France Bans Citizen Journalists from Reporting Violence

Think of it like this:

film real-world violence and distribute the images on the Internet.

You can not film acts of violence and then place them on the internet.

You can film them and give them to the Police.

If it is State Violence, you'd not care about breaking the law.

What is the big issue here?

It starts out like that, and then eventually becomes this. If you accept the idea that The State can do stuff like this, they'll eventually get around to deciding they can do...other things.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
I never said it was not a bad law within the extent it goes..

All I pointed out was why it was proposed in the first place, because of idiot out of control youth.

Oh, I totally agree with you, that the slap-happys were most likely the final straw that broke the camel's back and was the reason that this law was proposed.

It's just a poorly written law, is all I'm sayin'. These idiot youths need to be dealt with. But this law has the potential to restrict both freedom of expression and use of the internet, the way it is currently written.

Originally posted by Justin Oldham
It starts out like that, and then eventually becomes this. If you accept the idea that The State can do stuff like this, they'll eventually get around to deciding they can do...other things.

To be honest, I don't see how the two are related at all. One attempts to take away basic liberties, and the other is merely a report on an underestimation of needed resources.

I was trying to very softly allude to abuse of power. It's late where I am, so I apologize for the attempt.

Originally posted by Justin Oldham
I was trying to very softly allude to abuse of power. It's late where I am, so I apologize for the attempt.

I am not sure if you are in Europe or not, but this is a major problem for us. Their is now a Gang Culture to video incidents of violence (such as attacking people and video recording it) and their is very little the Police can do. (It is hard to track down the victim, etc) so this is actually a step in the right direction.

Odium

When I remember that I was taught during childhood that I could be proud of being French because of the Revolution and all that liberty stuff that came after, I can't prevent myself from thinking that, after being the first ones to celebrate freedom in Europe, we may be the first ones to put an end to it. Look at this law, preventing fellow french citizens to tape anythnig that looks like an act of violence. Of course, I'm aware of hoaxes, but if you have to call a journalist every time you see something crazy going on, let me tell you that you'd better forget it. This is a good way to "moralize" the country, but this is a shame to see that nobody gives a damn about our citizen liberties being taken down, one by one, by a so-called governement which is just a bunch of conservative elders, leading the country to totalitarism. Maybe, this day, people like me will fight them. But, waiting for that day, we can't do anything against that. Cry, Liberté, cry !

I share your sentiments, Mulder. time and time again I keep hoping to be wrong, but so far very few of my predicitonshave been off the mark. We are seeing a slide towards what can only be called a terrible darkness in the Western world.

As a political scientist, I do understand that what's happening in places like France and America can be chalked up to any number of things, but...that doesn't mean I have to like it. That's why I write and speak on the subject of liberty. My one great hope is that more people will do the same.

now here is what confusses me.... a year ago "happy slapping", in the UK, was a massive craze within young "yob/chav" (what ever you want to call them) going up to random people slapping them and filming their reaction to show to all their mates via mobile phone videos.

A new law in France makes it illegal to film any acts of violence and post the offending images or videos online.

The only problem is that France doesn't actually have much of a happy slapping problem.

So why are they brining out a law which is to stop something which rarely happens?

But, unlike the United Kingdom, where 200 such attacks inside London trains were recorded by police over a six-month period, French police have logged only about 20 similar cases since 2005.

20 cases in 2 years? thats nothing and especially not grounds to ban ANY type of violence recorded on film.

Like it says in the ABC report many people believe it is to help cover up any reports of police brutality as that individual may face 5 years or a $100,000 (USD) fine if they try to speak out!

In my opinion i think this law is a total disgrace and totally ignores the freedom of expression on the internet. Will this the start of us not even being allowed free speech on the internet?

LINK

Yeah, lets just hope will all the patriot act garbage going on - that the US government doesn't file in line 'lock step' with France... truly unbelievable. I could see this happening in some other country - like Russia or China, but France - incredible find.

While "happy slapping" may be targeted in this ban it's not the only thing. "Security Forces" don't happy slap, and you can't record acts of violence by them according to the article posted earlier in this thread.

Imagine police attacking a group in a Muslim community. Say someone had a camcorder and taped it surreptitiously and posted it on the net so people could see exactly whats going on. The police could then pull it from the web and arrest the person that put it there and/or made it.

I can see how banning "happy slapping" would be a good thing, but this law blatantly curbs freedom of speech and the free flow of information.

Originally posted by Odium

Their is now a Gang Culture to video incidents of violence (such as attacking people and video recording it) and their is very little the Police can do. (It is hard to track down the victim, etc) so this is actually a step in the right direction.

oh, give me a break, if you're filming the act you are producing evidence, not necessarily good evidence, but still better than nothing, isn't it?. plus, last time i checked, beating someone up is illegal already, so how can we expect them to curtail videos when they can't do much about the actual crime? the answer is simple, people who do it won't upload it (share the clips like porn instead) OR use someone else's account. for a criminal, circumventing such hapless laws is easy and they have nothing to lose, seeing as physical violence carries a heftier sentence (or so i hope).

so, who will get the shaft? anyone daring enough to record a crime, after all it will magically go away when we ignore it.


PS: one can easily discern videos made by (co-)perpetrators and witnesses, the former can expose themselves while recording, so the difference is obvious. last year, when paris erupted in violence, someone uploaded a short movie of a clash between police and gangs, filmed from balcony nearby. with this law in place, the guy would have risked jailtime! you do know that people everywhere like to see something to substantiate outlandish claims?

Originally posted by Odium

Originally posted by Justin Oldham
I was trying to very softly allude to abuse of power. It's late where I am, so I apologize for the attempt.

I am not sure if you are in Europe or not, but this is a major problem for us. Their is now a Gang Culture to video incidents of violence (such as attacking people and video recording it) and their is very little the Police can do. (It is hard to track down the victim, etc) so this is actually a step in the right direction.

Odium

That would be the way I understand it as well Odium.. the law is supposed to be trying to fight back against gangs instigating violence and then posting it on the internet.. we have the same problem in America except usually the people post them on Myspace and end up getting arrested. The last major story was a group of 13 year olds girls beat up 1 other 13 year old girl after school and put it on Myspace. They aren't to bright eh?

I think that what we've got here is a government effort to exploit the situation for their own purposes. Stop and think about it before you reply. How many different ways can French authorities use this to their advantage?

Some of you know me, and you know my work. This law, if applied in the U.S., would shut me up. I would not be surprised if the Fed built a case agaisnt me for "past crimes." That's the sort of witch hunting you will see in France if this thing takes hold.

Not enough? Consider that the response you are about to type might one day be agaisnt the law in your country. It's not that much of a stretch. Just a few pen strokes from the courtroom to the gallows.