

Them: "No problem. Just try Windows 8 for a while"

Me: "Have you got a cheap set of ears or something? I said 'I want to un-screw-up this machine. I want a computer OS on it, because it's a computer, not a cell phone. How do I install Windows 7 or something useful on it?"

Then: "Just try Windows 8 for a while. It will grow on you"

Me: "like a fungus? We bought a COMPUTER. It should have computer functions. Un-screw it up."

Them: "We have a free e-book instructing you in the fine point of Widows 8 to help you get used to it. We'll send that to you".

Me: "ARRRGH! CHOKE! GASP! COUGH!"

Them: "OK. All you have to do is buy a copy of Windows 7, then gut the computer so you can install it."

Me: "It's a brand new computer! I just took it out of the box! Why would I have to buy anything else to make it functional? I've already got Windows 7. Why can't I install it?"

Them: "You have to gut the computer first."

Me: "I have to gut a BRAND NEW computer to make it work?"

Them: We'll send you the e-book to help you adjust to Windows 8."

Me: "( unintelliglible string of consonants) THUMP!" as my chair falls over backwards into the floor.

Them: "The e-book is on the way. have a nice day, and let us know if we can assist you any more."

Me: "Assist me any MORE? I'll let you know if you ever assist me to begin with! How 'bout I box this beast up and send it back?"

Them: "Try Windows 8 first for a while."

*loud slamming noise as I beat the phone against the desk*

- END OF TRANSMISSION -

The upshot was that I installed 3rd party software to reinstate the start button and bypass the useless "metro" screen, and uninstalled every single "app" I could locate. Mom is still unhappy with it (she reads English, not picture-ese), and she has a brand-new computer that has to limp along on crutches.

M$ and their OEM minions are pushing Win8 hard, I suspect a far more sinister motive than embarassment at a flawed and failed OS. I suspect they intend to force "trusted computing" on an unsuspecting world via Win8 and now Win8.2. Once it's in place and prevalent, the other shoe will drop - THEY will decide what YOU can do with YOUR OWN computer. It goes so far as to be able to stop you from reading "subversive" literature (like "1984") on your OWN computer via a centrlized certificate scheme, requiring permission from another server elsewhere to open a document on YOUR computer. It isn't inconcievable that they will be able to revoke permissions to read documents that YOU wrote on YOUR OWN computer by blacklisting them on the central certificate server. Keying the OS to the TPM is just their way of trying to keep you from taking control of YOUR OWN computer by installing a functional OS.

"Computer security" is the least of your problems in this Brave New World. YOU will have no computer security AT ALL on YOUR OWN computer, but Big Brother will have all the security and control he could hope for in his wettest dream...

... and Big Brother IS watching. Will we be like Winston and "love Big Brother for the rest of his days" after our "period of adjustment"?

Go Underground. jailbrak your computer. Install Win7, or Linux, or ANYTHING other than Win8 and for God's sake, disable that TPM chip! Rip it entirely off the motherboard if you can!

Your kids will thank you later on down the road. Retake YOUR liberty - it's for the children!

If they were trying to develop a super-spy OS that they wanted everyone to use, they probably should not have created Windows 8. Most corporations won't switch to it, and it has nothing to do with security. There are just too few features worth switching for. There is little added value for Windows 8. It will increase training time, supporting it is a pain in the rear.. trying to turn your computer into a huge smart phone was a really dumb idea.

reply to post by Thorneblood

Originally posted by Thorneblood
reply to post by ColCurious

 

Oh it doesn't, it just puts us all in the same boat.

But i guess that fascism tastes better to you when its home made huh?

The difference is the U.S. is currently going where Germany was ~80 years ago (IF you U.S. Americans refuse to learn from history).

And yes, we are all in the same boat, because the NSA has grown to a monster many times over what the Gestapo ever was.

Originally posted by Elliot
It will be interesting to see if a completely new 'operating system' is brought in by various countries and the internet will become basically fragmented finally.....as was always inevitable. It was always going to be the case the countries would have to use their own internet to protect themselves from others snooping so perhaps it will all operate on two levels in the future.

edit on 21-8-2013 by Elliot because: spelling

"Red Flag Linux" is a Linux distro put out by the Chinese government. I used to have a copy, but it got stolen from me. When I went to recently replace it, I discovered that I couldn't seem to download it any more, even though it was still "there", Hmmmm...

Before people go all nationalistic and "them and us" on me over the supposed "enemy" potentially building a back door into my operating system, I tell you this plainly: I have less to worry about from Chinese surveillance of my internet activities than I do from the Surveillance State I already live in. I don't have to live with the Chinese government, and I'm pretty sure they already don't care about my political views on the US government. The guys in my own back yard, however, are a different matter...