How Has ATS Changed Your Views?

Hi Good People,

Since I became a member of ATS in December 2007, I have found myself becoming more skeptical and discerning regarding the UFO/Alien phenomena than I can ever remember, (30+ years). I believed far more easily pre ATS but now, my quest has steered toward the tangible proofs and not the hearsay. To be honest, my preconceived notion was that I would probably become a bigger believer in such a community. My experience at ATS has certainly surprised me!

What effect has ATS had on you?

1. Are you now a bigger believer than pre ATS?
   
2. Are you now more skeptical than pre ATS?
   

I would be interested to hear your stories on how ATS has changed your life and your perceptions/beliefs.

Please Note: This is NOT a thread dedicated to Pet Theories!

reply to post by InfaRedMan

Well, i guess that to find out how many cases turned out to be hoaxes, (many of them here), makes think that many are more skeptikal.
Frankly my experience here, so far hasn't changed my view:
i think that there must be intelligent life out there, but i don't think that the absence of proofs is a valid reason to "fabricate" ones.
In my opinion, to expose as many hoaxes/fakes/misinterpretations as possible, should help us to have a better idea of the phenomena:
so it happens that even former "blind believers" ask for evidencences supporting claims, for sources and so on.
But i prefer to call it improvement
ATS is unique in this: it acts like a school, but a "school" in which each "student" is free to decide which "teacher" actually adds something to his/her knowledge, and which one spreads BS (where for "teachers" i mean we ALL and for "students" i mean we ALL).


[edit on 7/4/2008 by internos]

For me I would have to say that I am much more skeptical since becoming a member here. I think that before ATS I would be much more prone to believe in a lot of non conventional beliefs such as alien life or government conspiracies. Since becoming a member, the debate that takes place on every thread I read is usually both informative and researched, and very uniformed and no research, just speculation. You just have to sort through and pick out the most likely explanations, use the facts presented, and decide for yourself. These debates have taught me that a lot of perceptions I may have had about these topics were not informed enough to make a decision about.

I would like to say that in my opinion, the most over researched area here is 9/11, and I have yet to see any real smoking gun or proof of conspiracy, only speculation, guesses, and uninformed decisions. Most of the time 'proof' of conspiracy on that topic winds up being proof that there is no conspiracy.

I could never get enough of my fellow members threads on NASA, Space, and our galaxy. They are the most informed, the best photos, and the most intelligents threads I find. As to alien life, I have always thought that it would take ignorance to believe that we are the only life in the universe. As to whether or not there is proof we are not alone, I have yet to see any definative proof.

ATS is unique in this: it acts like a school, but a "school" in which each "student" is free to decide which "teacher" actually adds something to his/her knowledge

Yeah! This is how I always thought of ATS! It's great that way!!

IRM- The reason I joined ATS was to discuss Aliens/UFOs. I was a firm believer in the hypothesis that some UFOs represent intelligently controlled machines not manufactured by humans. Since joining, my beliefs have slid around on the spectrum a bit. Overall, I would say they haven't changed too much, although I'm probably slightly more skeptical now than I was pre-ATS.

I've become even more disillusioned with humanity than I was before I came.

I understand truth seekers and schizophrenics, borderline personalities and dissociative disorders. I understand the need to find meaning and to see wonders and signs.

What sickens me is the glut of supposed covert therapists who are so determined to "seem like the rest" that they fall into a cookie-cutter routine of faux open-mindedness that actually reveals their unjustified confidence in the MMPE and the entire culture of psychiatry/psychology.

The nasty bugger of certainty is that it requires some conception of a mean, from which divergence (psychological, philosophical, epistemological) can be measured.

In other words, the number of people here who think they "have it all figured out" seems to be at least equal to the number of people here who are sincere seekers, prepared to see aliens crawling through their windows. I'd much rather spend time with the latter than the former, quite frankly, because at least they know that they don't know what the hell is "real" and what isn't.

So, my answer is that ATS would be a helluva lot better without so many piss poor "clerics" displaying their inner conflict over the unspoken mandate of remaining invisible and the need to be observed as brilliant and grounded.

[edit on 31-10-2008 by applebiter]

[edit on 31-10-2008 by applebiter]

reply to post by Scramjet76


Hey SJ76!

Thanks for resurrecting this tired old thread... LOL! It kind of died a quick death the first time around. Hopefully I can get more comments this time.

I guess for me, the biggest change in my views has been that of people and not necessarily the UFO/Alien phenomena itself. I still thoroughly believe in their existence.. and that they visit earth both in the past and present.

I have trouble believing the individual stories of my fellow humans. Sure some are true but many aren't. I sometimes think various people feel as though they need a story to belong to a certain 'club'.

Also the sensationalism and general paranoia that appears to surround them here repels me to a large degree... i.e" MILABS, Bluebeam, False Flag NWO Holographic Invasions and the like. It just feels like vanilla flavored fear mongering to me... and us humans aren't renowned for that behavior at all are we... lol!

I like to involve my energies in the solid, down to earth investigative threads. One's that take an honest approach in solving the mysteries without 100 people proclaiming they have this inside track and 'know' for sure. It just isn't helpful and leaves me just that bit more skeptical.

Thanks for chiming in mate!

IRM

Honestly, its educated me more and more on hy so many possible conspiracies may well be realistically possible.

Really UFOs and Aliens cant be judged from the pictures and the videos of unidentified things, these make for good daily discussion and an interesting consideration of what might be there.

The depth of fact comes from witness testimonies, ex professionals across all establishments have now come forward and theres literally hundreds with great information. While you cant accept it at face value, you can look at 400 people who were once highly respected and valued in their fields all saying the same thing and be fairly certain there is definately something behind it.

Most of these people risked alot coming forwards and many of them gain nothing from it, in many cases the trashed their own "credibility" in the acceptable worlds of science and engineering for speaking out. So in that sense I couldnt ever fall on a point where what we see is the truth, that defies all sense of logic and reason. Where theres smoke theres often fire and where theres plumes and plumes of smoke coming from respectable chimneys, somethin IS burning behind it all.

Couple with the fact that those who give out the official infromation lie on a regular basis, often changing the lie week in week or, or just backtracking and trying to spin it a new way, those arent the actions of people with nothing to hide.

Anyway, I suppose my main curiosity (although I studied critical theory and philosophy) was how, in actual terms the deception remained so deeply hidden. Being at ATS has taught me that outright. You can read it in a million books and write essasy on it, but sometimes you just dont realise how true it is until you watch it play out more and more.

How could the military build saucers and test them? Easily, even if they are seen and all over the news, mainstream popualtion wont accept it.

How come we have never seen an alien? Maybe we have, maybe we have seen several, again its just going to be denied and called a hoax.

Could NASA have a moon base? Why not? All they need to say is "we dont have one" and thats it, you can have pictures of it, flight dates, witnesses, whatever and it STILL wouldnt make a shred of difference it would remain "secret".

So in those terms now I realise that even the most radical of the conspiracy theories could easily be possible to hide and enact right under everyones noses.

My beliefs remain the same, convinced of something, not convinced of the exact details of that something.

However I have considered a great deal and many of the recent professional witness accounts, radar reports and events actually cross match with "tin hat" public sightings and events so theres an indication of truth right there.

Im not likely to be swayed by mass blindness because I know only too wel the devices and superstructures of the world, and like reading a book, its very hard to switch off the critical mind once its turned on. I dont watch news, I analyse it, I dont watch TV I critique it, its a habit ill never lose.

[edit on 31-10-2008 by silver6ix]

[edit on 31-10-2008 by silver6ix]

[edit on 31-10-2008 by silver6ix]

reply to post by applebiter


Applebiter, you phrased your opinion much better than I could have! I agree with you. It's those very elements that repel me and have turned me into the 'skeptical believer' I am today. There are fringe elements everywhere from UFO's & Aliens to Football.

If there was a positive to be drawn from my time at ATS, it's that I've met some amazing minds that have taught me a deeper understanding of the material - and the crazier elements have taught me the importance of critical thinking.

Thanks for a great post mate!

IRM

reply to post by InfaRedMan

1. Are you now a bigger believer than pre ATS?
2. Are you now more skeptical than pre ATS?

Well, tricky set of questions - literally....

After having witnessed several heated debates, some of which I participated in to no one's benefit, I would say more skeptical...but in a reluctant way...

Meaning, I know there is quite a bit of crap out there in terms of evidence, and knowing this makes getting "stoked" more difficult...ignorance is bliss, but bliss is bland; so now I try and sit back and let the pro's debate and try and take in the good and disregard the bad and occasionally throw in my 2 cents...

reply to post by chapter29


Nice balanced answer C29! There are some amazing people that contribute to ATS that everybody can benefit from. More than I would care to mention as i would no doubt omit someone unintentionally.

It is great to sit back and watch the sparks fly but I find it way too hard to not jump in and give my 2 cents worth... kind of a compulsive thing really. I think the great thing about ATS is the passion that people have for these esoteric fields of study so I don't mind the odd heated debate.

It's good to know that people still care and feel enough in a world littered with apathy and narcissism.

Thanks for your contribution to the thread mate!

IRM

[edit on 31/10/08 by InfaRedMan]

Originally posted by silver6ix

The depth of fact comes from witness testimonies, ex professionals across all establishments have now come forward and theres literally hundreds with great information. While you cant accept it at face value, you can look at 400 people who were once highly respected and valued in their fields all saying the same thing and be fairly certain there is definately something behind it.

I completely agree with your sentiments silver6ix. I believe we need more professionals in their relative fields to come out and tell us what they 'know' whether it be from aerospace, government, military, commercial pilots, astronomers etc. Though I agree that there is definitely something behind it, we still need more witnesses of higher credibility to come forward before the rest of the world wakes up!

IRM

Yeah I wouldn't say ATS changed my views really.. well it did in a way-- it's just a source for all sorts of stuff you can take in, and really gets you good at seeing whats fake and whats real.
I've found though there's some stuff people post that's legit but others try to talk down on it just because it didn't happen to them or they aren't open to believing whatever that topic is at hand; i let that stuff slide and I just find another thread and save myself the headache of argument

It also gives you cool topics or facts to bring up when you go out, and to surprise people with them and get em' interested in the paranormal That's my favourite part.


Oh what would I do without ATS

[edit on 31-10-2008 by MurrayTORONTO]

Originally posted by InfaRedMan


I completely agree with your sentiments silver6ix. I believe we need more professionals in their relative fields to come out and tell us what they 'know' whether it be from aerospace, government, military, commercial pilots, astronomers etc. Though I agree that there is definitely something behind it, we still need more witnesses of higher credibility to come forward before the rest of the world wakes up!

IRM

Yes, compartmentalisation is a real soul destroyer which is why everything stays so fragmented. However, id like to think more people will come forward, the more high profile ones that come out and say it, I think that will inspire others to step forward and speak out.

I would say this, I dont think its a tide that can be stemmed. Sooner or later you run out of fingers to plug the dam and it all comes rushing out.

The concern for me is that the say "ok lets investigate" and then six months later you get a token gesture document back saying "nothing to see here, move along".

Do we even trust the authorities to manage to investigate and disclose anymore? Im not sure

Originally posted by MurrayTORONTO

It also gives you cool topics or facts to bring up when you go out, and to surprise people with them and get em' interested in the paranormal

That's my favourite part.

Yeah, nothing like sitting around a table with a hot coffee at 4am after the party has finished, blowing peoples minds with all kinds of crap and watching their faces go blank as they laugh uneasily trying to comprehend everything you've just said as the overwhelming urge to vomit comes over them!

IRM

reply to post by silver6ix


Your not referring to a certain "Project Bluebook" by any chance?
People are still smarting from that!

IRM

Originally posted by InfaRedMan

Originally posted by MurrayTORONTO

It also gives you cool topics or facts to bring up when you go out, and to surprise people with them and get em' interested in the paranormal

That's my favourite part.

Yeah, nothing like sitting around a table with a hot coffee at 4am after the party has finished, blowing peoples minds with all kinds of crap and watching their faces go blank as they laugh uneasily trying to comprehend everything you've just said as the overwhelming urge to vomit comes over them!

IRM

Haha yup. I love that. The problem is half the time I have a hard time making them actually believe a word I'm saying is true, but then I get a call a few days later like "omg man yo what else can you tell me? I just got finished talking to my mom who swears on her life she saw a UFO landing at her farm as a child".
It's stuff like that they won't believe it until someone they've known their whole life gives them some sort of proof or past story..

At that point I tell them what they want to hear and let them know about this site.
Sh***y though cause there's a lot of bs on here with hoaxers n' such and somone new to it will believe anything they read-- or nothing. But hey I guess that's how I got where I am now isnt it?



[edit on 31-10-2008 by MurrayTORONTO]

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
reply to post by silver6ix

 

Your not referring to a certain "Project Bluebook" by any chance?

People are still smarting from that!

IRM

Yes thats the baby. Im not sure it deserves the "project" tag, unless we change it to "Project Propaganda" which is about all it amounted to. Doesnt give you great confidence in any "official" investigation, nice to see they finally admit it was a scam job though

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
reply to post by applebiter

 

Applebiter, you phrased your opinion much better than I could have! I agree with you. It's those very elements that repel me and have turned me into the 'skeptical believer' I am today. There are fringe elements everywhere from UFO's & Aliens to Football.

If there was a positive to be drawn from my time at ATS, it's that I've met some amazing minds that have taught me a deeper understanding of the material - and the crazier elements have taught me the importance of critical thinking.

Thanks for a great post mate!

IRM

Ah yes ,how will I ever forget that flaming you gave me . You were a REAL BITCH . But thats okay . I know what I know and it eats you that you are not in on it ,I understand completely . But chill out mate , like I said ,disclosure is accelerating , its a process and I reckon you will be hearing some very interesting reports in OZ in the near future .

Originally posted by InfaRedMan
Hi Good People,

Since I became a member of ATS in December 2007, I have found myself becoming more skeptical and discerning regarding the UFO/Alien phenomena than I can ever remember, (30+ years). I believed far more easily pre ATS but now, my quest has steered toward the tangible proofs and not the hearsay. To be honest, my preconceived notion was that I would probably become a bigger believer in such a community. My experience at ATS has certainly surprised me!

The same happened to me and i can understand how you're feeling.

[edit on 31-10-2008 by umbracode]