A Christian Store Denied Him This T-Shirt…

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


I didn't attack your faith. If you have an issue with the verse in the Bible, then the Bible is attacking your faith.

Originally posted by cetaphobic
reply to post by RevelationGeneration

 

I didn't attack your faith. If you have an issue with the verse in the Bible, then the Bible is attacking your faith.

But you take a bible verse out of context to try and twist it to fit your agenda. Which seems pretty deceptive and dishonest to anyone that happens to read your T-shirt and is not well educated. I think the Christian Store did the right thing to deny you your T-shirt. If you want to spread lies Christians are not really the right people to ask. Jesus is the way the truth and the life... Christians are the ones with the truth. And you can have the truth to if you put your trust in Christ and take up your cross to follow him.

The question is how long will it take you to realize that?

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


What is the correct context? Also I have no idea why you think the story is about me.

Originally posted by cetaphobic
reply to post by RevelationGeneration

 

What is the correct context? Also I have no idea why you think the story is about me.

Like others have said, Timothy 2:12 means that women should not have authority in the church.

reply to post by cetaphobic


en.wikipedia.org...:12

The wikipedia page here has some good insights into the text.

Interpretation of this passage is typically considered complex.[7] N.T. Wright says that 1 Timothy 2 is the "hardest passage of all" to exegete properly.[8] A number of interpretive approaches to the text have been made by complementarians and egalitarians.

Egalitarian and complementarian interpretive approaches to the text typically take the following forms.
Socio-cultural: egalitarians argue that the text was intended for a specific socio-cultural environment which no longer exists and that the text is therefore not relevant to modern churches[9] (typically rely heavily on historical reconstructions using extra-biblical sources); complementarians argue that the socio-cultural environment (while relevant), does not restrict the application of the verse to a specific time and place in the past[10]
Lexical: egalitarians argue that the meaning of the key word in the text, authenteō, does not support the exclusion of women from authoritative teaching positions in the congregation;[11] complementarians argue that the meaning of this word in its context indicates that Paul did not wish women to have authority over men in the church[12]
Hermeneutical: egalitarians argue that the text was intended only to limit women for a specific temporary duration, or that it was intended only to limit uneducated women who were unfit to speak in the congregation;[13] complementarians argue that hermeneutical considerations indicate the text is universal in its application to Christian congregations[14]

Personally if we take the view that this is the word of god. And that the word of god is not subject to interpretation or ignoring because it does not suit our liking.

Then we must interpret this as it is displayed.

KJV 12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.
RSV 12I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent.
GNB 12I do not allow them to teach or to have authority over men; they must keep quiet.
NIV 12I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.
CEV 12They should be silent and not be allowed to teach or to tell men what to do.
NASB 12But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet.
NLT 12I do not let women teach men or have authority over them. Let them listen quietly.
NET 12But I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man. She must remain quiet.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


I think it goes beyond that.
He does say that women should not have authority over men.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by cetaphobic

 

Please protest some more with your sign. Since your a pagan I'm sure your in a position to be hating on the bible. What's the matter has the truth hurt your pride? why do you feel the need to attack our faith... Is it because Moses also exposed the pagan God's as being false when he brought Yahweh's wrath to Egypt?

edit on 27-11-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

I'm a pagan and I've never hated the christian bible. I found it very interesting and there's a lot of action, gore and funny ways of torture/punishement on it. Aside of the great words Christ himself said, he was a very good man.

I used to be a very religious person. It was the same catholiscism that showed me up that seeing god as a friend instead of a b****** who only wants to be praised (or he'll punish you, turn you into salt, drown you, etc.) was a way better. I still feel Christ as a friend of mine, I talk to him from time to time and pay visits to churches to find peace. But i'm not a catholic anymore, mostly because i'm a very social person and i love to have too many imaginary friends.

I don't hate the bible or christianity, i just don't like the fansclub

Originally posted by Caggy

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by cetaphobic

 

Please protest some more with your sign. Since your a pagan I'm sure your in a position to be hating on the bible. What's the matter has the truth hurt your pride? why do you feel the need to attack our faith... Is it because Moses also exposed the pagan God's as being false when he brought Yahweh's wrath to Egypt?

edit on 27-11-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

I'm a pagan and I've never hated the christian bible. I found it very interesting and there's a lot of action, gore and funny ways of torture/punishement on it. Aside of the great words Christ himself said, he was a very good man.

I used to be a very religious person. It was the same catholiscism that showed me up that seeing god as a friend instead of a b****** who only wants to be praised (or he'll punish you, turn you into salt, drown you, etc.) was a way better. I still feel Christ as a friend of mine, I talk to him from time to time and pay visits to churches to find peace. But i'm not a catholic anymore, mostly because i'm a very social person and i love to have too many imaginary friends.

I don't hate the bible or christianity, i just don't like the fansclub

I don't consider myself religious at all, spiritual yes religious no. And there is nothing good about Catholicism. They teach all sorts of things that is against what the bible says. I could name several but that is not the point. You say you think Christ was "a good man"? Well how can he just be a man if you refer to him as "Christ"... Do you know Christ means "messiah" the anointed one. What if you have actually mistaken him as a man when he is really GOD in the flesh? That would be a huge mistake would it not? You won't find peace in churches, many have been corrupted, that is not to say all churches are bad. Inner peace can only be found in one person and that's Jesus Christ the lord and savior of man kind. The bible is not a fairy tale or a work of fiction, the bible it self condemns such things, it tells us to very much live in reality and not fantasy. Maybe you should reconsider the bible, you won't find any truth or inner peace in paganism. YAHWEH has already exposed pagan deitys as being false. Do you remember the account of when moses went to egypt and brought YHWHs wrath against them... The pagan gods were no where to be seen, they were silent and did nothing.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


You know what I like? I like that one time when you admitted I probably know more about the Bible than you because I've read it three times. Ahh, takes me back.


See full image here
Good times. Good times.

Saying that women should not teach men in the church is still sexist, you know. Hating Pagans is still bigoted, you know. But oh, I forgot that you also don't mind being called a bigot.


See full image here

So why should I care what a bigot and sexist thinks again? Why should I trust that someone who is filled with hate is being honest? It would benefit you very much to lie about Pagans and anyone you disagree with.

reply to post by cetaphobic


First reply was directed at you, and that is if you have truthfully even read the bible 3 times. I personally do not believe you have.

And I do not hate pagans or any person's beliefs for that matter.

Woman should NOT teach in churches... This statement does not make me sexist. I have the upmost respect for woman. The problem is the Bible says its not right, so I have to go with what the bible says on this one. There is good reason for why this is but I will not go into it here.

Second reply wasn't even directed at you. Show me where I have lied about Pagans and I'll happily repent of my wrong doing.

I have not been hateful this accusation of yours has no foundation. If you interpret my post's that way then their is nothing I can do about it. I try to not base things on my opinion, but on a biblical basis.

And no where have I asked anyone to trust me. What I am saying is put your trust in our creator. Trust Jesus Christ with your heart and mind and he shall give you eternal life.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


Lies: Pagans are Satan worshippers. Pagans are knowing Satan worshippers. Paganism was not around before Christianity. Paganism was formed in rebellion of the Christian God. Witches are evil. The holy inquisition wasn't Christian. A religion that harms none is still evil.
And all of this:


Full image

reply to post by cetaphobic


How do I know pagan's worship satan? Well I'll answer that.

Either you are with God or you are against Him. If you are worshipping other so called deities then who are you really serving? The answer should be obvious... The great deceiver satan of course.

You have to ask yourself... Do you serve the God of Creation, or his fallen counterpart, Satan?

The truth is if you are not serving the Lord, Jesus Christ of Nazareth you are serving Satan by default.

This is how I know.

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


Now this is interesting.

Do you have concrete proof, other than the bible. That Pagans or Wiccans are in fact worshipping Lucifer?

You say there is only god and lucifer.

Can you prove that wiccans aren't worshipping something else?

And please don't use the bible as a reference. It's not a valid reference for this question.

reply to post by grey580


Concrete proof? I have proof but please define what concrete proof is for me.

Would wiccans own literature suffice?

reply to post by RevelationGeneration


That would be acceptable.
However to be fair you you can't be one sided. There needs to be a variety of sources. with differing views.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration

Originally posted by Caggy

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by cetaphobic

 

Please protest some more with your sign. Since your a pagan I'm sure your in a position to be hating on the bible. What's the matter has the truth hurt your pride? why do you feel the need to attack our faith... Is it because Moses also exposed the pagan God's as being false when he brought Yahweh's wrath to Egypt?

edit on 27-11-2011 by RevelationGeneration because: (no reason given)

I'm a pagan and I've never hated the christian bible. I found it very interesting and there's a lot of action, gore and funny ways of torture/punishement on it. Aside of the great words Christ himself said, he was a very good man.

I used to be a very religious person. It was the same catholiscism that showed me up that seeing god as a friend instead of a b****** who only wants to be praised (or he'll punish you, turn you into salt, drown you, etc.) was a way better. I still feel Christ as a friend of mine, I talk to him from time to time and pay visits to churches to find peace. But i'm not a catholic anymore, mostly because i'm a very social person and i love to have too many imaginary friends.

I don't hate the bible or christianity, i just don't like the fansclub

I don't consider myself religious at all, spiritual yes religious no. And there is nothing good about Catholicism. They teach all sorts of things that is against what the bible says. I could name several but that is not the point. You say you think Christ was "a good man"? Well how can he just be a man if you refer to him as "Christ"... Do you know Christ means "messiah" the anointed one. What if you have actually mistaken him as a man when he is really GOD in the flesh? That would be a huge mistake would it not? You won't find peace in churches, many have been corrupted, that is not to say all churches are bad. Inner peace can only be found in one person and that's Jesus Christ the lord and savior of man kind. The bible is not a fairy tale or a work of fiction, the bible it self condemns such things, it tells us to very much live in reality and not fantasy. Maybe you should reconsider the bible, you won't find any truth or inner peace in paganism. YAHWEH has already exposed pagan deitys as being false. Do you remember the account of when moses went to egypt and brought YHWHs wrath against them... The pagan gods were no where to be seen, they were silent and did nothing.

You can say whatever you want, but for me, yahweh is just the demiurge that pretends to be the creator of the universe but he isn't (I'm still not sure about him making the earth, i'll give him that point anyway, a deity can do things like that for certain). Christ, in other hand, was a good guy that really knew who he was, something that everyone here can do if they were awesome as him (for me he's one of the most awesome guys ever and i'm telling truth). He knew he was a part of the everything this universe is, the wholeness we are as sons and daughters of the great God/Goddess. He knew who he was, and he tried to tell everyone that we are the same as him, to wake up to God, not to the demiurge. True story, he told me about it once (you should ask him to come to your home for a cup of tea by time to time, great guy, great conversation, and if he's going to tell you something funny, he can turn the tea into wine and everything tastes better!)

Don't mind me, i'm a "devil worshiper" ('cause i'm a mage, and everybody knows that mages and witches are devil worshipers, du'h!) that turned her back into christianity and catholiscism because she cannot found answers on it due her incappability to stay serious. My brothers are catholic, one of them is an acolyte on his church and everything else, I respect them because is their faith, i'll be a crap of a human being if I told them to follow my beliefs because I think they're right. We are free to believe in whatever we want because of something that little but so important as FREE WILL is. Believing that the bible is a non-fiction work is stupid. First, it was written by a lot of guys that never knew christ in person, like 50 years after the guy died (the most earlier ones, there's some parts that were writen centuries ago!!!! WTF!) and has been translated so many times in different eras and languages that even if once it holded some truth, now it is a great work of fiction. It's a really good book, but by time to time i've said "Mother of Thor!" while reading!

This is the same as veganism for me: You can eat what you want and argue as much as you want while you're eating your veggies/preachin, but don't spit on my dish (and i'll let you eat in peace too) Live and let die, my friend, and you'll never be trolled again

Originally posted by cetaphobic
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

But how does that solve the problem of those who claim the WHOLE Bible is the word of God and is not to be cherry picked from?

That belief is called Biblical Inerrancy... and it's only been around for 200 years... only the masses believe that BS

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration
reply to post by cetaphobic

 

How do I know pagan's worship satan? Well I'll answer that.

Either you are with God or you are against Him. If you are worshipping other so called deities then who are you really serving? The answer should be obvious... The great deceiver satan of course.

You have to ask yourself... Do you serve the God of Creation, or his fallen counterpart, Satan?

The truth is if you are not serving the Lord, Jesus Christ of Nazareth you are serving Satan by default.

This is how I know.

Wow... I didn't realize you were so uneducated and ignorant of history....

Did you know there was no Nazareth until people went looking for it?

That's because the Gospels were Greek Wisdom Texts... just like the Corpus Hermeticum....

Originally posted by HunkaHunka

Originally posted by cetaphobic
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

But how does that solve the problem of those who claim the WHOLE Bible is the word of God and is not to be cherry picked from?

That belief is called Biblical Inerrancy... and it's only been around for 200 years... only the masses believe that BS

There is an article in Wikipedia on Biblical Inerrancy.
Depending on how one defines the term, it could date back to the Nicene Creed where it says that the prophets were inspired wikipedia on biblical insperation and inerrancy
Seems the writers of the New Testament believed that but not to the same extent as some fundamentalists today.

Originally posted by RevelationGeneration

Originally posted by cetaphobic
reply to post by RevelationGeneration

 

What is the correct context? Also I have no idea why you think the story is about me.

Like others have said, Timothy 2:12 means that women should not have authority in the church.

Which therefore means you should be questioning your assertion of the morality of what is in your holy book. One of the catalysts of my deconversion was actually reading the Bible. I don't care that Jesus means you don't have to adhere to the purity laws, or that there was a 'reason' for whatever vile action happened. The fact that God was ever okay with or required stuff like rape, murder, genocide, slavery, preemptive war, sacrificing of anything living, etc means that I will not cede any authority to him since he appears to be a sociopath and megalomaniac. My rule of thumb has always been: would I be okay with God doing that to my family regardless of the reason (such as falling victim to a plague for your leader incorrectly implementing a census)? Cultural context isn't an excuse either, since he very clearly indicated what he wanted changed and ensured it would happen. I could never serve a deity that could condone or advocate any of that.