Record low temperatures in 46 states during June

reply to post by drwizardphd


I generally agree with you... except for this:

Originally posted by drwizardphd
I have already stated that climate change is a natural cycle that has happened thousands of times before in earth's history. To deny that it is happening is outright ridiculous. I will say it again, the planet is warming. The data that you posted proves it conclusively.

When you say the planet is warming, you obviously aren't reffering to the trend for the last 5-10 years. Are you referring to the overall trend for the last 150 years, since we've been warming from the LIA?

Then theoretically, you should have said "the planet has been warming". Because noone knows (certainly not the IPCC) whether this recent cooling trend could carry on. There's no gaurantees we are going to start warming again. Trends have to end some time. Here's an up to date graph of globally averaged temperatures since 1979.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4f12ee21702a.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by freestonew
i wonder how Australia is doing?

Well I'm not in Oz, but close

Here in NZ we've had one of our coldest winters in a long time. In the area I live, called Bay of Plenty, we generally get mild winters (no snow) and warm summers. I haven't seen any actual data on temperatures, but I can say we've had more frosts this winter than the last few winters combined.

I can't say I'm complaining too much. We may have another bumper snow season, after our record snow levels last year.
Just hope it doesn't start seriously affecting crops here.

[edit on 7-7-2009 by Curious and Concerned]

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned

When you say the planet is warming, you obviously aren't reffering to the trend for the last 5-10 years. Are you referring to the overall trend for the last 150 years, since we've been warming from the LIA?

Well, we have been warming, and we are warming. It goes without question that we have been warming since the Little Ice Age.

However, over the last 10 years the planet has been growing rather consistently warmer (as consistent as temperatures can be). Your graph shows it, as well as many others.

(You'll have to accept my apologies as I'm still not entirely sure how to format and display images on this forum)

North ern Hemisphere Temperature This Decade Higher Than The Last 1300 Years, Say Researchers

Temperature Record Since 1880

GISS 2007 Temperature Analysis

Temperature Record of the Past 1000 Years

Very warm 2008 makes this the hottest decade in recorded history by far

In any event, according to the BBC we might be entering a cooling phase beginning next decade, however it will sadly only last until around 2020, when temperatures will likely begin to rise again.

Next decade 'may see no warming'


So while you are correct that there will be a cooling trend, and it may be starting to begin as early as next year, you are incorrect in that cooling has happened in the past 5-10 years. Also, many scientists seem to predict that on a larger scale, the earth will continue to warm over the next century.

Whether or not that will actually happen is up to debate, as no one can very accurately predict the future. However, as I have said before, Global Warming is a mostly natural event, and it is an event that is being exploited by our government and corporate interests in order to obtain financial gains at the expense of the working class.

Originally posted by drwizardphd
Well, we have been warming, and we are warming. It goes without question that we have been warming since the Little Ice Age.

However, over the last 10 years the planet has been growing rather consistently warmer (as consistent as temperatures can be).

No it hasn't. When you look at a linear trend, it looks more like this.

or, you can see what Atmospheric physicist Richard Lindzen has to say about it Here

or theoretical physicist Lubos Motl Here

How about NOAA? You like NOAA, right? You'll accept opinion from them, I wager.

Here's a couple of NOAA scientists talking current cooling maybe continuing for decades.

Just for the Hell of it. Let's throw in Jarl R. Ahlbeck D.Sc. and lecturer at Abo Akademi University, Finland

Your graph shows it, as well as many others.

No it doesn't. You can see what that graph shows clearer here...

That one only goes to 2008. It cooled more after that. You can see that in the first graph.



[edit on 8-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 8-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 8-7-2009 by Ntity]

[edit on 8-7-2009 by Ntity]

Oh and as far as this piece of junk goes...

North ern Hemisphere Temperature This Decade Higher Than The Last 1300 Years, Say Researchers

Wanna try some actual science, from actual scientists citing enough peer review to choke a horse explaining why Michael Mann (the hockey stick graph guy) is wrong about that?

Here ya go.

"Don't confuse weather with climate," said WCCO's Chief Meteorologist Paul Douglas. "Weather is a snapshot, climate is a long term trend."

In other words, weather is what happens at any given moment in the atmosphere while climate is how the atmosphere behaves over decades and centuries.

Paul said the term global warming can be misleading.

"I think a better description is probably climate change because there are going to be regional variations across the globe," he said.

We need to keep a global perspective in mind because while the United States is experience record cold, some of Europe and Asia are seeing record warmth.

"Don't look out the window and make assumptions about long-term climate," said Paul. "But that goes both ways. In the summertime on the hot humid days we can't beat our chest and say this is global warming."

reply to post by ~Lucidity


Very well then Lucidity. Explain it to me. Explain to me why CO2 is not showing up as the main driver of the short term global temperature trend for the last, at least 7 years, but it will show itself to be the main driver of global climate in 30 years.

Originally posted by Ntity
reply to post by ~Lucidity

 

Very well then Lucidity. Explain it to me. Explain to me why CO2 is not showing up as the main driver of the short term global temperature trend for the last, at least 7 years, but it will show itself to be the main driver of global climate in 30 years.

Huh? All I was trying to show by posting that interview was that weather and climate are two different things and that some people may be quite right in saying that global "warming" may not have been the best term to describe the effects or results of what we're doing or what is happening naturally. It confuses people when they hear "warming" when in essence some places will be colder, some drier, some wetter.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


Ah, OK. I see. I thought you were making the weather versus climate argument in reply to the previous post which asserted short term trends (7, or more years) do matter.


[edit on 8-7-2009 by Ntity]

Has anyone considered that increased CO2 in our atmosphere actually causes cooling instead of warming?

Youtube: The Great Global Warming Swindle

Also, I have recoded it for WinMedia found here

Rapid share Link to Recode of The Great Global Warming Swindle

It is about 1 hr 15 mins. In this film it asserts that Global Warming is bogus and gives evidence that CO2 is not the culprit and Cap and Trade is just BS (which we already know). However, the science presented is very enlightening and should be considered for your edification.

I think it might clear the air on a few levels in regards to mis-conceptions. However, I cannot help you with any precognitions with disregarding evidence when presented in a logical manner by scientists. So, in translation: Take a look, see if it jives and make up your own mind.

Originally posted by drwizardphd
However, over the last 10 years the planet has been growing rather consistently warmer (as consistent as temperatures can be). Your graph shows it, as well as many others.

Are you looking at the same graph? To me it appeared to level off then start to dip. Yes, the temperatures were higher than they were 150 years ago, but a higher constant temperature does not = warming.

So while you are correct that there will be a cooling trend, and it may be starting to begin as early as next year, you are incorrect in that cooling has happened in the past 5-10 years. Also, many scientists seem to predict that on a larger scale, the earth will continue to warm over the next century.

Really?? Is this incorrect?

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b5442db078d1.jpg[/atsimg]



[edit on 8-7-2009 by Curious and Concerned]

i wouldn't use 7 years as an example of climate change. Thats still short enough for any number of factors to be effecting temperature. We need graphs that span at least 150 years to get any kind of trend. Thats where a line of best fir should be drawn.

The earth is too fickle to play guessing games with. It is much to old to attempt to judge any trend on a 7 year timescale. realistically, we should be using more then a thousand years (as mini ice ages are probably caused by the sun). to chart change without the suns influence (in order to see if CO2 is a factor) we would need to know exactly how much energy the sun is exerting on our magnetosphere.

In other words, who cares anyway? we all know that man-made warming is a sham and it doesn't matter which way the temperatures going. all that matters is the money waisted and the fear generated.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


What your data fails to show is that although there were 307 record low temperatures set in June there were also 691 record high temps during the same period!

Perhaps "climate change" is indeed the correct term.

reply to post by Kevin_X2


I wasn't using it as an example of climate change, but as a reply to the post saying we had still been warming over the last 5-10 years. But yes, I agree with you