Feeling negative? Look at the opposite side...

Feeling hateful? You are learning about love.
Feeling fear? You are learning about courage.
Feeling weak? You are learning about strength.
Feeling powerless? You are learning about power.
Feeling hopeless? You are leaning about hope.
Feeling sad? You are learning about joy.
Feeling pain? You are learning about pleasure and ease.
Treated unfairly? You are learning about justice.

I think you got the point.

The point is, you are a soul incarnating a human body for learning purposes.

You have to learn values and virtues and you have to live their opposite to really know what it is.

So, never forget this method while going through hard times: recognize and identify the negative feeling, value or virtue at stake, and focus on learning its opposite.

It will make you stronger, wiser, better, its the right thing to do with adversity, learn and move on.

Love u all

reply to post by Manula

Thanks, but it wasn't terribly reassuring.

In fact, I feel just as bad now as I did before I read it.

reply to post by Manula

Feeling hateful? You are learning about love.
Feeling fear? You are learning about courage.
Feeling weak? You are learning about strength.
Feeling powerless? You are learning about power.
Feeling hopeless? You are leaning about hope.
Feeling sad? You are learning about joy.
Feeling pain? You are learning about pleasure and ease.
Treated unfairly? You are learning about justice.

Nice list though... I don't agree with all your avenues of approach.

Hate? Most people will go through an entire lifetime and never know true love. True hate is just as rare.
Fear? This is something that attacks people who don't have faith in their own abilities to defend or in how their life will someday end.
Sad? I had to give away a 12 year old Aussie Shepherd to the local Humane Society that was my late Mom's dog. Their facility was full and she is likely already dead. I loved that old dog... sadness followed.

People deal with this stuff on individual levels. There is no single user's manual to life that I am aware of. I respect your approach and I like some of your outbound remedies but... don't expect that every person can find solice and sleep by way of the same tollroad.

Just a few thoughts.

reply to post by Manula




just some model builder humor...

great advice you got here man, thanks!

Originally posted by redoubt
reply to post by Manula

 

Feeling hateful? You are learning about love.
Feeling fear? You are learning about courage.
Feeling weak? You are learning about strength.
Feeling powerless? You are learning about power.
Feeling hopeless? You are leaning about hope.
Feeling sad? You are learning about joy.
Feeling pain? You are learning about pleasure and ease.
Treated unfairly? You are learning about justice.

Nice list though... I don't agree with all your avenues of approach.

Hate? Most people will go through an entire lifetime and never know true love. True hate is just as rare.
Fear? This is something that attacks people who don't have faith in their own abilities to defend or in how their life will someday end.
Sad? I had to give away a 12 year old Aussie Shepherd to the local Humane Society that was my late Mom's dog. Their facility was full and she is likely already dead. I loved that old dog... sadness followed.

People deal with this stuff on individual levels. There is no single user's manual to life that I am aware of. I respect your approach and I like some of your outbound remedies but... don't expect that every person can find solice and sleep by way of the same tollroad.

Just a few thoughts.

I share what works for me, i cant do nothing more.

This means nothing. Those are just words. You are wrong to try and make people think that words can fix or change any serious pain. You have obviously no experience.

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by Manula

 

Thanks, but it wasn't terribly reassuring.

In fact, I feel just as bad now as I did before I read it.

Hey this is just some thoughts, if you are feeling bad, explore it, why are you feeling that way? What event is making you have negative thoughts and negative feelings? Explore it, and erradicate it from your mind.

Originally posted by Jefferton
This means nothing. Those are just words. You are wrong to try and make people think that words can fix or change any serious pain. You have obviously no experience.

I have a lot of experience. Psychological suffering comes from your thoughts and beliefs, reality is just a catalyst, its your automatic negative thought/beliefs/reaction that creates bad feelings. The event is not to blame, you are.

Physical pain can be imposed, suffering is optional.

Originally posted by Manula

Originally posted by Jefferton
This means nothing. Those are just words. You are wrong to try and make people think that words can fix or change any serious pain. You have obviously no experience.

I have a lot of experience. Psychological suffering comes from your thoughts and beliefs, reality is just a catalyst, its your automatic negative thought/beliefs/reaction that creates bad feelings. The event is not to blame, you are.

Physical pain can be imposed, suffering is optional.

edit on 10-6-2013 by Manula because: (no reason given)

More empty talk. People like you are why so many others are taken advantage of.

reply to post by Manula

Physical pain can be imposed, suffering is optional.

I disagree with this.

Yes, physical pain can be inflicted. But sorrow, sadness, loss, and depression are not "optional".

When a truly loved one dies (a child of yours, a spouse, a parent, a close friend) the grieving process is not optional. If you truly loved them, then you will grieve, no questions about it.

Those who don't grieve for the dead are those who weren't necessarily emotionally involved with them.


~ Wandering Scribe

reply to post by Wandering Scribe

What a silly argument. You disagree with the notion that suffering is optional, but then you pose the example of, basically, someone who is attached to someone will suffer. It's true that someone who is attached to someone else will inevitably suffer, but that doesn't mean suffering isn't optional. All you have to do is not be attached to that person.

In addition, true love does not mean you have to become attached and then get sad when they die. That's not part of love, that comes from not fully accepting that all things are impermanent, having unrealistic expectations, and wanting to control everything.

I know some love, ye I'm not able to be mad for long, that prevents me I ever felt hate.
Fear is overrated as it's just a chemical reaction what causes it, after you take a stand you can overcome fears.
Courage mostly is because you don't see the risk you take as serious as you should.
Weak isn't feeling it's a lack of confidence that holds you down when you could easily stand strong.
Power is one I don't like, it causes you to over rate personal trades above others. not have any possible hope you can change a thing is disappointing and leaves open a few emotions that will replace your lack of hope for a while.
joy is great and even the most tiny cause will have it made. sadness however isn't the opposite of joy., although yoy will fel more appreciated because makes joy even feel better then without sadness as amplifier.
Pleasure makes you understand that you something you like. Ease is about you don't be effected by negative emotions it can make you feel the positive ones as reward.
Pain is a sign, an alert something is wrong, and is should be blocking most feelings that cause you to make the pain go away.
Justice isn't fair for any one, it's an agreement to get the same rights as others. with the ideas that are shared most.
Fair is to personal to get a box that prevents it to shift place for the need of another.

My 2 cents

Luckily positive is natural fo me caus feeling negative has been something I only recently experienced. It sucks bu t lights up the good things and make them feel even better.

reply to post by Manula


Yes, everything is always giving to everything else.

Trees give us oxygen to survive, and we give trees carbon dioxide to survive.

If someone is taking from you then it is teaching compassion - not to be that way towards others.

reply to post by Damsel


The attachment is optional, not the suffering. If you are truly attached to somebody in body, mind, and soul, then you will suffer at their loss. If you don't suffer at the loss of a loved one, then you are not really as attached as you think.


~ Wandering Scribe

Originally posted by Wandering Scribe
reply to post by Damsel

 

The attachment is optional, not the suffering. If you are truly attached to somebody in body, mind, and soul, then you will suffer at their loss. If you don't suffer at the loss of a loved one, then you are not really as attached as you think.


~ Wandering Scribe

You're not making sense. It's true that if you don't suffer at the loss of a loved one, then you must not be attached, but you just said that only the attachment is optional; not the suffering. How can one not suffer if it isn't optional?

reply to post by Damsel


It makes perfect sense.

You can choose whether or not you will attach yourself to someone/something. But, as soon as you do form an attachment suffering over the loss of that special person/thing is no longer optional.

If you want to get technical, then yes, suffering is entirely optional if you never, ever make connections to anything in all of existence.

As human beings though, that option is not feasible.

We all form attachments to something. Whether it's to people, places, pets, foods, beliefs, art, or something else doesn't matter. Humans are feeling beings, and as beings with feelings we cannot abstain from attachment.

Attachment to parents
Attachment to siblings
Attachment to significant other
Attachment to spouse
Attachment to pet
Attachment to political ideal
Attachment to spiritual belief
Attachment to favorite foods
Attachment to music
Attachment to movies
Attachment to a painting

We all form attachments to something.

If your favorite musician dies, you'd feel some kind of regret at their no longer being able to create. If your spouse dies there's a whole host of grieving stages which accompany it. If you really crave a particular food but have to settle for something you dislike, there's a certain irritability which comes. If a politician who opposes your political ideal passes a law you disagree with, there's a reaction which accompanies it.

That being so, suffering is not optional; only choosing what we attach ourselves to is.

Hope that makes my stance a little bit clearer.


~ Wandering Scribe

reply to post by Wandering Scribe

I think it's a huge mistake to say it's not feasible to abstain from attachment. It certainly isn't easy to do, but it's not impossible, and I think it's something people should strive for.

Originally posted by Wandering Scribe
reply to post by Damsel

 

It makes perfect sense.

You can choose whether or not you will attach yourself to someone/something. But, as soon as you do form an attachment suffering over the loss of that special person/thing is no longer optional.

If you want to get technical, then yes, suffering is entirely optional if you never, ever make connections to anything in all of existence.

As human beings though, that option is not feasible.

We all form attachments to something. Whether it's to people, places, pets, foods, beliefs, art, or something else doesn't matter. Humans are feeling beings, and as beings with feelings we cannot abstain from attachment.

Attachment to parents
Attachment to siblings
Attachment to significant other
Attachment to spouse
Attachment to pet
Attachment to political ideal
Attachment to spiritual belief
Attachment to favorite foods
Attachment to music
Attachment to movies
Attachment to a painting

We all form attachments to something.

If your favorite musician dies, you'd feel some kind of regret at their no longer being able to create. If your spouse dies there's a whole host of grieving stages which accompany it. If you really crave a particular food but have to settle for something you dislike, there's a certain irritability which comes. If a politician who opposes your political ideal passes a law you disagree with, there's a reaction which accompanies it.

That being so, suffering is not optional; only choosing what we attach ourselves to is.

Hope that makes my stance a little bit clearer.


~ Wandering Scribe

We have to learn to care, cherish and love without too much attachment. But we can attach if we are able to detach when we have too.

People never die even our pets are eternal.
We have souls and we are together on the other side.
I believe in eternal life so i don't mind attaching to people and pets because i believe we don't die, we just change forms (we loose our physical body, always keeping our soul body alive).

But if we learn to detach we can attach. The problem is attachment without the ability to detach at the right time.

Of course, we will suffer during the process of detachment but its temporary and we consent it, its self-consented, so its not a big problem.

When i say suffering is optional, i don't mean in absolute terms, some suffering is natural, but we can manage it, we allow it to suffer as long as we can control it..

reply to post by Damsel

I think it's a huge mistake to say it's not feasible to abstain from attachment. It certainly isn't easy to do, but it's not impossible, and I think it's something people should strive for.

The problem with that is that it is a slippery slope. Abstaining from forming any kind of attachment includes abstaining from morals, values, and ethics. You form attachments to these things as well.

If everyone strove to be completely detached from everything, then parents would not raise children, teachers would not educate students, employees would not go to work, doctors would not provide remedies for ailments, and so on.

I have no problem with the Buddhist ideal of removing yourself from the chain of dependent origination. I don't even mind if you try to understand that both pleasure and pain are temporary and should not be a stone in the mind.

But to completely detach from all attachments is something I cannot agree with.


~ Wandering Scribe

reply to post by Manula

We have to learn to care, cherish and love without too much attachment. But we can attach if we are able to detach when we have too...(removed quoted material which is irrelevant to reply)...But if we learn to detach we can attach. The problem is attachment without the ability to detach at the right time.

I was going to use an example of real loss from my life, but decided not to reveal such personal information about myself on here (as the ATS guidelines suggest). So, my question(s) for you would be:

01. Is conditional love, loving only to a certain extent, and then no more --- what you call "learning to love without too much attachment" --- real love? If you set boundaries on what you're willing to feel, endure, or reciprocate with somebody, are you really loving them?

02. Who decides when it is the "right time" to detach? When you lose someone, do you detach immediately? A week? After the wake? A year later? How do you decide?


~ Wandering Scribe