Woman Denied US Citizenship Because of Atheism

To the both of ya: I clearly explained myself in the very post you quoted. Maybe read it again??

reply to post by windword


I think that if she has no recourse and the situation is as stated it is falls to the Government and then to the US citizens to see it corrected. Even more than the lady as to solve her particular case...

reply to post by JayinAR

You gonna watch the video? Or not?
It's only 4 minutes and ticks, for crying out loud, Mister "Been on both sides".

It's just a video.

Your initial post, as I recall was "Reer fffft fffft" to me. Or at least that's the one I'm responding to. You said that atheists don't give a crap about how other people feel. Then you said that you and your wife argue over whether the kids should be indoctrinated or not. You're on the fence.

Just watch the video, please.

If she declared herself a satanist, which is religious, would she have gotten USA citizenship, or is the law only against atheism? What if she said she believed in aliens, would she have gotten USA citizenship? What if she said she believed in unicorns and centaurs, what then?

What #ing difference does it make what one believes in? I thought USA was a secular country!

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by windword

 

This is silly. She can just define her version of "take up arms" as meaning exactly what she said (agreeing to be in service and support defense). So, right off the bat, she's going to waste people's time (and no doubt government money) with this issue? I say fine, we don't need her. Citizenship denied.

Taking a stand is one thing. Jeopardizing your future over semantics is quite another. Get over yourself lady. I don't agree with the "Under God" part of the Pledge either, but I'm not going to get my knickers in a bunch over it either.

Are you of the opinion that the "inalienable rights" of an American citizen shouldn't be extended to a would be citizen? This issue wasn't "silly" when an American took his atheistic conscientious objections to the Supreme Court and won.

reply to post by wildtimes


She isn't my wife and I think I will pass on the video. Thanks anyways.

reply to post by JayinAR

to "save" people from a situation they do not want to be saved from

How do you know that? what if they were only told one side... a closed mind version of the religion.

"We are truth, others are false"

Of course they would fear the other side, they have been brainwashed from birth to obey something....people learning the truth will most likely lose a religion's subscription, like what is happening in the past 30-40 years.

If it were for the few that started coming out, Atheist would still be put in jail for their "evil exposing the truth and stuff".

To tell the truth, my parents still take offense to me saying i'm an atheist. my mom told me in the past "not to tell that to anyone"....

reply to post by windword


The constitution should protect anyone in the states. Citizens or not. I am not sure if this is a constotutional issue though. If it is she can appeal it and win.

Originally posted by Hushabye
She was denied because she's anti-war. She could be a catholic priest and would have been denied, if she doesn't support the U.S. war machine.

edit on 16-6-2013 by Hushabye because: (no reason given)

She should have just lied, like everyone else. ;o)

reply to post by wildtimes


If I were a little more petty I would quote each time you have said "I know what I am talking about" and the book suggestions and stuff.

You may not like my opinions, but I am entitled to them. That is something the atheist crusade will not take away.

It amazes me how you go from agreeing with my initial point to attacking my character and somehow my PARENTING because of it???

Sheesh

reply to post by luciddream


Are you suggesting that there are actually people who are born and live their lives without ever hearing other points of view regarding religion?

If someone is that naive they have bigger problems than mommy and daddy's influence.

reply to post by DarthMuerte


No. Plenty of the rank and file were Christians of one stripe or another.

Most of the people smart enough to participate in the Constitutional convention were less enthusiastic about the Church, as is evidenced by pretty much everything they ever wrote on the subject. Including the Bill of Rights (and subsequent Jeffersonian letters), for example.

The problem is plenty of religious folk don't care what the framers intended. Like the Book of Leviticus, they use what props their own argument and disavow the rest. This isn't a Constitutional issue, per se, rather -- it is a "most human's are hateful morons" issue; religious and non-religious alike.

Wowzers. That's ridiculous. Morality only matters when it comes from organized religion, eh? Not surprising to be honest. I have always believed that morality is what matters the most, regardless of where you place your faith. The land of the free.. Sure thing. Funny how people are penalized for not compromising their morality.

reply to post by JayinAR


When I first started posting on ATS, I was in a thread attempting to use a modern pathologists report to prove the gruesomeness of death of Jesus. I don't know why Christian like to obsess over such things. But I posted my opinion that Jesus, in fact, didn't die on the cross but survived.

I was amazed at how many people replied in horror, as though that thought had never been presented to them. So, yes, many Christians go through life never having their beliefs challenged. But, they're probably not on ATS!

reply to post by Barcs


I honestly see this as more of a legal issue than a philosophical one. The Government has a vested interest in making it as difficult as possible to claim conscientious objection. Personally I feel that if we have a voluntary military, you should be able to quit for any reason you deem fit, but I knw they don't see it that way.

If that were the case they wouldn't have a war machine anymore.

Originally posted by sylvie

Originally posted by Hushabye
She was denied because she's anti-war. She could be a catholic priest and would have been denied, if she doesn't support the U.S. war machine.

edit on 16-6-2013 by Hushabye because: (no reason given)

She should have just lied, like everyone else. ;o)

You shouldn't have to lie about your support for religion and the military to gain USA citizenship. Its a well known fact that USA and Israel are right wing orientated and that the right wing supports both of the aforementioned.

Its tragic that people have to lie about their beliefs to gain USA citizenship.

On other hand if you are mexican and want a job at mcdonalds you can always cross the border ILLEGALLY and not contribute a dime to unemployment, social security, disability programs. You can also STEAL the jobs from the american high school dropouts who apparently deserve to die from starvation, and then have the hypocritical right wingers claim everyon is a welfare scumbag.

Its hard to get in legally, but really easy to get in illegally! Double whammy.

Not sure why this is even a big deal...Loads of people are denied citizenship for varying reasons....

This thread title is VERY VERY misleading. She's not being denied because of her atheism...She's being denied because of her moral objection to "support" the country.

You think that's unfair? How about individuals with great moral character, no criminal background, ARE eligible, have no quarrels with signing for selective service, but can't demonstrate a proficiency in English.....these people get denied all the time...don't see a big fuss about that....

A2D

(You think it's bad? Did you know there are now conscientious objection clauses for health care which allow health care providers to deny service based on their own "moral objections"? This can range from abortions to birth control to refusing to service a patient with AIDS....)

reply to post by windword


I think the problem they have with her is that she is not willing to fight for her country if crap hit the fan. If our country came under attack you kinda need to stand up for it if you are the only one there to fight and no one there to support. what is she going to do when the enemy comes her way and she is the only one there to encounter them?? is she going to give them directions since she won't fight them? chances are they would off her simply by association.

I think they can try to give her a by if it would be infringing on her religious beliefs but since she has no religious beliefs then it means she just isn't loyal to the country as it is expected of her.

Your title is misleading and false. The problem they have with her is that she will not fight for her country, had she said yes she would be a citizen already

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by JayinAR

 

When I first started posting on ATS, I was in a thread attempting to use a modern pathologists report to prove the gruesomeness of death of Jesus. I don't know why Christian like to obsess over such things. But I posted my opinion that Jesus, in fact, didn't die on the cross but survived.

I was amazed at how many people replied in horror, as though that thought had never been presented to them. So, yes, many Christians go through life never having their beliefs challenged. But, they're probably not on ATS!

You are not supposed to obsess over the the death of Christ you are supposed to "obsess" over him bridging the gap between God and man. YOu are supposed to "obsess" over how he lived his life and his teachings not his death.

If you are talking about roman catholics then I lawl cuz those guys are completely off their rocker and have perverting christianity as soon as they were able to take control of it with the so called head of the church the POPE.. there is only one head of the church and it is a not a man that is ordained the Pope.

if you see what the roman catholic church does it has nothing to do with the message of Christ. Heck most churches espeically the pentecostal ones are way off their rocker.

they focus on everything but the point of Christianity in the new testament.. which is what leads them astray and perverts christianity