Wisconsin Senate passes resolution calling for Democrats to be taken into police custody

reply to post by centurion1211

Of course the pro-union people will claim they were planted, but I say if bullets were found, then everyone needs to get out, just in case they were from a crazed, pro-union person after all.

I'm not one to throw out accusations with no evidence...but since you started it with your "crazed pro-union" talk....


We do have the Governor on tape saying he had thought about placing troublemakers into the crowd, but he thought it would bring more attention to the protests.

I guess the next best thing would be to plant bullets to disperse the crowd over "fears" of violence.


Or someone just lost track of their bullets



And I thought you right wingers always claimed liberals don't own guns???

reply to post by MindSpin


If I did not show up to work for more than 2 days and did not communicate with my boss I would not have a job very quickly. Law makers should be held to a higher standard since they represent the people, they should be dragged back in hand-cuffs, forced to vote their conscience and thrown out on their arses for not doing their job...

Just because you dont agree with what will pass does not mean you dont have to goto work, they fled their position no different from a Marine in battle...they should be prosecuted.

Originally posted by MindSpin

Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by MindSpin

 

Over paid tax payers!

This is all I hear from ATSers...complaining about other people making too much money.

Bankers make too much money, Wall street makes too much money, CEOs make too much money, Union workers make too much money.....and on and on and on.


If you are not happy with how much money you make...do something about it, don't just cry about other people making too much money.

Just a claasic example of how people tend to fight against their best interests. Times are tough so let's just lower everyones pay. Brillant, just effing brillant.

Originally posted by marinesniper0351
reply to post by MindSpin

 

If I did not show up to work for more than 2 days and did not communicate with my boss I would not have a job very quickly. Law makers should be held to a higher standard since they represent the people, they should be dragged back in hand-cuffs, forced to vote their conscience and thrown out on their arses for not doing their job...

Just because you dont agree with what will pass does not mean you dont have to goto work, they fled their position no different from a Marine in battle...they should be prosecuted.

Did you know the Dem representatives in that building moved their desks outside in the snow - - so they could continue to work for their Constituent? I hear it was about 20 degrees. Did you know they ran phone lines from the offices outside through windows - - so they could work.

Why? Because they were either locked out of their office - - - or ordered to work for the Republicans.

Stay informed.

reply to post by marinesniper0351



First, Wisconsin isn't a corporation and Walker isn't the CEO or King!!!!!

Part of doing your job is to decide what laws to vote on.

You also get to choose who you want to negotiate with and can travel. King Walker can't take away people's rights to travel out of State or force them to vote!

The Dems found a law and are using it to their advantage. If you don't like the law, try to change it. But to decide you are going to start arresting people to get around the law is just insane!

Originally posted by howmuch4another
reply to post by OLD HIPPY DUDE

 

They don't have to compromise.... they won. That's the way elections work. The majority gets to rule and there isn't a guarantee they all vote together if there is disagreement on policy. In this case they will. You think it ok for the minority to just walk out on their duty because it fits their agenda. If they were truly representing their constituents why are there 7 recall petitions circulating?

That is exactly how this should be handled - recall votes. I also want to make it clear that these senators are not violating the law. They may be violating protocol, but it is not illegal to do what they are doing. Sometimes civil disobediance is the only thing left. I would also imagine that the recall votes will include the Gov and the senators backing him. I bet the Wisconsin will choose to let the missing senators prevail. About damn time someone took a stand in this country.

Originally posted by Starwise
reply to post by ThinkingCap

 

Once the Democrats return the other side can call quorum and vote majority....its a trap. Thats why democrats left the state, to keep it from being voted on to give them more time.....

Yes - - anyone who is actually following the reality of this would see that.

This governor was bought and paid for before taking office. And he is doing his best to do what he was paid to do.

And I thought Dictatorship was illegal. Apparently not - - - check Ohio and Indiana.

Originally posted by marinesniper0351
reply to post by MindSpin

 

If I did not show up to work for more than 2 days and did not communicate with my boss I would not have a job very quickly. Law makers should be held to a higher standard since they represent the people, they should be dragged back in hand-cuffs, forced to vote their conscience and thrown out on their arses for not doing their job...

Just because you dont agree with what will pass does not mean you dont have to goto work, they fled their position no different from a Marine in battle...they should be prosecuted.

They have been in constant communication...and their job entails more than just casting votes. They are the elected voice of the people...and in turn they are allowing the people their chance to have their voice heard.

The final outcome doesn't matter, most likely the law will pass. But awareness was brought to the agenda of the Wisconsin Governor and the Republicans.

It has been shown that he is willing to have police use force to drag back elected officials to ram his agenda through, break up protesters, and work hand in hand with the Koch.

In my opinion...this is already a victory for the democrats...no matter the final outcome of this one law.

Originally posted by David9176
Wouldn't it be nice if you were a billionaire and you didn't have to protest the old fashioned way?

Instead all you had to do was flood corporate news and politicians with money to get your way?

And in the process completely take yourself out of the CLASS WARFARE now being waged by CONSERVATIVES who were just crying up a river about the insane SOCIALISM that was on the way?

Congratulations America.

You have fooled yourself into trashing what little is left of the middle class....all the while ignoring the billionaires who corrupt and run our government....get us into endless wars....then blame TEACHERS and other Americans for problems THEY PUT IN PLACE.

nearly 3 years since the bailout of Wall street....

AND WE ARE GOING AFTER TEACHERS!!!!! Yes, that crazy ass 50 year old lady in glasses is going to beat us with her "thug" bat! Look at the evils they are doing to our country!!!

Idiots....IDIOTS!!!! Pull your damn head out of your asses and look at what you are doing.

edit on 3-3-2011 by David9176 because: (no reason given)

I feel the same way. I often wonder what type of person supports this stuff?

These Walker and Koch supporters keep calling these teachers and firefighters pigs and trash. Not kidding Rush said those exact words. The same people "thank God for the Koch brothers" and see no problem with the bailouts.

So I wonder if these supporters are closer to the working class (the pigs according to the Koch supporters) or the good billionaires?

reply to post by MindSpin


I am sure this has been considered but will someone let us know how long a WI State Senator have to be absent

before the leader of the legislative body can declare the seat open?


With several open seats a quorum can be declared and business be continued.

Rather than give the protesting senators a photo op with their arrest, has the majority leader considered a law

declaring the missing members deceased pending their proof of existence by their presence in the chamber?

Originally posted by Starwise
reply to post by ThinkingCap

 

Once the Democrats return the other side can call quorum and vote majority....its a trap. Thats why democrats left the state, to keep it from being voted on to give them more time.....

www.merriam-webster.com...

edit on 3-3-2011 by Starwise because: Didnt add my comment oops

More time for what?

The debate is over.

"Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me."

I would be more concerned about a fellow legislator's junkets paid for by tax dollars or corporate money, than a fellow legislator's fleeing for reasons of principle.

reply to post by whatwasthat


Um...no, they can't just declare them dead


The only option they would have is to expel them...but it takes a 2/3 majority vote...and the Republicans don't have that.


Boo Hoo....Republicans have to play by the rules.

Originally posted by MindSpin

Boo Hoo....Republicans have to play by the rules.

But so to the dems.

If they want to get paid and/or see their homes and families again.

Hey, I noticed no pro-union person wanted to comment on the democrat legislator telling the republican legislator that, "You are f---ing dead!".
...

Quorum


Quorum-busting has been used for centuries. For instance, during his time in the state legislature, Abraham Lincoln leapt out of a first story window (the doors of the Capital had been locked to prevent legislators from fleeing) in a failed attempt to prevent a quorum from being present.

In the United States Senate, the procedure was used in the early morning hours of February 25, 1988. Senator Robert C. Byrd of West Virginia, then the Senate Majority Leader, moved a call of the house after the minority Republicans walked out in an attempt to deny the Senate a quorum after Senate aides began bring cots into the Senate cloakrooms in preparation for an all-night session over campaign finance reform for congressional elections. Bryd's motion was approved 45-3 and arrest warrants were signed for all 46 Republicans. Senate Sergeant-at-Arms Henry K. Giugni and his staff searched the Capitol's corridor and Senate office buildings for absent Senators, and after checking several empty offices, spotted Senator Steve Symms of Idaho, who fled down a hallway and escaped arrest. After a cleaning woman gave a tip that Senator Robert Packwood of Oregon was in his office, Giugni opened the door with a skeleton key. Packwood attempted to shove the door closed, but Giugni and two assistants pushed it open. Packwood was "carried feet-first into the Senate chamber by three plainclothes officers" and sustained bruised knuckles.

Prior to 1988, the last time the procedure had been used was during a 1942 filibuster over civil rights legislation.[9] Southern senators had spent days filibustering legislation to end Poll taxes used in the South to disenfranchise blacks and other low-income voters. Taking place just days after midterm elections had resulted in the loss of nine seats. Democratic Majority Leader Alben W. Barkley obtained an order on a Saturday session on November 14, 1942 directing Sergeant at Arms Chesley W. Jurney to round up the five Southern absentees to obtain a quorum. Jurney sent his Deputy Sergeant at Arms, J. Mark Trice, to the apartment of Senator Kenneth McKellar of Tennessee at the Mayflower Hotel. Then 73 years old and the third-most senior Senator, McKellar was later described by Senator Bill Frist in his book on Tennessee senators as an "extraordinarily shrewd man of husky dimensions with a long memory and a short fuse." Trice called from the lobby, but McKellar refused to answer his phone, so the deputy sergeant at arms walked up to the apartment and convinced the senator's maid to let him in:


A recent prominent example of quorum-busting occurred during the 2003 Texas redistricting, in which the majority Republicans in the Texas House of Representatives sought to carry out a controversial mid-decade congressional redistricting bill which would have favored Republicans by displacing five Democratic U.S. Representatives from Texas (the Texas Five) from their districts. The House Democrats, certain of defeat if a quorum were present, took a plane to the neighboring state of Oklahoma to prevent a quorum from being present (and thus the passage of the bill). The group gained the nickname "the Killer Ds."

Seems both partys have used this tactic with the same results, it's nothing new , and it breaks no laws.
So get over the fact this is a democracy and not a dictatorship.
And just because there are rules that you don't understand,in regards to a Quorum, doesn't make Wis. Democrats wrong in what they are doing, it prevents an action that they and their tax paying, voting constituents
do not support.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by MindSpin

Boo Hoo....Republicans have to play by the rules.

But so to the dems.

If they want to get paid and/or see their homes and families again.

Hey, I noticed no pro-union person wanted to comment on the democrat legislator telling the republican legislator that, "You are f---ing dead!".
...

Yes, that is the sacrafice they are willing to make...they are still not breaking any laws. Good for them for making personal sacrafices to stand up for what they believe in. More than you see most politicians do.


As for that quote...it is a moronic quote, the guy should apologize and suffer any backlash from the voters he has coming.

Are you willing to condemn moronic talk from Republicans yet...including your beloved Palin??? Or still not willing to do that yet???

reply to post by Daughter2

I often wonder what type of person supports this stuff?

Centurion.

So I wonder if these supporters are closer to the working class (the pigs according to the Koch supporters) and the good billionaires?

I dunno...let's ask Centurion.

Who do you stand by Centurion? The working people of this country or the billionaires that are corrupting our government?

Are you afraid of that mother of 3 teacher, or as you refer to them...UNION THUGS...might beat you with a baseball bat?

Both partys have had control of the house and the senate at the same time and yet a quorum is still a requirement to do business. Why is that ?

Desperate times call for desperate measures.

reply to post by OLD HIPPY DUDE


I knew stuff like this had been done before, so I greatly appreciated the history lesson.

From the first idea of calling out the national guard to calling on police to handle the situation shows a behavior pattern that should be abhorrent to citizens in a free country. This is the pattern found in dictators of any political persuasion.

I'm breaking my own rule here.... I try not to contribute unless I've read the entire thread, but I'm just too eager to contribute (pardon this minor break in the flow....)

Am I incorrect in assuming that we all recognize the element of political theater in this scenario?

They are to be compelled against their will, as they had declared it. They have no physical recourse, no avenue of appeal or injunction (if that's the right term). This task is to be executed by law enforcement personnel, as directed by what is essentially, the Republican Party of Wisconsin.

Now forgive my obtuse question, in what manner of reasoning is it not arrest? No, that is not a rhetorical question.... I propose an answer.... It is not "arrest" because they will not be charged with anything. Now, consider this. Lacking a charge, by what authority can any government seize a citizen? ..... They can because they are pretending.... it's called "making believe."

Understand, this is speculative I admit.... but I was wondering.... can it possibly be true that the 'majority' can impose its will so completely on the 'minority?' Can they legitimately marginalize the substantial resistance they face by parliamentary process? The framework of the system was created by more intelligent men than I, but I don't think the process was supposed to get here.... Isn't a Democratic Republic, such as ours, supposed to be compelled to compromise, not capitulate?

This isn't going to be a win-win for anyone, this is true enough; but behind it I see political gamesmanship that is disturbing in it's winner take all 'construct.'

meh.... it's late, I ramble.

(Note to self: Don't post when your exhausted.)

Be well.