Practically Perpetual motion machine via Superfluid helium fountain waterwheel

pretty well explained my thoughts by the thread title,

surfing youtube i stumbled upon this video in which they speak about the mysterious properties of superfluid helium which occurs 2 degrees above 0 kelvin, so 2 kelvin.

look at the portion 1:29 in



www.youtube.com...

they explain that due to it's zero viscosity it is able to produce an endless fountain as it fountains itself up and out it falls back into its own pool never ending,

so put a water wheel in it, what more do you need, endless energy right there,

as the details in the vid say this can only be maintained so long as it is kept at sub-lambda point temperature,

so is this realy the only challenge to endless energy? is mastering how to maintain such a precise temperature? small burden to overcome for a world without an electricity bill

The amount of energy needed to keep it @ that temp is more than it could produce.

Now in outerspace you might be on to something but it would just float off into deep space.

reply to post by pryingopen3rdeye

Not exactly. Endless as long as the helium stays liquid...at 2.2ºK (that is very very cold).

It's not really free to produce liquid helium.

Absolute zero (or 0 degrees Kelvin) is not the same as 0 degrees Celsius. 0 degrees Kelvin is approximately -273 degrees Celsius. To maintain that temperature would require more energy than would be produced.

Originally posted by pryingopen3rdeye
pretty well explained my thoughts by the thread title,

surfing youtube i stumbled upon this video in which they speak about the mysterious properties of superfluid helium which occurs 2 degrees above 0 celsius, so 2 celsius.

Actually the Lambda point is the sort of cold that you'd get really really chilly in no time, and boy it'd be really really cold there with you.

Absolute Zero is

defined as 0K on the Kelvin scale and as −273.15° on the Celsius scale. This equates to −459.67° on the Fahrenheit scale.

The Lambda point is 2.17K So it's about -270/1C.

2 degrees above Celsius might make for a nice lemonade though!!

Perpetual motion is impossible.

reply to post by SWCCFAN


it would float away into deep space? then why havent our satelites done the same? the ISS? everything we seem capable of keeping in place in space are somehow different?

reply to post by SpearMint


oh thank you for your well thought out scientific and logical critique,

100 years ago flight was impossible......

get out of your box

reply to post by winofiend


ya its true i said celsius when i meant kelvin apologies for that mistype, will try and edit that out now

edit - success


yes it would be electricaly taxing to maintain such a cold temperature, and as someone mention a bit easier in space, but perhaps if scaled up enough the build up of energy accumulated from such a device could eventualy overcome that limit,

only some real calculations could tell if this is so

Originally posted by pryingopen3rdeye
reply to post by SpearMint

 

oh thank you for your well thought out scientific and logical critique,

100 years ago flight was impossible......

get out of your box

No, 100 years ago flight was possible, 1 million years ago flight was possible, but we hadn't harnessed it.

Perpetual motion is impossible due to the laws of physics, more specifically, it violates the first and second laws of thermodynamics.

Don't be a smart ass.

reply to post by SWCCFAN


Its called orbit man, you know satellites don't just float off into deep space right?

Phage- I can hardly ever think of any flaw in any of your thinking, despite my best efforts, your mind is a work of art. We capture helium and condense it into liquid all the time here on earth, it isn't that hard to get it.

Do you think it would work more efficiently if say, I had the liquid tanks at a high altitude, say 7K up, like on Everest? Where nature would do the work, or maybe antarctica? So that once the liquid helium was had, we might be able to keep it cold perpetually without add energy?

reply to post by SWCCFAN


Its called orbit man, you know satellites don't just float off into deep space right?

Phage- I can hardly ever think of any flaw in any of your thinking, despite my best efforts, your mind is a work of art. We capture helium and condense it into liquid all the time here on earth, it isn't that hard to get it.

Do you think it would work more efficiently if say, I had the liquid tanks on an orbital station?

reply to post by SpearMint


im pretty sure i can be a smart ass all i want, dont use insults like you just did, that much isnt permitted by the T&C of the site,

ALL scientiste of the time 100 years ago said flight was impossible, just the same as they say perpetual motion is impossible today,

the laws of physics have been broken many times already, they are only laws to the mind that accepts them as so,

quantum mechanics have already trumped them, so they continue even today to find away to tie them together without confliction and still struggle to do so

dont just assume something is impossible becuase you are told so, think outside the box, think beyond what your told are the limits of possibility, without that effort we never would have taken flight back then, it was that exact thinking that motivated them to try flight, and they did succeed in flight

whats more we do not need to specify perpetual in a literal sense (wich is all that is claimed impossible) when only a practical sense will do.

magnets as example, they do not contain an endless amount of push, but their life spans far surpass your own so they 'practicaly' do

Originally posted by pryingopen3rdeye
100 years ago flight was impossible......

So no birds were flying more than 100 years ago....

!00 years ago man had been flying heavier than air aircraft for 9 years......

Originally posted by pryingopen3rdeye
reply to post by SpearMint

 

im pretty sure i can be a smart ass all i want, dont use insults like you just did, that much isnt permitted by the T&C of the site,

ALL scientiste of the time 100 years ago said flight was impossible, just the same as they say perpetual motion is impossible today,

the laws of physics have been broken many times already, they are only laws to the mind that accepts them as so,

quantum mechanics have already trumped them, so they continue even today to find away to tie them together without confliction and still struggle to do so

dont just assume something is impossible becuase you are told so, think outside the box, think beyond what your told are the limits of possibility, without that effort we never would have taken flight back then, it was that exact thinking that motivated them to try flight, and they did succeed in flight

We have never thought flight was impossible, because other species can fly, it was just a matter of how we can achieve it, and the Wright brothers figured it out. I don't think you quite understand these laws, perpetual motion is clearly impossible, it cannot exist. Also, If you are insulted by phrases like "smart ass" then you need to get a grip, quite right you can be a smart ass all you want, but it doesn't make you right.

Perpetual motion is perpetual motion, I don't know what you mean by a "practical sense", if it's not literally perpetual motion, then it isn't perpetual motion.

As the above poster pointed out, the first flight was 109 years ago, in 1903.

reply to post by SpearMint


If the history of science has taught man anything, ikt is that nothing is impossible, just improbable. If we just assume things are not possible and don't try, we would still be rubbing sticks together to make fire, and walking everywhere.

Its a fact!

Originally posted by spoor

Originally posted by pryingopen3rdeye
100 years ago flight was impossible......

So no birds were flying more than 100 years ago....

!00 years ago man had been flying heavier than air aircraft for 9 years......

so my off the top of my head estimate was off by less then a decade hardly a point worth argueing, and ya birds have had flight, i need to specify man made flight? thought a typical brain could easily interpret that properly, guess not,

reply to post by SpearMint


see this link in regards to the arguement that flight was deemed impossible by scientists before the wright brothers did it, perfect place for your arguement, not this thread

forums.randi.org...

and if you dont know what "practically" means as you stated, then google it

reply to post by SpearMint

The second law of thermodynamics is - entripy. Just because a ordered state seeks a more chaotic state, or everything rusts in short, how does that violate the second law?

reply to post by inverslyproportional


not all of our man made objects in space are in orbit, yet they do not float away, their positions are maintained, yes it costs energy to do so, but this is a dicussion about a theoretical device to produce energy.

also why not put this one into orbit anyway, the temperature couldnt be that drasticly different, should still achieve the aim of keeping some of earths heat off of it.