All the Preaching on ATS

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by signalfire
Anyone who tells you you're going to hell is automatically going to hell. Isn't there something about that in the bible? In the 'he who is without sin' department?

You're judging me right now. You're a hypocrite, at least Christians are honest about it.

We're to use the 'entire council of God", single verse theology is absurd. One could legitimately take Matthew 7:1 and couple it with Luke 12:19 and come away with alcoholism using that method.

The most misquoted verse in the Bible is probably Matthew 7:1, "Judge not that ye be not judged." We hear this verse multiple times a day. At Troy State University in Alabama, a professor we met even said that it was one of the Ten Commandments. Too often we have heard sincere, misinformed Christians and unbelievers alike say, "I don’t want to judge anybody, but..." Ironically, the one who screams "judge not" is often the one passing judgment on you!

Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged.

edit on 7-4-2012 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)

The verse is actually: Matthew 7

1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured unto you.

Or as I have heard it before- Judge not lest you be judged in kind.

In other words (as a confirmed catholic) you are being disingenuous by not including the whole quote.
It is not for any of us mortals to pass judgment on any other being alive at this time, unless you prefer to have a harsher judgment heaped upon you when you reach the gates of heaven. To possibly be rejected.
Christ, it is reported (in the bible), was a supporter of the lower classes, and even the non believers to be accepted into heaven if they lived a righteous life. Going so far as to grant the kingdom of heaven to the thief strung up on the crucifix next to him, moments before he died.

www.biblegateway.com...

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by mileysubet

 

Here is that quote:

"If sinners will be damned, at least let them leap over our bodies. And if they will perish, let them perish with our arms about their knees, imploring them to stay. If Hell must be filled, at least let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go there unwarned and unprayed for."

Charles Haddon Spurgeon, "The Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit", Volume VII, pg. 11.

The problem with that quote is:

I am not a sinner, primarily because I was raised out side of religion and secondly because I don't believe in your god therefore even if I did "sin" my sin would not be within your definition of sin.

I will not pass with my "arms about their knees" and sense there is no god no one will "implore me to stay"

Fill your teeth if you must, but be warned that the meal will be empty.

reply to post by mileysubet


The only way to engage in debate with scripture quotes, is to quote scripture. It's really not that hard.
With respect, quote it if you want to debate it. Most that do quote it only know the talking points, and not the message. Sad what organized religion has degraded to.

Originally posted by randomtangentsrme
reply to post by mileysubet

 

The only way to engage in debate with scripture quotes, is to quote scripture. It's really not that hard.
With respect, quote it if you want to debate it. Most that do quote it only know the talking points, and not the message. Sad what organized religion has degraded to.

The only "scripture" I will will quote or base my life on is the history of my life or those life's around me. I did not live several thousand years ago and the person quoting so said scripture did not either. I do not believe Grimms fairy tails are factual so why should any one think a tale told by mortals about an immortal omnipresent god several thousand years ago would and any more accurate?

I have never and will never quote a mortal on topics that they can not and have not been heard by a living person in our time. Is it too much to ask of an all powerful god for more detail in our age to clarify his stance on our existence.

reply to post by mileysubet


Have you asked the Christ to come into your life and heart. To give you an indication of the 'what is' in regards to the Truth of our reality?

Seek and you just may find beliefs changing.

Originally posted by mileysubet

Originally posted by randomtangentsrme
reply to post by mileysubet

 

The only way to engage in debate with scripture quotes, is to quote scripture. It's really not that hard.
With respect, quote it if you want to debate it. Most that do quote it only know the talking points, and not the message. Sad what organized religion has degraded to.

The only "scripture" I will will quote or base my life on is the history of my life or those life's around me. I did not live several thousand years ago and the person quoting so said scripture did not either. I do not believe Grimms fairy tails are factual so why should any one think a tale told by mortals about an immortal omnipresent god several thousand years ago would and any more accurate?

I have never and will never quote a mortal on topics that they can not and have not been heard by a living person in our time. Is it too much to ask of an all powerful god for more detail in our age to clarify his stance on our existence.

Amen to your first. Agreed, my personal bible is the ultimate Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy. To put it a different way, as my best friend says, know your enemy.
Or to quote sun Tzu, in one of many translations: "If you know the enemy and know yourself you need not fear the results of a hundred battles."
www.brainyquote.com...

It is not to much to ask. It is to much to ask for Christians to provide, unfortunately.

BTW I find more truth in Aesop's fables than the bible

reply to post by jaxnmarko

Don't fret too much about man made religion. It is a shame that the truth or mystery of spirituality is perverted and corrupted by organized religion these days. All of us have an antenna to heaven as it were and we need to learn to trust that. The search for the kingdom within? When others preach to us about religion and hell, try and learn to disregard that. Like you said, don't judge...

Also know it is our "job" as it were to learn how to find the truth that the early church found. I mean they didn't have the Bible right? So how did they get the wisdom to live it? That is the key.

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet
If you say I am going to to hell..can I at least get a good spanking before I go?

Ho i see your here to do the same thing

Typical detract and derail
Talk about shooting yourself in the foot and having the other one in your mouth

Just my Nickel worth

If only I was that flexible.

Ho yes you sure are showing us the lack of flexibility in mind and body
I can’t prove it either but you’re doing a fine job yourself

Just my Nickel Worth
Remember we drop using penny here

Yes oh enlighted one, choosing not to live by the words of a book makes him so close minded...

reply to post by jaxnmarko

Let me suggest the real reason why you are noticing more religious threads.

Until about eighteen months ago, there was no "Recent posts" page on what was then the BelowTopSecret section of ATS. If people posted threads in the "Religion and Theology" sub-forum, you would not come across them unless you deliberately entered that forum and knew what you were letting yourself in for.

Now we have the "Off Topic" section, with a "Recent Posts" page. So when you enter that section and your eye runs down the page, you will, of course, come across any religious threads that happen to be going. If you dislike them you will be more likely to notice them.

There you are then; not a "shift towards religion" at all, but a simple change in the page structure of ATS.

As long as "preaching" threads are in the sub-forum which invites people to "share your own faith-experiences", they are in exactly the right place.

I am truly sick of preaching
As a personal conclusion I have come to..
I do not believe in the OT, for most of it is metaphor.
NT was written by powerhungry white men.
I believe in Jesus's teaching..
Meaning I see insight in mysticism, gnosticism and lost books of the bible that refer to his miracles in a realistic way that does not allign with mainstream belief..
I question... and find answers through seeing everyone's persective...
Not just trying to prove your own perspective is correct.

God is what we imagine, until we know what it is.
Do not judge because you know you are no better.

I learn every day, from every one....
I am not afraid of being wrong, and changing my beliefs or perspective...
You do not have to hold onto one idea forever...
We all go through ebbs and flows?
We go through growth and changes...
Does your perspective on the universe around you not change at all?
I think my spiritual journey is ongoing and everchanging, and I think it is beautiful.
I have never felt so divine in my life. I feel very connected to the source the more open I am to every possibility...
Because as far as us mere humans are concerned, we will never know (:

reply to post by PrincessofSwords

I am truly sick of preaching

My suggestion is to not enter the forum specifically designed for this and named as such. I've been truly sick of the political debates and haven't frequented those forums in years. Your frustration is in not being able to convince any of us because of weak arguments, not the fact you chose to enter a forum dedicated to this debate.

Originally posted by jesiaha

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet
If you say I am going to to hell..can I at least get a good spanking before I go?

Ho i see your here to do the same thing

Typical detract and derail
Talk about shooting yourself in the foot and having the other one in your mouth

Just my Nickel worth

If only I was that flexible.

Ho yes you sure are showing us the lack of flexibility in mind and body
I can’t prove it either but you’re doing a fine job yourself

Just my Nickel Worth
Remember we drop using penny here

Yes oh enlighted one, choosing not to live by the words of a book makes him so close minded...

Everyone chooses to live by the words of some book. Your schooling was based upon books.

Moot point.

reply to post by mileysubet

The problem with that quote is:

I am not a sinner

Not true, your drivers license doesn't read "Lord Jesus Christ". We're all sinners, myself included, the only difference is some are repentant and others are unrepentant.

But we''re all sinners.

Fill your teeth if you must, but be warned that the meal will be empty.

Isn't that the damn truth if I've ever heard one, been starving for years!!!

reply to post by randomtangentsrme

The verse is actually: Matthew 7

1. I'm not a Catholic.
2. I know it's Matthew 7, that's why I said Matthew 7:1.

you are being disingenuous by not including the whole quote.

Thank you for proving my point of the absurdity of "single verse" theology!!!

Context FTW!!!

90% of ATS is people "preaching" their opinions on various topics. Why would you expect the religious forums to be any different?

reply to post by jaxnmarko


Funny, in all the posts i read in the religion section, very few if any have blatantly told people theyre going to hell. I don't think there's any southern baptists on this site at all.

Generally someone makes a case for what they believe, and some asshat that doesn't even believe in anything (secular folks), come and troll because they delight in it and thats all they are is trolls. When i was agnostic i didn't know and couldn't care less if there was a such a thing as a YHWH or Yeshua, or a Shiva or Zeus and i would steer clear of anything to do with religion attached to it, i wouldn't go running into a religion forum and make fun of people for believing in the invisible man in the sky because i really didn't care.

A real atheist, wouldn't set foot in a religion forum or a noncaring agnostic. On the other hand now that i'm not longer that way, i still do not go around telling people theyre going to hell which has been more based on the pagan greek version of Hades than sheol/Gehenna that came out of the hebrew religions. Now i can think of one person on here who will tell you, that you are going to hell if you call Jesus any other name than Jesus, or tell you that you're a member of a cult if you do not believe what he does, even though he is making his own cult and rewriting the bible to say what he wants. But very few people do i see like that, and he knows who i am talking about.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

Now i can think of one person on here who will tell you, that you are going to hell if you call Jesus any other name than Jesus, or tell you that you're a member of a cult if you do not believe what he does, even though he is making his own cult and rewriting the bible to say what he wants. But very few people do i see like that, and he knows who i am talking about.

Really wolf? Only one?
I see a good half dozen of them on any given day; some are way way out there, and don't even attempt to support their stance with anything other than opinion or 'channeled messages'. They give very little information on how they arrived where they are, and when asked, either run away or change the subject, or try to turn the tables so they can condemn others.

I enjoy reading the Galactic Federation of Light channelings (not on ATS, ?? if anyone knows where they might be...perhaps Alien/UFO forum?) actually...they are wonderful, optimistic, uplifting, full of hope and a promise of a better future...
they speak of things we need to hear...and offer everyone a chance to partake.

The religious 'seers' -- on the other hand -- and the rogue preachers and Jesus-Camp types -- are not...they are morbid, scary, threatening, sinister, damning, warning, terrorists. Further, their 'followers' are often just as negative and tyrannical.

Big, big diff.

I'd tell you happy Easter, but I know you don't do 'Easter'....in any case, a happy belated vernal equinox and season of growth to you!
wildtimes

reply to post by jaxnmarko


It is because for all the members on ATS who are able to quote or refer to scripture, they're understanding of it is still shallow. From at least the fundamentalist christiian perspective, those who are devoid of Christ are the walking dead. In the same way an inmate on death row is merely awaiting execution after sentencing.

John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

But from the christian perspective, we can be brought to life, and our execution stayed, by being pardoned. And the only one who can stay that execution, and pardon you is Christ.

So why do they preach the gospel? Why do they proselytize? Because it is their duty to do so. And woe unto them if they do not! It is a commission, a commandment.

Mark 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

Luke 14:23 And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.

(This verse is part of a parable, and should read as a whole)

So why are they so passionate about it? For the same reason their God and Saviour is passionate about it.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

From the christian perspective, they are acting out of the same love(agape) that God has for you. In the same way you would not stand by and watch a child drown, neither can they stand by and not make at least a valiant attempt to let you know that reconciliation to God has been accomplished for you if you will only accept it.

So where ever you find fundamentalist christians, you are going to find preaching. As to feeling judged or condemned by them. See John 3:18 above.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jesiaha

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet

Originally posted by Trillium

Originally posted by mileysubet
If you say I am going to to hell..can I at least get a good spanking before I go?

Ho i see your here to do the same thing

Typical detract and derail
Talk about shooting yourself in the foot and having the other one in your mouth

Just my Nickel worth

If only I was that flexible.

Ho yes you sure are showing us the lack of flexibility in mind and body
I can’t prove it either but you’re doing a fine job yourself

Just my Nickel Worth
Remember we drop using penny here

Yes oh enlighted one, choosing not to live by the words of a book makes him so close minded...

Everyone chooses to live by the words of some book. Your schooling was based upon books.

Moot point.

so you are comparing school books to the bible....I'm sorry people don't teach marine biology using 2000 leagues under the sea.

Originally posted by signalfire
Anyone who tells you you're going to hell is automatically going to hell. Isn't there something about that in the bible? In the 'he who is without sin' department?

The "he who is without sin casts the first stone" has nothing to do with salvation. Once saved, always saved. One does not work for salvation and one cannot work to undo salvation.

However, there is a "clause" : you will be judged as you judge others. Bear in mind that the Great White Throne Judgement is for unrepentant sinners and the Judgement Seat of Christ is for Believers. Unrepentant sinners will be judged by their works. Believers will be judged for what they did in the flesh, but they will not lose their salvation.

It is each individuals choice to spend eternity in the lake of fire or to spend eternity surrounded by the love of God. But no human can descern another's heart, so they cannot descern another's salvation.