Challenge to Christians: Prove the Bible is True

Originally posted by fordrew
reply to post by hypervalentiodine

 

You can't prove that the bible is false - instead you attack my statement. Pathetic.

I have no interest in disproving it. There is no point. The people who believed it before will continue to believe it after and visa versa. Such is life. However, if you plan on proving something, your theory should be falsifiable and, well, not circular.

reply to post by Creedo


No matter what can be said for, or against, the Bible it's writings are old and in that respect alone it is a history book. It gives an indication of thinking processes and lifestyles from two thousand years ago (or as near as.)

I'm no aethiest...I do believe In God but not necessarily as depicted in the Bible. I am a regular reader of the Bible because I find it fascinating.

reply to post by The GUT

have been alarmed throughout my lifetime (and throughout history) at the debauchery and sometimes outright evil (subjective term I know) comitted in the name of the Bible and the purported Word of God.

So have I!! How DARE they?!

But this is certainly the weakest of your claims. I've seen your excellent intellect on these boards and I feel that you can do better than that one.

I live on the west coast of Scotland where there are real issues with sectarianism between catholic and protestants. It's calmed a lot these days but its still there. It comes largely in the form of football tribalism. Catholics tend to support Celtic and protestants support Rangers. That's on the surface but obviously sectarianism's history has far more serious roots than that.

I have met many people who have moved here from abroad, or even just from England, who were shocked that the first question they were asked on arrival was what religion they were.

I don't think we should underestimate the peoples' of the past or the various authors of the books of the Bible and their capacity to lend spiritual insight.

Some of the OT writings are far from 'good' in my view. Its attitude to slavery for one....or to entitlement of certain peoples to land and property for another. From that perspective alone I question its validity to those it was not written for.

Even the NT Mathew 15 says ''Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon. 22And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil. 23But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. 24But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 25Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. 26But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. 27And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. 28Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.


Sent ONLY for the lost sheep of the house of Israel...and the Caananites compared to dogs?

I would love to know my Celtic history better...but that's an impossibility thanks to dear old Nero...who more or less eradicated our history. I'm sure the Celts were the chosen people of their Gods too.

I appreciate the input on this thread...we are here to debate.

reply to post by IAMIAM


From your thread

Jesus is not God. He never claimed to be.

Jesus Claimed he was the Son of God. He was correct. He IS the Son of God for he is a creation of this magnificent existence, the great UNKNOWN. He was not stating he was greater than anyone. He was trying to teach Man who they were. We are all Children of God, and he says so repeatedly.

Jesus claimed he was the Son of Man. Again, correct. This is paying homage to the biological entities that created him.

What can I say....but I 100% agree with you on this (where’s the good debate in consensus lol) We are ALL the children of God.

Now....in the beginning was The Word...but before I speak I tend to think first. Thinking is electro chemical energy and connections. Electro chemical connections pervade and enable all life. Everywhere and everything. That is my idea of God.

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by Creedo

 

No matter what can be said for, or against, the Bible it's writings are old and in that respect alone it is a history book. It gives an indication of thinking processes and lifestyles from two thousand years ago (or as near as.)

I'm no aethiest...I do believe In God but not necessarily as depicted in the Bible. I am a regular reader of the Bible because I find it fascinating.

To somewhat I agree with that Christina, but what I mean was that it is not an accurate source for historical real world events.... we're still struggling to find actual evidence that the "biblical flood" actually happened for example...

reply to post by Creedo


Struggling to find? Please, you're way too kind in that statement. There is a definitive lack of evidence for this story and it is purely impossible.

The only manner in which the Bible is historical is in studying how it developed and how that development was influenced by culture and how the book influenced individuals historically.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul



Chuck Missler-Digging up the Truth (Biblical Archeology) part 1

2010: Noah's Ark found?


I kindly disagree Madness.

reply to post by Creedo


This is rubbish lol...I can't have debate with concensus. Where's all the condemnations to hell for questioning the word of God. No, the Bible is certainly not an historical source when it comes to things like Exodus, passover etc. Although Roman Emperors are placed correctly in time...as is the occupation of Palestine by the Romans. A little bit of truth here and there surrounded by historical myth. That's the 'big lie' technique isn't it.

So what gave status 2000 plus years ago in the eyes of the people of the time? - it gives us that. An insight into mind....that's interesting.

Originally posted by christina-66
Now....in the beginning was The Word...but before I speak I tend to think first. Thinking is electro chemical energy and connections. Electro chemical connections pervade and enable all life. Everywhere and everything. That is my idea of God.

It doesn't matter how one defines God. He is omnipotent and will choose the best way to manifest to his children. What matters is that there is love between us. If we love one another, we are doing God's will, regardless how we see him.

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Ok, I'm just going to spell this out in large letters and slowly:


Where the geologic evidence?

Where is the genetic evidence?

And different people find Noah's ark in different places every couple of years. The boat isn't all that important. Big pieces of wood can get onto mountains in all sorts of ways. The only things that matter in this discussion are geology and genetics, as they would be the easiest and most definitive ways to prove that the tale is true or at least the general ideas (global flood, rescue of incredibly small gene pool of all animals on the planet) are correct.

Archeology? Not going to cut it.

reply to post by madnessinmysoul

Ok, I'm just going to spell this out in large letters and slowly:

I'm not responding until you drop the arrogance and rudeness.

Try again.

Madness, didn't you mention something to the effect about the "walls of Jericho" not falling?

Bible 1, Skeptics 0

Science: Score One for the Bible

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Madness, didn't you mention something to the effect about the "walls of Jericho" not falling?

Bible 1, Skeptics 0

Science: Score One for the Bible

From the source provided:

Wood says that the city's walls could have come tumbling down at just the right time to match the biblical account. While that does not prove that the event happened, it does give plausibility to the Old Testament version. Read more: www.time.com...

All is see is "could have", "does not prove"........ this is hypothesis and one theory and hardly merits a "Bible 1, Skeptics 0" score....

Never minding the Old Testament because that is the book of "Old" laws and is more a history of one tribe of man, but what I wonder is why would ANYONE want to prove the New Testament as false? Even if it isn't historical, even if it is pulled from the imaginings of some deranged writer, the teachings of the character in the story, Jesus Christ, ARE true. At least they should be found to be true by any man or woman who desires to be free from the world of oppression and tyranny we have created. They are lessons in how to build a better Kingdom than the one ruled by Rome where all must compete against one another for mere survival. They teach that God is found within each and everyone of us thereby freeing us from the bondsman status of the Church.

Why would any person in their right mind dispute the teachings? Does one enjoy the life of servitude to other men?

Christs two great commandments were to Love god with all your being (God is all that is within you and without you), and your neighbor as yourself.

All of his teachings were based off these two commandments. He recognised all as his equals, children of God.

Why would you not find this true?

Do people actually enjoy the systems of iniquity we have today? Do people enjoy being a slave to a system of Empire? Is the worldly wealth so fantastic that you would support the system that enslaves your childrens childrens children?

This is madness. No other person in history has whether real or imagined taught such a simple truth that it shook the very foundations of society as we had come to know it.

Was horrible things done in the name of Christ and his teachings? Absolutely! What better way to discredit the teachings than to do horrible things that are contrary to them? What better way to get people to hate the teachings than to make them fearful of what they say?

Some one please tell me what they do not believe about what Christ taught? His teachings are true and I will show you why. I will be his advocate to you.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by Creedo
reply to post by Slipdig1

 

The problem though is the Bible IS NOT a history book... It never was and never will be.

You think its not a history book, because you don't believe it is. I don't think the greeks were real, they were only written about in books and how do you know those history books are real?

It is a history book, Its the history of the jews and of the gentiles after. Just because you don't believe it doesn't make it any less true.

Originally posted by Creedo

Originally posted by christina-66
reply to post by Creedo

 

No matter what can be said for, or against, the Bible it's writings are old and in that respect alone it is a history book. It gives an indication of thinking processes and lifestyles from two thousand years ago (or as near as.)

I'm no aethiest...I do believe In God but not necessarily as depicted in the Bible. I am a regular reader of the Bible because I find it fascinating.

To somewhat I agree with that Christina, but what I mean was that it is not an accurate source for historical real world events.... we're still struggling to find actual evidence that the "biblical flood" actually happened for example...

Watermarks half way up the pyramids. There is alot of evidence of big floods. If you bothered to look. There world back then, would have been alot smaller, so a flood of there whole world was entirely possible.

reply to post by fordrew


If god pretty much wrote the bible he needs to go back to school its full of contradictions and isn't even good fiction.

Originally posted by Creedo

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Madness, didn't you mention something to the effect about the "walls of Jericho" not falling?

Bible 1, Skeptics 0

Science: Score One for the Bible

From the source provided:

Wood says that the city's walls could have come tumbling down at just the right time to match the biblical account. While that does not prove that the event happened, it does give plausibility to the Old Testament version. Read more: www.time.com...

All is see is "could have", "does not prove"........ this is hypothesis and one theory and hardly merits a "Bible 1, Skeptics 0" score....

You're wrong sir, Madness recently stated there was no evidence the walls of Jericho fell. This is NOT accurate. In fact, archaeology has uncovered evidence that the Biblical account is accurate. The walls fell, the city burned, and it was a sudden destruction not a siege.

And from TIME magazine it's not a Christian source.

Originally posted by Hellspike
reply to post by fordrew

 

If god pretty much wrote the bible he needs to go back to school its full of contradictions and isn't even good fiction.

What is contradictory in Christs teachings?

With Love,

Your Brother

There are quite alot actually but dont take my word for it check this out.

www.youtube.com...