Ordo Templi Orientis

Has anyone had any encounters with the Ordo Templi Orientis or OTO? Once again I was looking for Templar groups and then came acorss them. It sounded interesting but then I came across the Crowley stuff.

Any ideas?


oto-usa.org...

I would also like information particularly on the Typhonian O.T.O.

I mention them in this thread....www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Typhonian O.T.O. is concerned with effective transmissions and communications from 'outerspace' for the purpose of opening Gateways. The Typhonian 'deities' denote specific operations of psycho-physical alchemy which involve essences or elixirs secreted (thrown out and/or considered unclean) by the human organism. Its formula is that of the XI� involving kalas that are entirely absent from the masculine organism.

Originally posted by Mundane Egg
Has anyone had any encounters with the Ordo Templi Orientis or OTO? Once again I was looking for Templar groups and then came acorss them. It sounded interesting but then I came across the Crowley stuff.

I�m a former associate member of O.T.O. The order was founded in 1899 by Dr. Theodore Reuss of Germany, and was originally a merger of several Masonic Rites, viz., the Rites of Memphis and Mitzraim.
A few years later, Reuss dropped the Masonic requirement, and began initiating non-Masons and women.
In 1912, Reuss made Aleister Crowley the Grand Master of O.T.O. in the U.K. Several years later, Reuss resigned his office after suffering a stroke, and made Crowley international Grand Master.
Crowley re-wrote the Order�s ritual so as not to conflict with regular Masonry, and to infuse them with his Thelemic religio-philosophies. Today, the O.T.O. is firmly based on Crowley�s religious teachings.

Fiat Lvx.

Sooo...would you recommend the OTO?

Maybe I have received prejudicial info on Crowley throughout the years....I like what I read about the organization until I came across Crowley.

The organization claims (so I think) a Templar connection - but I am not seeing it.

Any insight would be great.

Take it easy,

ME

Originally posted by Mundane Egg
Sooo...would you recommend the OTO?

That depends on what you�re looking for. For the most part, O.T.O. is a club of hippies and beatniks who idolize Crowley. For example, Jack Kerouac, whom you quoted, used to hang out with the O.T.O. folks a lot (especially Lenore Kendall and the other Frisco poets who were interested in mysticism and magic). Allen Ginsberg, although not a member himself, was a friend of Karl Germer, who became International Grand Master of O.T.O. when Crowley died.
The O.T.O. became a hot spot for hippies in the 1960�s. The Order stressed creative genius and rebellion to authority, these characteristics having been personified by their prophet, Aleister Crowley. People like John Lennon, Jimmy Page, and Jim Morrison began to publicly praise Crowley, which added to the O.T.O.�s popularity among rebellious youth.

The organization claims (so I think) a Templar connection - but I am not seeing it.

It does indeed. In English, they translate �Ordo Templi Orientis� as �Order of Oriental Templars.� But they have little, if anything, in common with the historical Knights Templar. O.T.O. is a combination of Islamic mysticism, Qabalah, Yoga, free love, rock �n� roll, and some really wild parties.

[Edited on 2-6-2004 by Masonic Light]

it's great if you want to have orgies and dedicate/channel through intent, your 'sexmagick' to lucifer(the true god, according to them).
it's great if you like to watch(or be) the girl who gets boffed by everyone in the room. it's also great if you like working your way up through hierarchies.
it's great if you like line-dancing, in other words.

Billy Bob

You make it sound so appealing
except for the line dancing...
what about disco?
the Hustle now that is litrugy

So do they really think Lucifer is the one true
I thought that they were - any path - any deity -

I like what I see but need some wise sagely advice on this please

Originally posted by Mundane Egg


So do they really think Lucifer is the one true
I thought that they were - any path - any deity -

�No� to all of the above. To join the O.T.O., one must be a Thelemite, Thelema being the name of the occult religion founded by Aleister Crowley.
Thelemites are generally pantheistic, although this term is not completely accurate. The motto of the O.T.O. is �Deus est Homo�, which means �God Is Man.�
They do not believe in God in the conventional sense, nor do they believe in the Christian concept of Lucifer. However, on occasion, Crowley (like the Theosophists) used the term �Lucifer� to refer to the occult force that the Hindus call �kundalini�, and he once wrote a poem called �Hymn To Lucifer�.
Thelema is basically a solar religion, and the most important God is Ra-Hoor Khuit, a/k/a/, �Horus,� who represents the sun. Crowley proclaimed the arrival of the �Aeon of Horus� in 1904, which is year 0 on the Thelemic calendar.
The O.T.O.�s religious body is the Ecclesia Gnostica Catholica, or Gnostic Catholic Church. The E.G.C. celebrates a Gnostic Mass which was written by Crowley for the Church. The Mass is dedicated to the worship of Nuit, the ancient Egyptian goddess of the stars, whom Crowley identified with the Ain Soph of the Qabalah.
Crowley�s major literary works are �Magick In Theory and Practice�, �Magick Without Tears�, �The Holy Books of Thelema� (which constitutes the religion�s Holy Canon of Scripture), �The Vision and the Voice�, �The Equinox of the Gods�, and �The Book of Thoth.� Most of these can be read online at:

www.hermetic.com...

However, Crowley often wrote in a code that he meant to be incomprehensible to the uninitiated, or, at least, to those unfamiliar with the magical formula of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn.

Fiat Lvx.


[Edited on 2-6-2004 by Masonic Light]

Originally posted by Masonic Light
In 1912, Reuss made Aleister Crowley the Grand Master of O.T.O.

Greetings Brethren and Fellows,
Actually my Brother, it was 1922. I have had encounters with the Ordo Templi Orientis - Though not a member, I have come across many in my time. Actually, quite recently I met a Frater that mentioned he had travelled the Aethyrs and passed thiry Trials, the last of which was a three day long crucifiction in order to be purified. Very interesting indeed. I thank you for your attention.

Regards,
Bro. Daniel Brown

Originally posted by Decretal
Actually my Brother, it was 1922.

You may have misunderstood my meaning. Crowley was appointed Grand Master of the O.T.O. for the British Isles in 1912 by Reuss., who was Frater Superior. However, in 1922, Crowley became Frater Superior and International Grand Master upon Reuss� resignation due to ill health.

Fiat Lvx.

Originally posted by Masonic Light

You may have misunderstood my meaning. Crowley was appointed Grand Master of the O.T.O. for the British Isles in 1912 by Reuss., who was Frater Superior. However, in 1922, Crowley became Frater Superior and International Grand Master upon Reuss� resignation due to ill health.

Fiat Lvx.

Greetings Bro. ML,
I apologise for my mistake - I was speed reading through the posts. Thank you for holding back your temper as others failed to do in numerous posts.

Regards,
Bro. Daniel Brown

You mentioned Horus a few posts back is that the same God that the all seeing eye belongs to?


You said that Crowley used an incomprehensible code so that means it does little good for the rest of us to read his writings.

Originally posted by TgSoe
You mentioned Horus a few posts back is that the same God that the all seeing eye belongs to?

Yes. This Symbol is one of the most important in all of Occultism. In the Egyptian myth cycle, the reptilian god Set (probably where the word �Satan� is derived from) murdered the Sun God Osiris in cold blood. Osiris� son, Horus, sought vengeance, and launched a battle against Set and his armies of darkness.
Horus won, and banished Set to the infernal regions. However, during the course of the battle, Horus lost an eye to Set�s sword.
Thoth, the God of Science and Magick, placed the Eye of Horus on the heavens, which became the Sun, the source of light and life.
This Egyptian myth was probably borrowed from an older Indian myth, concerning the Eye of Shiva. The occult interpretation of the Symbol is that it refers to the �Third Eye�, or Sahasrara Chakra. This symbolism is also perpetuated by pious Hindus, who wear a red dot on their foreheads to represent the Third Eye, and may also be the reason that the Priests of Christendom mark the foreheads of their flock on Ash Wednesday. According to occult doctrine, the power to open the Third Eye, attaining Samadhi, is based upon the Adept�s ability to consciously control the kundalini force, which is derived from solar energy interacting with the nervous system.
You can see a photo of Crowley wearing the Eye here:
www.rosslyn.org...

You said that Crowley used an incomprehensible code so that means it does little good for the rest of us to read his writings.

It depends. If Crowley is writing on politics or religion or whatever, anyone can follow him. But his magical formulas and jokes are often encoded.
For example, in one book he writes �Frater Perdurabo is but an Eye; what Eye, no Man knoweth.� (Frater Perdurabo was Crowley�s Golden Dawn name). Looking at the index, he says that all references to an Eye in that particular chapter refer to the anus. In other words, he was saying that he was an a**hole!

An example of his encrypted magical formula can be found in his book �Magick In Theory Practice�, where he talks about �human sacrifice.� He of course isn�t referring to killing people, but is alluding to tantric sex magic. In Tantra, the male withholds orgasm, and does not ejaculate. In other words, the opportunity to create a human (through conception) is �sacrificed�. But Crowley, who had a penchant for dark comedy, preferred to talk about �human sacrifice� and the �bloody sacrifice� (i.e., when ejaculation occurs). To add to the joke, he writes in a footnote to the chapter on human sacrifice and bloody sacrifice, that anyone who misunderstands what he just wrote is bound to get in trouble!

Fiat Lvx.



[edit on 11-6-2004 by Masonic Light]

"some really wild parties""

What do you mean by really wild parties. Could you elaborate on that just a little. I'm just curious. What goes on at those parties?

In the old days, they were all '___' parties, and people such as Allen Ginsberg, Timothy Leary, and John Lennon were known to frequent them, although none of these three were actually members of O.T.O.
Perhaps I should point out that today's O.T.O. no longer allows the use of illegal drugs at official functions, even so called "spiritual drugs" like acid, mesc, and shrooms. The wild parties of the good old days of yore have turned into "study groups", Iron Butterfly and the Beatles have been replaced by Bach and Dead Can Dance, and bourbon takes a backseat to espresso.
But even though O.T.O. functions are much more tame than they used to be, you can still meet some...er..."interesting" folks.

Would you call it a cult? Why or why not?

Originally posted by Masonic Light
Yes. This Symbol is one of the most important in all of Occultism. In the Egyptian myth cycle, the reptilian god Set (probably where the word �Satan� is derived from) murdered the Sun God Osiris in cold blood. Osiris� son, Horus, sought vengeance, and launched a battle against Set and his armies of darkness.

Greetings Brother,
It is true that the term 'Satan' is derived from the Ancient Egyptian God Set. But your statement that he was a Reptilian is incorrect - I have a friend that is a Priest at the Temple of Set... U2U for more info.

Regards,
Bro. Daniel Brown

P.S. Please view the 'Comments on Decretal' thread to see my invitation for you to join a Research Group.

HERE"Set was usually depicted in human form with a head of indeterminate origin, though said to resemble that of an aardvark."

I have heard of Set, in fiction books by White Wolf Ent. as a serpent, but never other then there.

[edit on 12-6-2004 by Darktalon]

Originally posted by miltie
Would you call it a cult? Why or why not?

Depends on how you define �cult�. Technically, any religious group can be classified as a �cult�. This is true from O.T.O. to the local First Baptist Church. This is also why the Roman Catholic Church officially calls a marriage between a Catholic and a non-Catholic a �diversity of cult�, requiring special dispensation from the Bishop.
But the common meaning of �cult� is any religious group that deviates from the norm. In this case, if Thelema is the norm, then O.T.O. is not a cult because it is �orthodox� Thelema. However, if a fringe group were to secede from O.T.O. to form a new sect based on Thelema, this group would be a �cult�, if the original teachings had been altered.

Concerning Set, it depends on the reference. The Papyrus of Ani depicts Set with the head of a jackal. However, the Hellenistic Egyptians depicted him as reptilian, with the head of a crocodile, and is why ancient paintings of Harpocrates show this God stepping on the back of a crocodile (i.e., to show Horus having conquered Set).
The O.T.O. has generally used the Greek basis of identifying Set with the crocodiles of the Nile instead of in his aspect as a grave-robbing jackal, and is why I referred to him as �reptilian� in this thread concerning O.T.O.

Fiat Lvx.

Did the Serpent dictate to Crowley the Book Of The Law?


II,22 it says " I am the Snake that giveth Knowledge & Delight and bright glory, and stir the hearts of men with drunkenness.To worship me take wine and strange drugs whereof I will tell my prophet, & be drunk thereof! They shall not harm you at all. It is a lie, this folly against self. The exposure of innocence is a lie. Be strong, O man! lust, enjoy all things of sense and rapture: fear not any God shall deny thee of this. II,23 I am alone: there is no God where I am. "

In III,11 it says- " Worship me with fire and blood; worship me with swords & spears. Let the woman be girt with a sword before me: let blood flow to my name. Trample down the heathen; be upon them, O warrior, I will give you of thier flesh to eat! III, 12 Sacrifice cattle, little and big:after a child."


How about this one? - III,43 Let the scarlet woman beware! If pity and compassion and tendeness visit her heart; if she leave my work to toy with old sweetness; then shall my vengence be known. I will slay me her child : I will alienate her heart: I will cast her out from men: as a shrinking and despised harlot shall she crawl through dusk wet streets, and die cold and an-hungered. III,44 But let her raise herself in pride! Let her follow me in my way! Let her work the work of wickedness! Let her kill her heart! Let her be loud and adulterous! Let her be covered with Jewels, and rich garments, and let her be shameless before all men!"

Anyhow thats some deep stuff, it doesn't seem to me like something that a man made just made up. Who is the scarlet woman by the way?