For all those who thing Gitmo is necessary..

The Guantanamo Handbook... this is an experiment in which several volunteers participated in a *mild* re-creation of Guantanamo's Interrogation Techniques and treatment of prisoners with those who believe GITMO is needed and doesnt torture people by definition...
Interestingly enough only 2 out of the original 8 actually made it the entire 48 hours.. and keep in mind everything in the video is "legal" and is a very mild representation of what some of these guys have to go through.. that Canadian boy included...

It's a lengthy video but it is definately for the people who believe GITMO is a necessary evil and should continue to operate as such

www.surfthechannel.com...

Wow. Really, wow. Enduring that for 48hrs looks horrific enough, never mind 7 years! Imagine enduring that day in day out? I can't even begin to imagine.

One question that's never been answered for me on Gitmo from those that thinks it's neccessary is this - if these people deserve to be in there, if they have really commited a terrorist act, why have they not been charged?

We can debate the methods, the justification, the rights and wrongs of it till the cows come home, but the fundamental question is, if they are guilty then why have charges not been brought against them?

The next question is, if these people can be held and tortured for years without charge or proof of guilt, what is to stop them doing it to you?

These are 2 questions that no Gitmo supporter has ever been able to answer. Hopefully some supports of legal torture might come onto this thread for a try after watching the video.

Originally posted by Nammu
Wow. Really, wow. Enduring that for 48hrs looks horrific enough, never mind 7 years! Imagine enduring that day in day out? I can't even begin to imagine.

One question that's never been answered for me on Gitmo from those that thinks it's neccessary is this - if these people deserve to be in there, if they have really commited a terrorist act, why have they not been charged?

We can debate the methods, the justification, the rights and wrongs of it till the cows come home, but the fundamental question is, if they are guilty then why have charges not been brought against them?

The next question is, if these people can be held and tortured for years without charge or proof of guilt, what is to stop them doing it to you?

These are 2 questions that no Gitmo supporter has ever been able to answer. Hopefully some supports of legal torture might come onto this thread for a try after watching the video.

very good point my friend... see I like the video because just before and while there doing the experiement they flash back to video interviews of some of the volunteers before hand saying "They get what they deserve... it keeps us safe keep doing it da-da-da" and then having been through the experience of BEING innocent and by the end of it strongly oppose and cant imagine the harsher treatment some of these prisoners endure... I believe all supporters should watch this video

thanks for the feedback

[edit on 16-7-2008 by ToolFanMael]

I can't believe there isn't more comments on this!

Coupled with posts like this - Federal Court: Bush Can 'Indefinitely' Detain Civilians! - I'm really starting to fear for the American public.

The sensory deprivation that they use in Gitmo is a horrible method of torture (not that the other torture isn't horrible) that is designed to drive you mad. I've even heard that they play the Barney 'I love you, you love me' song over and over again to break prisoners. *shudder*. That would drive anyone insane!

The simple truth of the matter, and one that is highlighted very very well in the conclusion of this video, is that how can we spend years breaking down these people, torturing them and literally driving them insane, then trust their 'confession', or even any information they give?

While I don't approve of some of the methods in Gitmo used to break people I do believe they need to either be convicted and tried or released. Taxpayers dollars are paying for these guys to live there and its not that I'm coldhearted but the law system takes to damn long and justice isn't what it should be. Case in point, a person is convicted for trying to commit murder and they get life imprisonment. What the hell good is that going to do if they are going to die in prison anyways? Save taxpayers money and kill them, instead of spending thousands and thousands of dollars on someone thats is going to die there. I'm talking about the repete violent ones, not the ones with one charge or lack of evidence. These monsters shouldn't get to wait on death row, they should be killed as soon as possible. And although it sounds horrible I am also all for an eye for an eye. Murder would be lower if they had to expeirence the same fate they put their victim through. Like a person that kills their child coldheartly by suffocation. They should die that way too. Why should they get a painless death, when they tortured a person? Anyways sorry about the rant but it seems lawlessness has got to stop and we need to get the people that deserver to be there in there and the ones that don't out.
Remember its just my opinion and hopefully no offense is taken.

-Aza

Originally posted by Azathoth
While I don't approve of some of the methods in Gitmo used to break people I do believe they need to either be convicted and tried or released. Taxpayers dollars are paying for these guys to live there and its not that I'm coldhearted but the law system takes to damn long and justice isn't what it should be. Case in point, a person is convicted for trying to commit murder and they get life imprisonment. What the hell good is that going to do if they are going to die in prison anyways? Save taxpayers money and kill them, instead of spending thousands and thousands of dollars on someone thats is going to die there. I'm talking about the repete violent ones, not the ones with one charge or lack of evidence. These monsters shouldn't get to wait on death row, they should be killed as soon as possible. And although it sounds horrible I am also all for an eye for an eye. Murder would be lower if they had to expeirence the same fate they put their victim through. Like a person that kills their child coldheartly by suffocation. They should die that way too. Why should they get a painless death, when they tortured a person? Anyways sorry about the rant but it seems lawlessness has got to stop and we need to get the people that deserver to be there in there and the ones that don't out.
Remember its just my opinion and hopefully no offense is taken.

-Aza

maybe callus but I agree 100% man... ya gotta think.. in some other countries.. ya steal they cut yer hand off, etc. I dont think too many ppl would be committing a crime if they were actually afraid of the punishment for sure man lol get the lawyers out of it.. especially in capital offences or brutal rape cases, etc. anyways I could go on and on... but you are absolutely right my friend

I'm sorry, I just had to laugh.

The words from your comment which must be highlighted are 'volunteers' and re-creation or better yet, 'simulation'.
What are you trying to prove with this fake, staged, liberal interpretation of events at Gitmo?
How do the people who made these video's really know what goes on in Gitmo? Where they there? Answer: NO!
Are they getting their info from the prisoners? If so, then it's even more worthless because what do you expect prisoners to say.

Double down thumbs for obvious liberal propaganda SIMULATION which does not have a solid base in reality or fact.

Since the Club Gitmo handbook came up...What about the Al-Queda handbook? The handbook that tells their members to cry torture whether they were or not?

Club Gitmo...a terrorist retreat from the stress of jihad!

Originally posted by WhatTheory

I'm sorry, I just had to laugh.

The words from your comment which must be highlighted are 'volunteers' and re-creation or better yet, 'simulation'.
What are you trying to prove with this fake, staged, liberal interpretation of events at Gitmo?
How do the people who made these video's really know what goes on in Gitmo? Where they there? Answer: NO!
Are they getting their info from the prisoners? If so, then it's even more worthless because what do you expect prisoners to say.

Double down thumbs for obvious liberal propaganda SIMULATION which does not have a solid base in reality or fact.

im not trying to prove anything.. I dont know why you think I am... I just think some people might get a better understanding of what goes on there... not saying its absolute truth... but you make a valid point none of us were there.. so how do we know what actually happened... but you think it couldnt have happened just because you expect prisoners to say they have been torture.. you weren't there so how do you know what happened?

you can double down thumbs all ya want I never crammed this down your throat dude... thats a valid point you bring up for sure yet can't read it and apply it to what you just replied to my thread with.. but hey.. if a prisoner says he was tortured... obviously he wasn't....

btw im nor liberal or American.. I just thought this might be of interest to some

[edit on 18-7-2008 by ToolFanMael]

Originally posted by ToolFanMael
im not trying to prove anything.. I dont know why you think I am... I just think some people might get a better understanding of what goes on there... not saying its absolute truth.

You are absolutely correct. I admit I did come across a little harsh and I apologize.

reply to post by WhatTheory


Plus you said the words "liberal propaganda".

These people are against torturing prisoners! They must be liberals! Damn those liberals!

Sometimes you gotta quit looking at things as conservative vs liberal. It's often better to look at them as right vs wrong - unless blind party allegiance is your style.

I just started to watch the video, and wow. Star and flag from me. I can't believe you haven't gotten a lot more already.

Don't forget to flag this thing people!

reply to post by ToolFanMael


This ain't nothing to see there ain't no terrorist being tortuerd, fake people?. More of your liberal terriorts loving crying for satins children.You cry for hungry folk to lazy to work like a real man,you think to tax me more because I hav more money then you?

I ain't fiting with these fake yank conservative who don't know how real conservative is.At least they ain't pinkys satin lovers.We take what we get fron living and if I take it all then the lord ment it.And if he gave the USAthe power now we must never stop until thier is no more satin, no more men to bleed or rapture from God o Mighty!Maybe I'm the only one here who will nver ferget!But we have an army of young beutiful christian children who will fite for our red white and blue.we have millions of um here and the real conservatives and our fondation give money to teach the angles what the liberal keep from school.They defi the lord so we spend tens of millions to teach about the evil liberal and satins army in the east!watch yourself and your tungs the president will here of your unpatriot talks and e-mails.the mexican base ain't big enough,so you need to go to church shut up and listen!

Originally posted by winged patriot
reply to post by ToolFanMael
[morewatch yourself and your tungs the president will here of your unpatriot talks and e-mails.

good thing im Canadian then eh?

the mexican base ain't big enough,so you need to go to church shut up and listen!

I have been to church... my mom was a minister of sorts for 15 years.. so I am not completely ignorant to the topic but thanks for playing