Since When Was Thinness Equated With Beauty?

reply to post by othello


True that, just wished the pic embedded like I thought it would...

I can't see a thing wrong with her. I know of a few girls who are overly skinny and most of the guys around or that i know of will say this said person is "hot". Well i don't know what they are looking at, but if a girl is little more than skin and bones that is not attractive to me, and I can't see how it could be at all, but thats just my point of view.

reply to post by jstanthrno1


See now I see that pic and think a 4-some sounds like a good idea...

Really though I think all of those women are attractive.

This kinda makes me think that there is simply a huge diversity as to what guys find attractive and we can't really generalize as to what is attractive.

I also wonder i it has to do with the guy.

I know that different ethnic groups have different "standards" plus I bet there is a correlation with the guy's build type as well.

reply to post by jstanthrno1


Same here, I like the left and middle, but right is a bit too chunky for me.
EDIT: I mean the one on the right isn't bad , just rating them from 1 to 3, she'd be #3.



It might be subconscious conditioning. The media is all about "transfats are bad", which becomes "fat is bad", which might lead us to thinking "fat = bad", thus "fat people = bad", or "fat people = unhealthy = heart disease = not a viable choice for offspring", which may actually feed off of our billions of years of evolution for procreating with the 'right' partner.

Originally posted by anon102
S and F for you. Interesting read.

I don't really find thin women attractive at all. Sure they're easy on the eyes but it like what described to my friends the 'cookie cutter' effect. Seems all women I see who most men perceive 'catching' are thin. Now a days there are too many thin women with nearly the same figures and fashion styles. Like cookies from a cookie cutter

.

Over time it gets tiresome and drab to see the same kind of women over and over so I just ... lost interest.

Alot of the problem, to my mind, is that everything filters down from the Haute Couture houses. The 'muses' that the top designers utilise are usually freaks of women, not unbeautiful, but beautiful for their freakishness and difference. These muses have become increasingly adrogenous, as has the cut of clothes. More curvacous women are stuck with fashion that is unflattering and totally unsympathetic to their body shape.

Women have been mutilating themselves in various ways for centuries in order to conform to fashion. I would guess that if shown a picture of two women, with exactly the same everything other than one was heavier than the other, that most women would say that the thinner woman was happier. The popular media is incredibly body-facist. All a female celebrity has to do is gain a few pounds and she is front page news, go too far the other way and she is seriously ill. It is a very thin margin that these young women have to tread to keep their media fed public happy. And, it seems to be one that forces instability and low self-esteem. The standards set are unfeasible for the majority but they will pay a fortune in trying. And perhaps there lies the why such a standard, in a consumeristic society, has been set.

reply to post by Jinglelord


Now that i think about it i like your idea.

Also i think you are spot on to the deversity of what men find attractive.

one thing is i never thought about the corilation of mens body types to the women they are with and find attractive.Me i am stocky and i have always been attracted to larger type women and a friend of mine who is skinny only dates skinny women so maybe you are onto something if at the least its a sub concscience level that we pick body types

I figure there are a lot of gay men who lead the fashion industry in designing clothes... so they use tall thin women, because to them,that is more masculine, and what they used for their clothes...

Then, after time, men who are more concerned with what others think, started looking for what was "approved' by thier peer groups...

This is changing though and many men are listening to their primal instincts again

I am curvier now, but when I was skinny I would cry myself to sleep because I felt so masculine.. even with the big boobies, the rest of me didn't feel feminine....

Originally posted by mellisamouse
I figure there are a lot of gay men who lead the fashion industry in designing clothes... so they use tall thin women, because to them,that is more masculine, and what they used for their clothes...

Yes true and not only that but the sample clothes shown on the models, is often very small to save the designers money-as they materials are very expensive. The models, are basically hangers.

So let me get you right, you think woman should carry extra weight so they can have a healthy pregnancy and be able to fight back.

Isn't that an oxy-moron

I've found this post very interesting and to see the views from men about women's sizes, quite entertaining. Myself I've fluctuated between a size 10, 12 and 14 (pregnancies) and being English, these sizes are bigger than American sizes. I;m 5'2 so fat shows quite easily. Now in all my 48 years I have had many men tell me I'm attractive, wolf whistled and have had men come over to kiss my cheek, even when I'm with my husband. Why is this? Because I smile, always look happy and apparently have an innocent looking face with big boobies lol . Not once does a guy come up to me and say "Oh god you have fat around your belly, You look awful" Not once have I been out socializing and not had a lot of attention, even when I'm stood by gorgeous skinny blondes.
So fatter versus thinner??? I dunno so much

Long read(sorry) but I've studied for a while on beauty. I have some conclusions related to the...
OP's woman in question, appears healthy, may be can gain a few pounds and it would not hurt her, even though she looks tiny boned.

As the American culture changes from new influence(whether you want to include media or not), ideals will shift. Rounder "bottoms" and fuller lips are widely accepted, they were not in the 80s(see Jenifer Lopez vs Sharon Stone). The fashion industry influences actors and other celebrities(who are now most common on magazines and TV), which influences women, on how they "should" look.

Some factors in determining beauty, will stay the same, such as facial symmetry, which people find more attractive. Studies have shown men subconsciously, not only by hormones, find a woman attractive by body shape.

Also, women's hit to ratio balance has shifted during the years. I read this in an article last year sometime(hour glass shape body), but cannot locate it at this time. it explained that the ratio was the hour glass shape and pear shape. Now those are less common, compared to "straight" shapes to say if a woman wanted to gain hips by gaining weight-her hips and waist would measure the same diameter.

Also, to mention, "skinny" perceived after the 60s or so, meant the person was wealthy, thus having time to exercise, have physical trainers, nutritionists etc.,(same can be said for the tanning trend). Pre that era, people who weighed more were those who had more money because they could afford to eat, and "lounge around"...
One can say current weight standards are defined by the status quo.
Here's some reference material;

Some researchers have found that the waist-hip ratio (WHR) is a significant measure of female attractiveness[16].

Women with a 0.7 WHR are usually rated as more attractive by men from Indo-European cultures.[17] Beauty icons such as Marilyn Monroe, Jayne Mansfield, Salma Hayek and Sophia Loren typically have ratios close to 0.7, even though they have different weights and heights. In other cultures, preferences appear to vary according to some studies,[18] ranging from 0.6 in China,[19] to 0.8 or 0.9 in parts of South America and Africa,[5][20][21] and divergent preferences based on ethnicity, rather than nationality, have also been noted.[22][23]

It appears that men are more influenced by female waist-size than hip-size:

"Hip size indicates pelvic size and the amount of additional fat storage that can be used as a source of energy. Waist size conveys information such as current reproductive status or health status ... in westernized societies with no risk of seasonal lack of food, the waist, conveying information about fecundity and health status, will be more important than hip size for assessing a female's attractiveness." —Journal of Biological Psychology, [24]

Models as hangers(just one source) Here

Facial Symmetry & Actractiveness

Thinness is mainly equated with beauty in the West, although the global influence of Western culture has spread diet books, treadmills and slimming parlours around the modern world. In Africa, South Asia and the Middle East, most men still prefer women a Western actuary would describe as overweight.

Personally, I can find women of almost any size sexy. The only exceptions are the anorexic and the uncomfortably obese, who merely look ill. Feminine proportions, good skin, good posture and body language are far more important than mere size.

To answer the OP question, thinness started being equated with beauty when everyone (at last) had more than enough to eat.

Originally posted by Nick_X
I believe it's the inner Pedophile in men, and the Green Eyed monster of Jealousy in Women that is driving the skinny market. It's become massively popular since Kate Moss and CK advertisements and the trend has just continued with young models like Gemma Ward starting out when she was just 15 years old.

Also with womens beauty products - because you can put a higher $$$ selling something which is designed to achieve something which is harder to achieve, in this case, weight loss and being thin.

All the negative press about obesity and health just adds to the pile.

Advertising is funny...

I recall the Dove True Beauty ads(circa '04), who posted bullet board pictures of "normal women" of all ages and sizes(none were extremely obese or extra skinny, just what was normal in the US), however people complained so much the ads were pulled and re worked. Apparently we as consumers, want to see "beautiful, young, photo shopped and airbrushed-free of wrinkles, bumps, freckles and anything else we might want to dismiss in ourselves." people in fashion ads, as opposed to what we naturally look like.
Source:Here, that explains the ads, but not the uproar.

reply to post by dreamingawake


Can I summarize?

Overall preference seems to change with time especially towards the body types the elite of the time have in vogue (Large when food is scarce skinny when plentiful). Makes sense to look for genes of the elites I suppose...

Also it seems Chinese guys like little booty, Caucasian guys like some booty, and Hispanic and African guys like big booty...

Come on you all knew this was coming sooner or later in this thread it is appropriate for once.

Originally posted by Jinglelord

Don't forget... Spinal Tap-Big Bottoms

reply to post by dreamingawake


Fantastic! can't believe I left that one out...

And to debunk gay guys wanting women to be skinny and boy like I give you:

This clip explains it all!

My breasts are filled with love and life
my hips are round and well apart
such women they say - have sons. Cleopatra

So, men who don't want the responsibility of a family go for skinny chickies.
Men who do? Who want a family? Don't mind comfortable wide hips...

hehehe

Hows' that for generalizations!

There's something to the theory too - men used to want women who were capable of bearing children.
And now? That's another subject all together.

peace

I'd have to agree with the OP 100%

I personally do not find the rail-thin women attractive at all. But, I will not say they are ugly, because that would be no better than saying that women with a "little extra" are ugly. Different strokes for different folks (no pun intended)

That being said, body type comes into play here a lot as well. Woman "A" and woman "B" could be the exact same height and weight, but I might find woman "A" more attractive because of her body type. I love a pronounced round backside (Vida Guerra comes to mind ) and pronounced roundness up top as well. If a woman has those things, and a pretty face, odds are I will be very physically attracted to her. Some thick shapely thighs would sweeten the deal even more.

I don't understand the attraction to the rail thin girls to be honest. What makes a woman's body different than a man's (other than their reproductive organs, of course) is an ass, breasts, and thighs. Without those things, how is a woman's body much different than that of a man's? It's not. And I'm not attracted to men.

I feel horrible admitting this, but I have from time to time desired dating the more stereotypical attractive thin woman. Not because I find them more attractive, but because it plays into my ego. Making other people jealous or having them think how lucky you are for getting such an attractive girl when going out in public is something that is desirable to me on some level, even though I try to deny it and rid myself of such thoughts, it's only human. I have no doubt that many men who brag about how they only date thin women do so for this same reason. Not all of them, and few would admit it like I have, but I'm sure it's the case for many.

I think genetically we don't want these skinny little women, but it's programmed into us. Just like "hip clothing" (not to compare women to an object) What are the odds that millions of people JUST HAPPEN to like the SAME STYLE of clothing AT THE SAME TIME?!?! Stop lying to yourself, you like it because it's popular and it makes you look good to other people.

If everybody only wore what they personally liked, and dated women only because they themselves were actually attracted to them, things would be pretty different in my opinion.

On the topic of gay men influencing thin women as a standard, I don't fully agree. There's a website explaining the link, which I don't think I can post as it contains pornography comparing it to fashion models. The site tries to prove the theory of fashion designer influence. I really feel it's a stretch...Compare the women of men's magazines- which are glamour models- to high fashion models on the runways and in women's high fashion magazines, thin, but not too thin.

She is thin, I am confused as to why anyone would think she is fat or large , her stomache is flat she is healthy and more importantly she is an athlete. Doesn't that add to her attractivenesss that she is talented and active over say a skinny girl who is just thin from not eating and has no vitality in her.

My weight has fluctuated a lot of the years Iv been too skinny then chubby then just right for my height ect ect. But found that my mind set has always stayed the same , apart from at my thinnest, sure I might have looked better in clothes but my mental health suffered as a result.