Ask a Mason

reply to post by emsed1


You both have to agree on the subject matter, when you are both ready U2U Forum Moderator MemoryShock and he will get you both set up.

Good luck to both of you, it should be very interesting

reply to post by 360Degrees


I know of a Prince Hall Mason whom I am good friends with, from a Georgia Lodge. He moved to North Carolina, where the Grand Lodge is voting this year to (hopefully) once and for all enable fraternal recognition. He could have waited until the Grand Lodge meeting, but he decided to demit from Prince Hall and join AF&AM and do the degrees again.

He told me that as an African American he felt like his experiences with Prince Hall were that they tended to be extremely discriminatory in letting anyone else of another race in. Conversely, he said his AF&AM lodge opened him with open arms and noted he was accepted far better than people of a non African-Americna race had been into his former lodge. Hes visited quite a few lodges since and said he never felt any sort of prejudice.

I'll trust the opinion of someone whose been in both. We have improvements to make in masonry, but I am proud to say its not nearly as bad as you are making it out to be nor is Prince Hall more accepting than any other "mainstream" branch.

reply to post by emsed1


FYI.....I will be leaving this post around 5:30 pm EST. If I should miss a reply/invitation to the forum, I will return in the morning

Originally posted by 360Degrees
I already belong to a brotherhood far more ancient, benevolent, and enlightened that Masonry could ever aspire to be. And guess what? Didn't cost me a dime---the way you charge your "brothers" for every degree they earn. In case you missed my earlier reply--I am far beyond anything you could pretend to teach or offer

I think this is the source of all the anger we are seeing here. 360degrees is a member of a fakemason or "Illuminati" wannabe group and I think hes upset that no one recognizes it, so hes taking it out on masonry (an ancient group that people actually do recognize).

reply to post by ALightinDarkness


I am glad to know your organization has come around. My point, from the beginning, was to point out a fallacy that has existed in your fraternity. Point being that, it is decieivng to propagate and profess one thing, and practice another. I agree, we can move on now.

This is the thread I was reading:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

and

www.abovetopsecret.com...

It looks like all we need to do is agree on a topic and we are good to go!

I hope you guys don't mind a short derail in the thread while we come up with a topic. I don't think 360Degrees can U2U yet so if nobody objects we might just use a couple of posts to line things out.

I was thinking I could throw something like, "Freemasonry does good stuff" out there and you can refute it, or you could throw out "Freemasonry does bad stuff" and I could refute.

Of course the topic would have to be much more narrow and specific than that but I think that's the general idea.

Some things that I found interesting that came up in this thread were things like:

- Freemasonry is racist

- Masons are being controlled by a higher order

- The purpose of masonry is to control people

- Masonry only exists to serve others

- Masons don't have any ulterior motives

Or something to that effect.

I almost think it would be a more interesting debate for me to throw something pro-masonry out there and then you can challenge me to prove it because it sort of puts the burden to stand up for my challenge.

Do any of these appeal to you?

Originally posted by 360Degrees
reply to post by emsed1

 

FYI.....I will be leaving this post around 5:30 pm EST. If I should miss a reply/invitation to the forum, I will return in the morning

No problem. I should be around tomorrow if I don't get to talk to you before then.

reply to post by ALightinDarkness


Really??? Hmmm...funny there are millions more in my fraternity than yours. It is WIDELY recognized--and trust me, Ive had more opportunites than not to join. No reason I didn't other than---just didn't want to. Oh, and by the way YOUR fraternity is built off MINE (hint, hint). But, alas, it's just one more thing you won't readily admit. But....again, let's move on. Unless, of course, you choose to go deeper

reply to post by emsed1


Certainly. Look, I am open to all discourse. I know my initial comments ruffled some feathers....but hey, like I said, I was speaking to fact--not making anything up. I LOVE intellectual discourse, but if I am involved, trust me, it will be based on truth and fact. Never, I should hope, on anything just for the sake of argument.

Ok fellows here is the link to Public Fight Club Pub (ATS Debates)

Please review the link and contact the one of the Moderators listed in the opining post,

reply to post by emsed1


I've got a great debate topic for you two. "How can one tell 360 something he doesn't know if he won't tell the rest of us what he DOES know?"

And just for grins, you two could swap positions so that you'd have to defend his not actually SAYING anything in his messages!

Loads of fun!

Originally posted by 360Degrees
reply to post by emsed1

 

Certainly. Look, I am open to all discourse. I know my initial comments ruffled some feathers....but hey, like I said, I was speaking to fact--not making anything up. I LOVE intellectual discourse, but if I am involved, trust me, it will be based on truth and fact. Never, I should hope, on anything just for the sake of argument.

I poked around some sites to see if I could come up with a good proposition to start with.

I kind of like this one (as if you were addressing me):

"Can you prove that the singular purpose of masonry is to 'make good men better'?"

or we could turn it around and I could ask:

"Can you prove that masonry has a purpose other than 'making good men better'?"

Are those too broad? I thought it might make a good starting point. Also if any of you others would like to suggest something please do.



EDIT:

Or.. (this could go either way).. "What color is the sky in your world?"

[edit on 7/17/08 by emsed1]

reply to post by 360Degrees


Yeah, it was what I expected. A member of some group that doesn't get the recognition you like, so attack the masons because they do get the recognition. Freemasonry was built off stone mason guilds, which exist today as professional societies not as fraternities. Why is it that almost everyone I see who is critical of masonry almost always claims to either have "been invited" when we don't invite or be a member of a uber-powerful society that they can't name?

As to everything else, no one is denying that masonry is not a reflection of the society it resides in. As with all old institutions, it along with everyone else has a history of discrimination which lodges are now fixing, and most have already fixed it. I am not sure I understand the source of all your anger and arguing over this. I never saw anyone deny this.

[edit on 17-7-2008 by ALightinDarkness]

reply to post by emsed1


"Can you prove that masonry has a purpose other than 'making good men better'?" seems like it could build into a pretty interesting thread.

Originally posted by 360Degrees
reply to post by emsed1

 

"Can you prove that masonry has a purpose other than 'making good men better'?" seems like it could build into a pretty interesting thread.

COOL!

I will contact the mods and set it up.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.

360Degrees and emsed1...

Please go back through this page and find Suaron's posts. There is a link for a Public commentary/debate topic discussion thread. Please discuss any further debate concerns there and when you have decided, you can u2u me.

For the member without enough posts...you are able to u2u Moderators(myself) so no worries.

Thank you.

Let's get this thread back on topic, Ladies and Gentlemen....

Originally posted by MemoryShock
360Degrees and emsed1...

Please go back through this page and find Suaron's posts. There is a link for a Public commentary/debate topic discussion thread. Please discuss any further debate concerns there and when you have decided, you can u2u me.

For the member without enough posts...you are able to u2u Moderators(myself) so no worries.

Thank you.

Let's get this thread back on topic, Ladies and Gentlemen....

Hi,

I just U2Ued you with the info. I think we are all set to go.

Thanks!

reply to post by ALightinDarkness


Well, actually, several replies attempted to deny this. Sorry you missed those---selectively so, I'm sure. As for anger--hmmm, not so much. What is there to be angry about? Masonry has never taken one iota from me. Again I WAS MAKING A POINT. Did you miss me JUST saying that also? Stone Masons Guilds....OK. Wow, really?

reply to post by lost in the midwest


Well if you're susceptible to the general population, that doesn't make Masons that great of an elitist sect/cult/brotherhood now does it?

reply to post by emsed1


I will have to navigate my way into the forum. Again--the site is new to me. Will you start, send me the thread (if that's how it begins) and I can work my way in from there. See ALIGHTIN THEDARKNESS, there is something I don't know...I KID YOU