Christianity and Homosexuality....

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Anyway, people can change...and usually do when they find out their son, daughter or relative is gay. My aunts and uncles have been pretty great also, because they know me as me and not as gay me if you know what I mean.

Lucky you. My Dad still looks at me funny every time girls gone wild commercials come on. it's very awkward. but anyway Griff, My attitude has helped me alot, when I get to school I usually get sort of a FU mentalaty. If someone looks at me funny, I will stop walking, and stare back at them, if some one says something mean to me, I just say,"I love you too," it's really funny to watch their expressions. But my favorite class at Salem is Band. I play Baritone, Trombone, Tuba, and piano. In band I feel like I can truely express myself, not only that everyone in there is very accepting. If you are ever finding yourself depressed, just vent through music, of violent video games, If you need to you can message me. You know my name.

Well, I'm glad this thread has moved on from three shall we say
undesirable zealots preaching there ideologies and one sane person
actually confronting them on it.

Well, that's all I have to say for now, I'm of to creat a thread.

Originally posted by Inanna
I have never understood why to be Christian you HAVE to like people of the other gender? I thought Christians were supposed to be very understanding, loving people who hated no one? Who had no bad intentions or thoughts towards any other human being?

Is this something that has changed in the Bible over the years? You know one of the "edits" that have been made to make it more fitting to society?

Every Great Religion of the Great White Lodge(Christianity, Islam, Buddhism and many others) has emphatically stated that homosexuality is a crime against the Holy Spirit and the Dakinis, Nirmanakayas, etc.

The reason for this being that the Path of Initiation always(well, if the Chela be truly sincere) leads to the creation of the Soul which is a Sexual matter.

The Tibetan Initiates must train for many years as celibates, before entering a Tantric College.

And even after entering a Tantric College there is no guarantee that they'll earn the right of practicing physical Sex with a Wisdom Consort.


The Soul itself is androgynous.

However, the fall of Adam and Eve(which actually happened, but not in the literal way the Torah describes it) caused Humans to lose their Souls because they fornicated.

So to re-enter Eden we have to enter through the same door that we left, and this is Sex which is a major aspect of Alchemy and Tantra.

The Androgynous Soul can only be (re)Built based on the physical union of opposites.

The Divine Mother Kundalini(feminine aspect of the Holy Spirit) can only rise through the Spinal Column by way of the Sexual act between husband and wife, and without ever reaching the orgasm.

This is how we Build the Temple of the Soul-of-Man/Solar-Man or Solomon within ourselves.

This is the Great Arcanum of Primordial FreeMasonry.

It was not taught publically during the Age of Pisces.

Now is the Age of Aquarius.

Planets of Alchemy





The strength of the kidneys give you strength in the sexual force. And this is how you find how Uranus is related with Saturn, right? And are not perhaps Uranus and Saturn the two planets that you find in the sign of Aquarius? Any Aquarius person will know that Uranus rules the sexual glands, and Saturn is also in Aquarius. So here you find the relationship how Uranus helps Saturn in order to work in your nervous system so that the fluidic forces of the Ruach Elohim rise in you in order to work, and to have that outcome, which is the transmutation of the metals of the earth, Alchemy, or the metallic planets. Of course, you understand that the physical body then has to be clean, in order for those fluidic forces to move in harmony, not only in the earth but in the physical body and in the solar system they have to freely move in harmony. But if we put in our bodies wrong elements, as we were explaining in the last lecture with the Pancatattwa Ritual, obviously we are obstructing the move of that energy. Not only in the physical world, in the physical body, but in the internal bodies.

Yeshua(Jesus) taught this symbolically, as can be seen in the Christian Gospels which are an Esoteric Treatise on Kabbalah and Alchemy.



"With patience ye shall possess your Souls." - Yeshua of Nazareth

Jesus' Bloodline


Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto you (the mystery of my wife Mary Magdalene is “MM” and any “Master Mason” knows that! Is not perhaps Christ “Shin”, the Son of Nun, which is the final outcome of the blood? and), except a man be born of water (MeM, Mary Magdalene, who develops the Son of Nun in her Belly) and of the (Holy) Spirit (Ruach Elohim, Aleph), he cannot enter into the kingdom of God….

The wind (Aleph as oxygen) blows (the fire in the blood) where it listens (the “IAO” and transmutes the water into wine), and (when the fire is awakened) you hear the sound thereof (within your “Vav”, Spinal Medulla), but cannot tell whence it comes, and whither it goes (because it rises according to Nous, the fires of the heart): so is every one that is born of the Spirit (Aleph that hovers upon the Waters - MeM, Mother Mary).

Regards

Okay that went right over my head.

Basically, he stated some new age fooey about homosexuality
being wrong, because sex creats the soul.

Or something to that caliber.

[edit on 10/28/2006 by iori_komei]

I Dont want to stir up controversy. I respect everyone's opinion. I have my beliefs, and he\she has their own. But just because I respect your opinion, dosn't mean I believe you. I am a christian. I know that God loves me even though Im Gay. Hell, He made me that way.

Originally posted by Ford Farmer
I know that God loves me even though Im Gay. Hell, He made me that way.

That's the best way to put it. So, if we (gay people) are an abomination, then God is flawed. I doubt people would want to put 2 and 2 together to come up with THAT answer.

No, God sets Laws into place.

But it is WE who create our own destiny, based on the fact of dependant origination and interdependance(a very ancient fact that has nothing to do with "new age fooey").

Simply put; people are "born gay" due to past actions of sexual degeneration in former lives.

"God" does not create homosexuality.


We left Eden through the mis-use of our Internal Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, and it is by way of this same Tree through which we can re-enter Eden.

[edit on 29-10-2006 by Tamahu]

God created me

Originally posted by Ford Farmer
God created me

Amen to that, Ford.

As a Christian who has been subjected to many rantings about the horrors and abominations of homosexuality, I've come to this conclusion:

Straight Christians loooooove to sell the idea of homosexuality as a terrible horrible sin because then they will all have one sin in the bag that they know they will, without a doubt, never ever commit.

The bible has much much more to say about treating the poor with compassion and not giving in to the trappings of wealth. Funny how that concept doesn't get the ink.

Originally posted by Essedarius
Straight Christians loooooove to sell the idea of homosexuality as a terrible horrible sin because then they will all have one sin in the bag that they know they will, without a doubt, never ever commit.

The bible has much much more to say about treating the poor with compassion and not giving in to the trappings of wealth. Funny how that concept doesn't get the ink.

No offense, but what about reincarnation? I believe that everyone will experience everything that god created into existance. In this life time, we experience life's quests that we take for granted, than the after this life it's another chapter. To continue gaining knowledge from every perspective, and until you reach the level where you are a unique entity. We all could very well experience everything from this reality to other realitys. We all have different perspectives of how our journey unfolds, which confirms, we are individual souls that god loves everyone. So to those people who you quote that say they wont ever commit homosexuality, well there arrogance may just get to them, lol..

cheers to that

[edit on 1-11-2006 by 7Ayreon]

Originally posted by 7Ayreon
So to those people who you quote that say they wont ever commit homosexuality, well there arrogance may just get to them, lol..

Well said.
From your mouth to God's ears...

Well said.
From your mouth to God's ears...

I don't understand why you would bring god into this? Is this suppose to mean a threat to what I logically explained in the name of reincarnation?

Originally posted by 7Ayreon
I don't understand why you would bring god into this? Is this suppose to mean a threat to what I logically explained in the name of reincarnation?

Sorry for the confusion, 7Ayreon.
It's a turn of phrase...I was agreeing with you.

But now I'm confused...why would I leave God out of this?

Originally posted by Essedarius
Straight Christians loooooove to sell the idea of homosexuality as a terrible horrible sin because then they will all have one sin in the bag that they know they will, without a doubt, never ever commit.

The bible has much much more to say about treating the poor with compassion and not giving in to the trappings of wealth. Funny how that concept doesn't get the ink.

Oh really?

www.gnosticteachings.org...


Well, Tomas, I suspect you mean well, but just because our modern "morals" want to justify homosexuality, the Christ certainly never has, and throughout all positive, White Tantric traditions, the practice of homosexuality is strongly condemned.


Here are some "words of compassion and love" from the Christ.


From The Pistis Sophia:

Bartholomew said, “A man who hath intercourse with a male, what is his vengeance?”

Jesus said, “The measure of the man who hath intercourse with males and of the man with whom he lieth, is the same as that of the blasphemer.

Which is:

Jesus said, “If the time of such an one is completed through the sphere, the Receivers of Yaldabaoth come after him and bind him by his tongue to a great demon with a horse’s face; they spend three days travelling round with him in the world, and take vengeance on him.

“Thereafter they lead him into the region of the cold and of the snow, and take vengeance on him there eleven years.

“Thereafter they lead him down into the chaos before Yaldabaoth and his forty-and-nine demons, and every one of his demons taketh vengeance on him another eleven years.

“Thereafter they lead him into the outer darkness until the day when the great Ruler with the dragon’s face who encircleth the darkness, shall be judged. And that soul becometh frozen up[?] and destroyed and dissolved.

I need not mention that the Bible also strongly condemns the practice.


And some words from the Buddha:

"The pandaka (Pali for "homosexual") had been ordained in a residence of monks. He went to the young monks and encouraged them thus, 'Come all of you and assault me.'

"The monks spoke aggressively, 'Pandaka, you will surely be ... spiritually destroyed. Of what benefit will it be?" ...

He went to some large, stout novices and encouraged them thus, 'Come all of you and assault me.'

The novices spoke, 'Pandaka, you will surely be destroyed. Of what benefit will it be?'

"The pandaka then went to men who tend elephants and horses and spoke to them thus. 'Come all of you and assault me.' The men who tend elephants and horses assaulted him.

"The Blessed One then ordered the monks, 'Behold monks, a pandaka is one who is not to be ordained, ... and (pandakas) who have already been ordained must be made to disrobe."

That is, he must be kicked out of the sangha.


In Gnosis we know from our teacher that we must never condemn a person for his wrong actions, because we are all equally guilty (Let he who is wihtout sin cast the first stone.) Yet, simultaneously, we must also clearly and constantly indicate what those wrong actions are, and homosexuality is one among them. This activity causes suffering. It is similar to many other harmful actions one can pursue, and can stop. Although our modern society is desperately attempting to make this practice acceptable, this is only due to recurrence of past events and the will of a large number of very powerful, very degenerated persons. It does not make it proper or correct. As we know, morals and ethics are the product of personality and time. Yet the Law of the Christ is beyond individuality, time, or desire. To become one with that, one must shed all activity which conflicts with the Great Law.

You see?










[edit on 2-11-2006 by Tamahu]

Do we worship different Gods? My God has Unconditional love. My Lord loves, and accepts all. My God is kind, and Merciful. My God is warm, loving, and powerful. He is my faher as he is yours. My God dosn't judge you on whether you are Gay, or straight, black or white. I feel we worship two different Gods. Its sad though. You will never love, or understand your God, as I do mine.

Originally posted by Tamahu
You see?

You are quoting sources that I have never heard of in my life...so no, I guess I don't see at all.

Here's an oldy but a goody from a book called the Bible:

Some Pharisee asks Jesus what the greatest commandment in the Law is, and Jesus replies:

Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the first and greatest commandment.

Okay, nothing about sexual preference, race, gender, or class so far...but wait, I'm sure he's getting to that stuff...

And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

One more time for the Christians in the back pew:

Love your neighbor as yourself. All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.

Excuse me Jesus, you mean straight neighbors, yeah?

Love your neighbor as yourself.

But Jesus, you don't get it...I don't really relate to my neighbor's lifestyle.

Love your neighbor...

Jesus, you don't understand the way people are these days, they-

Love your neighbor...

But in the book of Deuteronomy-

Love your neighbor...

But Pat Robertson!?!!

Love your neighbor...

You see?

Originally posted by Tamahu
Simply put; people are "born gay" due to past actions of sexual degeneration in former lives.

"God" does not create homosexuality.

Love how you mixed Chrisitanity and reincarnation. It's like we're shopping at Sears for religion and we mix and match tops and bottoms to create our own personal religion. Christianity clearly teaches that you have one life and then that's it. If your religion states that you come back for more lives then it's not Christianity.

Homosexuality is a sexual preference. Child molesters have a preference for little kids, but we require them to change or we throw them into jail. This sillyness that it's an unchangeable trait doesn't apply to other sexual deviants for some reason. I'll give you that there's nothing illegal about homosexuality but abortion is perfectly legal too and you don't see Christians bragging about that do you?

This nonsense about Christians needing a sin they won't commit is just that. Nonsense. I don't know why you feel that Christians never sin. Do I need to bust out the "For all have sinned" quote? Christians are humans and make just as many mistakes as non-Christians. The main difference is that they acknowledge that they make mistakes and try to move on without repeating them.

To quote a popular song. "The saints are just the sinners who fall down, and get back up." I don't fault someone for being a homosexual any more than I fault the man who cheats on his taxes. I would fault someone for not making an attempt to change their bad habits.

Originally posted by Kacen
This is something I find very irritating, since even many Christians don't know the exact facts.

Even the most understanding Christians still say its a sin, when its not.

It does say in the Old Testament that Homosexuality is wrong, but Christians are negate from the Old Testament since Jesus re-did everything.

Why do you think Christians can eat shellfish and pork? The Old Testament condemns those things. The only people that have to follow that is Jewish people.

Thats what really gets me. Overall its just people who wanted to find an excuse to hate homosexuals, and without knowing enough about there own religion, dug into a Bible and looked for something and found it in a part of the Bible that Christians don't even have to listen to anymore!

No truer words have ever been spoken!!! You are 100% right

The real joke is on the haters

God made everyone not just the straight people and God loves everyone EVEN YOU!!!


Peace

EDIT:

Double post.

[edit on 3-11-2006 by Tamahu]