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Then 7's collapse is studied by these SE's and FE's, and give their best reason why it fell, using every tool available to them. The vast majority of these professionals accept what is said.
Originally posted by jprophet420
Because hundreds of their peers disagree.
You can't say "The vast majority of these professionals accept what is said" without a data sample. Show me a scientific pool where 1500 or so professionals have reviewed both sides of the data and agree with NIST.
Originally posted by jprophet420
You can't say "The vast majority of these professionals accept what is said" without a data sample.
It's entirely possible that ANY building could fall from fire effects.
There's a reason why these effects are studied in the SE trade
Apparently, SE's and fire science engineers are convunced that buildings can indeed fail without these countermeasures.
The only thing that can be gleaned from the fact that a majority of buildings DON'T fail is because these SE's do a pretty good job.
So give them their props for that.
This alone is enough to prove you have not actually read the NIST report in depth or understood their conclusions.
This claim you will find repeated on many conspiracy websites throughout the internet, but it is completely ignorant of what NIST was testing, or what actually occured in the floor tests.
How can you expect to argue against the 'official story', when you have not even read the 'official story' well enough to understand it?
Because hundreds of their peers disagree.
You can't say "The vast majority of these professionals accept what is said" without a data sample. Show me a scientific pool where 1500 or so professionals have reviewed both sides of the data and agree with NIST.
Regardless the 'hundreds' of peers are actually quite a lot less than hundreds, and many of them say insane things like claiming the buildings were brought down by nuclear weapons.
Perhaps you could produce a list of people who have viewed the NIST report and alternative theories, and tell us what they say.
Originally posted by jprophet420
You're right, you could. It would then be an unfounded statement and everyone who uses logic would disregard it.
Originally posted by hgfbob
all NIST released was their HYPOTHESIS...they DID NOT, and REFUSE to release the data, as to HOW they came to those conclusions, as a TRUE PEER-REVIEW is suppose to...that is the WHOLE idea behind peer-review
Originally posted by Badgered1
would there be no 'heat sink' effect from the steel that was connected, but not in the areas of the fires?
All the subsequent reports from SE's and FE's agree that there is nothing wrong with NIST's report on 7 or the TT. There's your peer review.
Thank you for visiting The Journal of 9/11 Studies, a peer-reviewed, open-access, electronic-only journal, covering the whole of research related to the events of 11 September, 2001.
Originally posted by jprophet420
Actually, the NIST report is not peer reviewed
posted by Badgered1
would there be no 'heat sink' effect from the steel that was connected, but not in the areas of the fires?
posted by Joey Canoli
Not much of one, at any rate.
The heat would have to transfer through the bolts and connections, so it really wouldn't matter much how large the "sink" was.
Originally posted by SPreston
Are you claiming that heat in steel beams will not disperse to cooler steel areas through thousands of steel bolts and other steel connections?
I have burned my hand holding on to a steel piece which was bolted to another steel piece several feet away which was cut with a torch.
The entire steel structure including the steel core would be a heat sink.
Originally posted by Joey Canoli
Originally posted by jprophet420
Actually, the NIST report is not peer reviewed
Well, when several qualified SE's/FE's put out white papers that discusses the findings in the report, personally, I'd call that a peer review.
But feel free to think otherwise.
Originally posted by Joey Canoli
Originally posted by hgfbob
all NIST released was their HYPOTHESIS...they DID NOT, and REFUSE to release the data, as to HOW they came to those conclusions, as a TRUE PEER-REVIEW is suppose to...that is the WHOLE idea behind peer-review
All the subsequent reports from SE's and FE's agree that there is nothing wrong with NIST's report on 7 or the TT. There's your peer review.
Also, I believe that you can purchase data from NIST if you want. There's a thread about that right now, I believe. Also, you need to take into account that the structural docs are not public property. So NIST isn't allowed - by law - to just release them to the public. Some info is available, for it was necessary to justify their conclusions in both reports (7 and TT), but like I said, if you want to purchase them, go right ahead.
Originally posted by Joey Canoli
Originally posted by SPreston
Are you claiming that heat in steel beams will not disperse to cooler steel areas through thousands of steel bolts and other steel connections?
I have burned my hand holding on to a steel piece which was bolted to another steel piece several feet away which was cut with a torch.
The entire steel structure including the steel core would be a heat sink.
Nope.
That's too bad. Cuz I've held onto a steel piece that was cut with a torch less than a foot away and didn't get burned.
Yes it would. it just wouldn't conduct heat away as fast as a continuous piece. It's called physics. Heat can only move x fast through steel, aluminum, fire insulation, etc. Cross sectional area comes into play here. When it is necked down in the connection areas, heat conduction rate gets necked down.
Originally posted by Joey Canoli
Originally posted by hgfbob
all NIST released was their HYPOTHESIS...they DID NOT, and REFUSE to release the data, as to HOW they came to those conclusions, as a TRUE PEER-REVIEW is suppose to...that is the WHOLE idea behind peer-review
All the subsequent reports from SE's and FE's agree that there is nothing wrong with NIST's report on 7 or the TT. There's your peer review.