Questioning about God's existence.

I did this a few days ago in my ethics class, and the answers I got were pretty interesting. So I figured I'd try it on ATS. Since it would be the perfect testing ground. NOTE: THIS IS MOSTLY FOR RELIGIOUS PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN GOD OF ANY RELIGION.

So without further adue: Hypothetically, say it was somehow proven without a doubt, that no religions god exists. Never has never will. What would you do? What would be your response? Would your life be over after learning this ugly truth?

I am an atheist, and my reasons are my own. When I asked this one of the girls said that she would kill herself if it was proven. She no longer had a reason to live. Someone else said he'd try and shoot the pope for lying to us all this time.

Again, i don't mean any offense with this, I just want to see what people would do.

Thanks for your time.

This is actually a very good question. I'd also be interested in the answer's provided.

Here is something to mull over:
Epicurus was a greek philosopher and he posed the question, do the gods exist... Remember he predates Christianity by nearly a 1000 years.


1.1 Theorem

God does not exist.


Proof

Consider the notion of an omnipotent and benign God and his willingness to eliminate “evil”.

Either:

(i) He is willing, but unable – therefore He is not omnipotent;

(ii) He is able, but unwilling – therefore He is malevolent;

(iii) He is able and willing – whence comes Evil?

(iv) He is neither able nor willing – then why call Him God?

Q.E.D.

(After Epicurus 341 B.C. – 271 B.C.)

I know this doesnt directly answer your question but it shows that the question of a Godless Universe is one that has been on peoples minds for a lond time.

If you want to read more, Wiki, as always does an admirable job.
A few facts about Epicurus and his Theorems

Originally posted by bigdanprice
Here is something to mull over:
Epicurus was a greek philosopher and he posed the question, do the gods exist... Remember he predates Christianity by nearly a 1000 years.


1.1 Theorem

God does not exist.


Proof

Consider the notion of an omnipotent and benign God and his willingness to eliminate “evil”.

Either:

(i) He is willing, but unable – therefore He is not omnipotent;

(ii) He is able, but unwilling – therefore He is malevolent;

(iii) He is able and willing – whence comes Evil?

(iv) He is neither able nor willing – then why call Him God?

Q.E.D.

(After Epicurus 341 B.C. – 271 B.C.)

I know this doesnt directly answer your question but it shows that the question of a Godless Universe is one that has been on peoples minds for a lond time.

If you want to read more, Wiki, as always does an admirable job.
A few facts about Epicurus and his Theorems

While that is a good read, that's not what I was shooting for sorry. My question was more along the lines of what would you do should god ever be proven inexistent.

Well, tricky question but here goes...

I'd continue being the best person I can be.....for ME, which is kinda what I do now anyway. We all feel good when we do 'the right thing', right? Well....MOST people do

It would definately be disappointing to know that this life and all its trials are for no greater reason but that doesn't mean you don't enjoy it for what it is imo. I'd carry on being who I am right now, but perhaps I might become a bit more 'hollow'....if that makes sense.

I feel that God does exist, but that God is within everyone - God is energy. I'm sure this does not qualify me as the type of beleiver you were directing the thread towards, but i felt like sharing my opinion nonetheless

With that said, if it were proven that no religious god exists then it would seem to me to be yet another thing that it has taken mankind way too long to realize. I don't think I would be changing much about the way I live my life, and I might be slightly amused at how many of those people who think they would commit suicide would justify not actually doing it. I definitely am not trying to offend anyone either, just being pretty darn honest here....

The same thing as If I found out pigs could fly, santa was real, the easter buny was real, the tooth fairy was aslo real, Id feel decieved, because my friend Ive never seen any of the above, but you can't deny love, love Is a two way thing.

It is just as miraculous to think that God doesn't exist in all this creation. God did not create religion, MAN did. So if all this religious crap has made you think negatively of God, I apologize for them. God is real, he is an essence of what is all. When you get a taste, keep chewing and try to swallow as much as possible in this life, becasue when we all are exposed with the real truth, those that have evolved spiritually will be at an advantage... AAC

Believing in GOD is part of a belief structure whether you are Muslim,Christian or jew .Therefore religion cannot be disproved as religion is a matter of faith not BELIEF.

This was the question.

Hypothetically, say it was somehow proven without a doubt, that no religions god exists. Never has never will. What would you do? What would be your response? Would your life be over after learning this ugly truth?

So, if you believe in god, rather then posting about how god is real or the greatness of god etc etc etc, just answer the question as best you can. Please remain on topic.

Originally posted by SFRemmy
So without further adue: Hypothetically, say it was somehow proven without a doubt, that no religions god exists. Never has never will. What would you do? What would be your response? Would your life be over after learning this ugly truth?

SFRemmy, good question. I can't really think of any reasonable way to answer it because if God does exist, then every element that comprises "life" and "reality" comes from God. In a way I think this question is similar to asking, "What would you think of a cake made with no sugar, eggs, flour, or butter?" The question doesn't really make sense because there can be no such thing as a "cake" without these ingredients.

However, I'm not suggestion that your question is irrelevant at all. In fact, I think your question, as well as Epicurus' proof are good ways to get people thinking about questions such as "What is life?" and "What is God?" Personally, I believe in God, but I don't really understand God or the concept of God fully. It would probably be safe to assume that no living person really understands God assuming that God exists. In Romans 11:33 it says, "Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!" This kind of summarizes my point of view.

In conclusion, I can't really answer the question because I believe in God and I believe that everything I've experienced as "life" and "reality" is the extension of God's creative force, so if God didn't exist, I think the concept of "reality" would be very different if it existed at all. Also, as I stated before I think this question is a very good way to wake people up and get them thinking. Of course, all of this is just my belief at this time and I respect everyone else's right to believe in God or not believe in God.

Im aetheis but I think if it was proven that there would be alot of chaos, because people would live the best life they could knowing that they would'nt have a heaven to enjoy...

I think it HAS been proven that no religion's God exists. Just look around at the current state of our world and then take a peak at history.

That said, I KNOW God exists - but couldn't prove it to anyone. God is in me - and I am in God.

Now - perhaps a better way to ask your question - given your own position on this - "what if it has been proven that the eternal Soul does not exist"? For you see, that is really what you are asking, isn't it?

Always,
Shawnna

It causes me not to questiuon the existence of G-d, but the existence of intelligent life on Earth every darned time a theological thread is started in Conspiracies in religion forum.

Such activity also causes a cute little kitten to be killed.

[edit on 11-2-2006 by Thomas Crowne]

the simple answer is this - thou shal not question or test thy God... its one of the commandments or other type of rule in the bible incase youve never heard about it. your questioning God right now so hes not gonna give you an answer, right away anyhow.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
It causes me not to questiuon the existence of G-d, but the existence of intelligent life on Earth every darned time a theological thread is started in Conspiracies in religion forum.

Such activity also causes a cute little kitten to be killed.

[edit on 11-2-2006 by Thomas Crowne]

My stupidity aside, as long as it's a kitten were talking was killed. Maybe David Beckham too. Anything else and I guess I'll just have to bear the guilt on my shoulders.

As for the godly creation of the universe and life on earth...

What IDT need's to be focusing on, rather then attacking the gaps of knowledge in existing scientific discoveries, IDT should be proving that life CANNOT occur naturally and that life NEEDS a creator. If they can do that, then the next and final step for them would be proving that an intelliget designer did in fact create the universe and direct the flow of life on this planet.

Also, the belief in god stems from the evolution of religion which has evidence for even today and in recent history in regards to the monotheistic belief. The unquestioning blind faith in god is an unfounded belief with no evidence that would lead one to know for a fact that there is a god at all. The only reasoning behind this belief is thanks to the religous scripture's devout believer's read. But, if religous scripture's can lay claim to a mystical diety without proof of such, then how come people don't believe as a matter of factual reality that many of the fantasy/sci-fi stories aren't just historical document's for other world's or dimension's? There's no proof that they aren't. Both the religous doctrine and the sci-fi book's were written by man. Look at scientology, litterally nothing to back it's claim, yet it's gaining follower's still.

Ok ok. Many things to say.

First off the Ten Commandments seem to me like a way just to keep people in check. I mean of GOD gave man free will, and then GOD forced man to worship it, and if you don't you go to hell. While you have that choice to worship or not, there are still very bad consequences. That's not much of a choice.
Had to get that off my chest.

I don't classify myself as any unparticular religion, my parents being the hard-core Irish-Catholics that they are. So honestly if GOD didn't exist, I wouldn't really give a rat's a**. I would probably even have a good chuckle about as society tore its-self apart. Now I’m not saying I do or do not believe in GOD, I just don't care. I think people should get more in touch with them selves then worry about worshiping some mystical entity that no one actually knows if it exists.

So to answer your question, I would probably make my self a sandwich.


[edit on 2/11/2006 by urbanoyster01]

"somehow proven without a doubt, that no religions god exists. Never has never will. What would you do?" == SFRemmy

1. Obviously, I would prepare for total anarchy. I would also be very interested in the mechanics of the "proof". If God
exists, he must be omnipotent. The proof would have to be on that order as well. To me, a characteristic of omnipotence
is the ability to create the universe, or universes. This would also show existance OUTSIDE the universe. Thus any proof
that cannot deal with OUTSIDE is automatically invalid.

2. Religion equates with Purpose. And purpose equates with humanity. Without purpose, whats matters anything ?

3. Which brings up a zero-sum game. Counter question for your gambling spirit. Would you bet on outcomes that are certain
to go against you every time ? Or would you rather bet on an outcome that is unknown but has an incredible potential payoff.
Your basic question defines the zero-sum game. I would never bet on zero-sum probabilities.

4. If God did not exist, he would have to be invented. (Forget who said that but heard it a long time ago)

Originally posted by Produkt
As for the godly creation of the universe and life on earth...

What IDT need's to be focusing on, rather then attacking the gaps of knowledge in existing scientific discoveries, IDT should be proving that life CANNOT occur naturally and that life NEEDS a creator. If they can do that, then the next and final step for them would be proving that an intelliget designer did in fact create the universe and direct the flow of life on this planet.

I'm not sure if this was meant in response to my post or just a general comment, but I felt like addressing it. First of all, I believe that God can manifest His power in any way, including evolution. I am firmly in favor of scientific inquiry into our universe. Many discoveries were made by those who thought with an open mind and relied on objective evidence to base their decisions (Galileo comes to mind).

Anyway, I admit that my belief on God relies on faith, but unbelief also requires faith. I don't think that anyone can prove or disprove God's existence to another person, although I believe it may be possible for someone to prove God's existence to themself i.e. through a spiritual revelation.

Also, there are many differnent conceptions of what "God" is. In the Bible, God is portrayed as having human emotions and as a father figure among other things. At first glance Hinduism appears to be polytheistic, until one learns that all their deities are manifestations of a Brahman or universal spirit. Other religions such as Shinto assign a supernatural spirit to everything. Maybe all of these depictions of God reveal some aspect of His nature, although I don't know that for sure.

Someone's belief/disbelief in God is a personal matter and should be respected as such. There are scientific modes of inquiry that reveal knowledge about the physical world and depending on your perspective reveal some things about God, but I don't believe that we can understand God fully using these methods. I think that the question "what is God?" is just as important as "does God exist?"