Enough is enough (Science vs Religion)

I am new to this seemingly interesting place but I do feel the need to weigh in, with my views of the whole science versus religion war. You people need to just agree to disagree and leave it be, stop trying to force your beliefs on each other, your not going to convince each other.
You may BOTH be wrong (that is the side of the fence I personally sit on, well I guess it more or less is the fence) it is pure hubris to pretend otherwise. We are young children in a giant's garden as a speices and I say its a fair wager to say that we actually know next to jack competely. And all this bickering, arguing and postering only shows how retarded we truely are.

Belief is belief, whether you call it science backed up with experiments or religion backed up with miracles.

Even Newtonian beliefs are proved false at the sub-atomic level.
Everything is relative, and therefore one must discern what model is best for what situation.

But humans are too lazy for that, they want one ultimate thing so they can be right.

Originally posted by Quazga
But humans are too lazy for that, they want one ultimate thing so they can be right.

I don't think people are lazy I think we love our BS. People tend to spend so much time and effort trying to back their preconceived ideas or something close to their preconceived ideas that I don't think they actually want to know the truth (whatever that maybe).


[edit on 9-8-2007 by WraothAscendant]

[edit on 9-8-2007 by WraothAscendant]

see this will be a problem for me.See i am an Angel yeah really no i'm not crazy i have been through clinical help been; hypnotized,drugged with massive amounts of truth serum,and polygraphed the whole nine yards.if it were possible i could be a register Angel citizen i have the clinical backings from different doctors.they can find no evidence of psychosis or paranoia to explain it so the doctor sit with the facts that I'm either an Angel or a robot......and so every time i come on here i am prompted by the code of my mission parameters that i must engage any and all strikes against God

No offense but umm what does that have to do with what I said? And I won't comment beyond that.

well me being angel means that i validate one side of the fence put the one in reality with God and science the other side faux-science.and as long as i am here or one of my brethren the problem with this will continue there is a right side just not many people are actually all together with the right side there here but they've climbed up a tree

science is something that claims to have made mistakes, it isn't hubris to say it's either the scientific method or faith. as far as we can see there is no other alternative.

"Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind."
Albert Einstein.

Hate to tell you WA, but this is a discussion board. Some of us want to discuss this topic. I don't believe in the supernatural, think that it's fairy tales, and I will discuss it when it comes up if the topic interests me.

All you can do is avoid posts you don't want to read. Asking us to stop is an attempt at censorship, which no one has the right to do here.

It's like sex on TV. Some people think there's too much of it. I say, if you don't like it, change the channel rather than trying to force it to stop.

Just my two cents.

majormalfunction, it's funny i don't believe in the supernatural either.the whole bit about evolution just seems like some goofy tale.the whole nothing then all of a sudden bang a whole universe can you get any supernatural of a story,well actually if you were on LCD.Anyways God and angels are the natural things of this world this addressed before its like your standing on a railroad track and your denying that a train is coming down the track so you just sit there see at the moment there is no train and what proof are the tracks i mean i've been places where there are tracks and no trains.just like when there are events that happen there may be no proof that it was God.fact is the tracks you are on have a train coming.just like you ecist in a world where there is a God that is the truth and the finite nature of this world.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
"Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind."
Albert Einstein.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

same guy.... einstein.

I believe in the super natural because for me there is way too much evidence pointing to the existence of things like ghosts. One of my best moments was when I saw a very good ghost photo in some friends of mine family photo album (which they'd taken some years previously).

So in my opinion science is the key to unlocking the supernatural into forming what could be a One World Religion.
Basically if you can take for granted that ghosts exist, you might assume they have some sort of order (God and those beneath him).
You might also assume they have some way of existing, and that our ability to enter-have contact with that realm has some sort of evolutionary purpose i.e. That the dead help the living on average.
Because the dead do not physically rule the living you might assume there is some sort of energy shortage on they're part. This might mean that ghosts influence us more on sub conscious (like when we're crossing the road and live because we happened to look twice instead of once).

Science is a true world religion. It's rules were never written by man, merely discovered by us and then written into books.
You could burn every physics book in the world, kill 99% of all life, but within less than a million years (so long as mankind survived) there will be new physics books saying exactly the same things as the ones a million years before.
The same cannot be said of the Bible-Koran (unless you really, really believe God will chuck us another copy from space).

Some day we will understand more about how ghosts work, e.g. how the documented dead can appear in front of the living in front of numerous witnesses.
Unfortunately there is so much we don't know this may take a while.
In another world it wouldn't; but as paranormal research found during the Cold War (despite good results) politicians are scared about doing paranormal research in case the public find out, and ridicule it as a waste of taxpayers cash.

But when this happens it will be a bit like when Darwin’s Theory of Evolution first came out. To begin with fundermentalists will probably reject the one world religion on religious grounds, but in the end those fundermentalists will be a minority even within they're own religion (much like Christians who believe everything in the Bible to be 100% true, as written, are today. Because what Darwin's theory shows, is that in the end (bar a seemingly inevitable minority) it is people faith that is carried by the evidence, rather than the evidence being carried by the faith.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul

Originally posted by FlyersFan
"Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind."
Albert Einstein.

"It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

same guy.... einstein.

Well, he was a genius after all

This whole 'science vs. religion' thing cracks me up though. There WAS a time when there was little or no science - and religion ruled the lands - it is now known as 'The Dark Ages'.... A time of much terror, barbarism, ignorance and religious injustice & intolerance. Anyone who actually WANTS to go back to that, deserves to be living in northern Pakistan with the remnants of the Taliban...they'd feel right at home in fact.

Without science and the comprehension of the natural world that it revealed to us all, we'd still be living in cold, dark mud huts, eating gruel every day. But I guess that would be heaven for some people on this board, huh?
heheh....apparently so.

J.

Science is not a religion.

1.
a. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
b. A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
2. The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
3. A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.

Not. A. Religion.

It's not a matter of opinion or belief whether or not science is a religion, it is a fact that it is not. It is also a fact that science describes the world and how it works much better than superstition does. There is hard evidence of things such as evolution. There is zero evidence for god, whichever one.

That's because science is real. It is a fact. Religion is a belief. Beliefs are relative to the believer, no two people hold exactly the same beliefs about anything. They are not the same thing, not two sides of the same coin, not even apples and oranges. Science is a fact, and religion is a delusion.

Atheism is not a religion either, so please let's not go there. My head might explode. It wouldn't be pretty.

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
Hate to tell you WA, but this is a discussion board. Some of us want to discuss this topic. I don't believe in the supernatural, think that it's fairy tales, and I will discuss it when it comes up if the topic interests me.

All you can do is avoid posts you don't want to read. Asking us to stop is an attempt at censorship, which no one has the right to do here.

It's like sex on TV. Some people think there's too much of it. I say, if you don't like it, change the channel rather than trying to force it to stop.

Just my two cents.

Peronaly, I believe in all sorts of paranormal occurances... what I do not believe is that humans have any real explanation for these things. They might claim to, but that doesn't make it so.

You can catch a Ghost on tape, but you can't say for certain what it actually was you caught on tape. Anyone who claims certainty about anything is usually wrong.

Originally posted by WraothAscendant
...your not going to convince each other.

You may BOTH be wrong... it is pure hubris to pretend otherwise...

Ah, the beauty of disagreement. Could it be arrogant to think that you're right about both being wrong. (You might have to read that a few times).

I think that refusing to examine both sides is hubris. Even if your not convinced in the end, at least you tried.

I think that both sides are right. I think they're just two different ways of looking at the same thing, with a few mistakes on both parts. Maybe someday science will be able to explain God and religious or paranormal phenomena.

Take the proverbial blind men asked to describe an elephant. All were right but only partially.

[edit on 8/10/2007 by Rev_Godslapper]

[edit on 8/10/2007 by Rev_Godslapper]

your not getting the point major natural is God created the earth supernatural is this big bang evolution non sense.....they also are new very very new well from my point of view at least. nine thousand years ago no one thought they would be accused of being decended from an animal and it baffles me that you think cause someone calls something proof it must be proof there is no proof of evolution.there is plenty of evidence for God its just to wide spread there are modern day miracles that defy the faux-science all together God is the god of science he made all things including those rules man just kinda made new ones so man could be better comforted and find a way to gain control.the faux-science you may follow is flawed and just helps it's self but inventing new ways for itself to be validated God doesnt change.poeple have all kind of problems with God but he doesnt change.if someone has a major problem with science they can just make a new theory.i'm sorry but i can only believe in something that makes the same sense it did ten thousand years ago.some new mojo hojo theroized faux science would require a tremendous amount of faith and strength to try and believe in something like it

Statue, can you please make your avatar smaller. WOW that's annoying.

Originally posted by MajorMalfunction
Hate to tell you WA, but this is a discussion board. Some of us want to discuss this topic. I don't believe in the supernatural, think that it's fairy tales, and I will discuss it when it comes up if the topic interests me.

All you can do is avoid posts you don't want to read. Asking us to stop is an attempt at censorship, which no one has the right to do here.

It's like sex on TV. Some people think there's too much of it. I say, if you don't like it, change the channel rather than trying to force it to stop.

Just my two cents.

Ohhhh a discussion BOARD. I here I am thinking that it was a classified adds board for rabid spider monkeys, silly me.

And I would like to add what most people do on that topic is NOT discuss but bash each other over the head with their beliefs.

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Ah, the beauty of disagreement. Could it be arrogant to think that you're right about both being wrong. (You might have to read that a few times).

I think that refusing to examine both sides is hubris. Even if your not convinced in the end, at least you tried.

I think that both sides are right. I think they're just two different ways of looking at the same thing, with a few mistakes on both parts. Maybe someday science will be able to explain God and religious or paranormal phenomena.

Geee yet another high horsed response. Going to attack me on my grammer next? Would you not agree that right and wrong could be split into a cup half full cup half empty situation?