7500 Year Old Toy Car and World's Oldest Title Deed

I saw this story linked on the Fortean Times website.

Worlds earliest toy car and title deed on show at Mardin Museum

Archaeologist Mesut Alp said that the toy car, which is made out of stone, dates back to the late Stone Age and is thought to be 7,500 years old. The Culture and Tourism Director of Mardin, Davut Beliktay, said that the car is like a copy of cars today, adding that in its shape, the ancient toy also resembles a tractor. Beliktay also revealed that toy dolls and whistles, also made of stone, were found at sites in the area, "we believe that the whistles and dolls are 5,000 to 6,000 years old. The whistles are still in working condition," he said.

And the deed:

Archaeologist Alp explained that the title deed is 2,800 years old and pertains to the selling of a garden. The content of the deed he added refers to a fruit garden, and the fruit trees within, which are to be split between the three sons of the owner. The deed refers to "Nabulu" which Alp explained was in fact the old name of current Nusaybin

My question is, where did they get the idea for a car? I think it looks a lot like a tractor. I know they had carts and chariots. Could this just be a copy of one of those?

I find all this fascinating.

very interesting! what is the source?
and "nabulu"?....

reply to post by tncryptogal


Interesting post, thanks for sharing.

S&F

Rev

That's pretty cool,
is there a bigger picture of the toy car and/or the titel deed?

reply to post by onestepbehind


The exhibit is on display at a musuem in Mardin, the Mardin Museum. The source is in the link I provided. I'm trying to find out more.

Okay. Did find out more. The province of Mardin is in Southeastern Turkey. Mardin is also the name of the capital city.

Here's a link to the museum: Mardin Museum

reply to post by rockslinger


I don't know. Maybe there is on this site: 360 panoramic tour of Mardin Museum

I'm sure they're holding on to it pretty tightly. I'd like to see a bigger picture too.

This photo from symbolic-logic.blogspot.com...



This photo from www.todayszaman.com...

reply to post by tncryptogal


Easy to explain. Aliens!

The tires on the front of the stone car do not look attached. I wonder how they came to the conclusion that this is where those wheels go? Looks like a wagon if you remove the front tires. Just wondering.

Im thinking that the "toy car", looks more like some form of tool. Maybe for grinding corn into flour or the likes of such tasks.
I doubt they took the time, to make toys for kids in such manner back then. My money is on some sort of tool.

Here is a bigger picture and if I didn't know any better I would say this thing was made recently and not with rock but paper mache

Not that I'm a big fan of the mainstream of archaeology, but I would definitely like to hear their take on this.

Where's Slayer and Byrd when you need them?

just goes to show that the 'experts' dont know sh3289t!!!! us humans have been here alot longer than we think!
cool find! thanx

Probably based on the four wheeled chariots common in the Middle-East during that time














First known depiction of a four wheeled vehicle

just goes to show that the 'experts' dont know sh3289t!!!! us humans have been here alot longer than we think!

lol. No I'd suggest you read a bit more about ancient military history; 4 wheeled chariots are well known, as were wheeled rams and siege towers. The use of the term 'car' is a mistranslation from the Turkish.

reply to post by tncryptogal


...the gospel of John Deere!

Excellent find btw! S&F!

Originally posted by Hanslune
Probably based on the four wheeled chariots common in the Middle-East during that time














First known depiction of a four wheeled vehicle

just goes to show that the 'experts' dont know sh3289t!!!! us humans have been here alot longer than we think!

lol. No I'd suggest you read a bit more about ancient military history; 4 wheeled chariots are well known, as were wheeled rams and siege towers

edit on 3/1/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)

edit on 3/1/12 by Hanslune because: (no reason given)

But ancient military history going back 7500 years? Some of the earliest chariots come from Mesopotamia, around 3000 BC,
If this is indeed real, the ability to chisel the stone into wheels for just a toy, is remarkable. I'm still on the fence to wither this is a hoax from the museum or not.

Archaeologist Mesut Alp said that the toy car, which is made out of stone, dates back to the late Stone Age and is thought to be 7,500 years old.

Stone does not have organic content and cannot be carbon dated, so their date is no doubt a wild guess. Chariots go back at least 5000 years (Mesopotamia) and as has been mentioned in this thread, this "toy" bears a lot more resemblance to a chariot than a modern car, so I'd guess that's what this is and that they're a little off on the age of it.

Originally posted by Violater1


But ancient military history going back 7500 years? Some of the earliest chariots come from Mesopotamia, around 3000 BC, If this is indeed real, the ability to chisel the stone into wheels for just a toy, is remarkable. I'm still on the fence to wither this is a hoax from the museum or not.

The key phrase from the media report was

Archaeologist Mesut Alp said that the toy car, which is made out of stone, dates back to the late Stone Age and is thought to be 7,500 years old.

The key word is 'thought', the stone looks to be sandstone which is fairly soft.

To those who seem to be posting skepticism without evidently reading the article:

#1 if you read the article, the "car/tractor" is baked clay... not a far leap of imagination there, easy to sculpt for pete's sake they were writing on it
#2 no one in the serious archaeological world goes brandishing outlandish claims without warrant. If they say they estimate it to be around 7000 ish... then it's because of the dig layer from which it came. Yes, some things are difficult to carbon date, but this item may have been found in the proper strata or they found pollen or some-such...

point being, no museum of repute would make such a claim without proof... the archaeological world would not allow it. You must understand how difficult it is to even have a paper published some times. It goes without saying that anything that rocks the foundations of what we know is heavily scrutinized! Let's be real here!!

It's not like this is some guy without a degree saying he found this artifact in his back yard while digging a hole for a swimming pool!

This article has run in rather reputable archaeological magazines. How can we lowly armatures refute what science has accepted as proven?

There have been stranger things found that are verified as authentic.

Accompanied with this article (and the several copies on various Web sites) is the statement, all the way at the bottom of the page, "Car toy belongs to Sumerian era another Archeologist noted."

I suspect this unnamed archeologist is correct, and Mesut Alp is incorrect about the dating. Sumerians were not around 7500 years ago.

The model on display does strongly resemble other models of chariots from Sumer; note the shape of the wheels between the "toy car", the images Hanslune posted of Sumerian chariots/carts, and the one above.