Excess mortality first week 2023

I've asked before but I'll ask again.

Can you please explain to us all what exactly a vaccine apologist is?

I've only ever come across the phrase from you and as I've been called it many many times I feel an explanation is only fair.


a reply to: Asmodeus3

a reply to: Asmodeus3

Any chance of answering my question about the state of the NHS and getting back on topic?

Other realities are available. Opinions, too.

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: Asmodeus3

Now come off it, I have given you my professional qualifications and decades of relevant experience in the field of Clinical Negligence, dealing with Medical Experts etc so stop with these lies.


What's yours, then?

Which have nothing to do with science as you have already admitted.

Now you have to admit what is causing the excess amount of non Covid deaths. You don't need qualifications in science for this. It's just straight forward.

a reply to: nonspecific

Good luck with that!

So what are you saying it man??

Go on, say you think that all non COVID mortality above average is a direct cause of vaccines and lockdowns.

That is what you are getting at isn't it?

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

originally posted by: nonspecific
You tell me.

Then back up those claims with proof if you like.

And that's going on the absurd notion that the entirety of the 23 percent above average mortality in the UK based solely on those two things.

You are talking nonsense again.




a reply to: Asmodeus3

It was a rhetorical question by the way....

The absurdity is the engagement in the denialism of reality and the reality is there are excess non Covid deaths in pretty much every country. Climate change and the Republicans can no longer be blamed for those deaths. Neither the orbital period of Earth.

originally posted by: nonspecific
I've asked before but I'll ask again.

Can you please explain to us all what exactly a vaccine apologist is?

I've only ever come across the phrase from you and as I've been called it many many times I feel an explanation is only fair.


a reply to: Asmodeus3

Vaccine apologists are those who deny that vaccined could cause harm or those who try to downplay the harms caused by the vaccines. Or find any other excuse to defend the vaccines for whatever reasons and the pharmaceuticals. And this goes together with denialism of reality.

Oh right.

Carry on then.

What do we call people that claim that vaccines only do harm or exaggerate the side effects caused by them?



a reply to: Asmodeus3

a reply to: Asmodeus3

Practicing in the field of Clinical Negligence does require some knowledge of medical matters and has gained me some valuable knowledge and experience of such things so you can just give up with your nonsense.

I thought you hated science and said you don't need any scientific qualifications to hold your opinions?

Seems like double standards to me.

I have already posited the fact that the current state of the NHS could be a significant factor in these deaths so if you have any regard for remaining on topic please answer me.

nonspecific


I don't think I am the only one who says it. Most of the ATS will agree with me. You can take a look around if you want.

But I have already made it clear in other threads what causes the excess deaths. I don't think there is much disagreement.

1) Lockdowns
2) Delays in getting crucial treatment (associated strongly with lockdowns)
3) Lack of good primary care
4) Mass vaccinations

originally posted by: nonspecific
Oh right.

Carry on then.

What do we call people that claim that vaccines only do harm or exaggerate the side effects caused by them?



a reply to: Asmodeus3

That's not relevant to the case of the Covid vaccines.

The AZ and J&,J vaccine for example have been withdrawn from most countries that have used them. So they were not safe and effective. AZ is produced in the UK.

The mRNA products are potentially dangerous and are associated with much more serious adverse reactions than the AZ vaccine for example.

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: Asmodeus3

Practicing in the field of Clinical Negligence does require some knowledge of medical matters and has gained me some valuable knowledge and experience of such things so you can just give up with your nonsense.

I thought you hated science and said you don't need any scientific qualifications to hold your opinions?

Seems like double standards to me.

I have already posited the fact that the current state of the NHS could be a significant factor in these deaths so if you have any regard for remaining on topic please answer me.

'Hated' science?? How do you come with these arguments? You are going from strawman to strawman.

You can have your opinion I am not saying the opposite but it will be an unqualified opinion with very little or no merits.

No I don't think you have an idea of what is causing the excess deaths. I have posted it above. The date of your NHS is just an excuse when you can't see the elephant in the room.

originally posted by: nonspecific
Oh right.

Carry on then.

What do we call people that claim that vaccines only do harm or exaggerate the side effects caused by them?



a reply to: Asmodeus3

Nobody has said that vaccines cause only harm. This is strawman.

Exaggerating the side effects?

The AZ that was produced in your country of origin has been withdrawn from the UK and most other countries that have ever used it. Fact.

Here is when you really start to engage in vaccine apologetics and denialism of reality.

a reply to: Asmodeus3

The current state of the NHS is very relevant.

I see that you continue to belittle other poster's and their opinions.

That's some very high horse that you are sat on.

I asked a question that was all.

Ifmyou can't answer just say so or ignore it as I've told you before.


a reply to: Asmodeus3

a reply to: nonspecific

PM for you.

a reply to: Asmodeus3

"Vaccine apologists are those that dare to question absolutely anything I say".

There, fixed that for you.

Carry on.

originally posted by: nonspecific
I asked a question that was all.

Ifmyou can't answer just say so or ignore it as I've told you before.


a reply to: Asmodeus3

Here is your answer again that I have already provided above.

A few replies back...

But I have already made it clear in other threads what causes the excess deaths. I don't think there is much disagreement.

1) Lockdowns
2) Delays in getting crucial treatment (associated strongly with lockdowns)
3) Lack of good primary care
4) Mass vaccinations


Factors they contribute to the excess non Covid deaths.

I am adding they lack of good primary care and lockdowns may also contribute partly to Covid deaths too.

originally posted by: Oldcarpy2
a reply to: Asmodeus3

The current state of the NHS is very relevant.

I see that you continue to belittle other poster's and their opinions.

That's some very high horse that you are sat on.

The factors that I have provided above are the most relevant in the amount of excess non Covid deaths.

Take a look again

1) Lockdowns
2) Delays in getting crucial treatment (associated strongly with lockdowns)
3) Lack of good primary care
4) Mass vaccinations

a reply to: nonspecific

I am stating again what I said above as there seems to be some avoidance...

Exaggerating the side effects?

The AZ that was produced in your country of origin has been withdrawn from the UK and most other countries that have ever used it. Fact

So the vaccine was not safe and effective.

I have created several threads covering stories about the strokes that killed many of Brits as a result of vaccination with the Astrazeneca vaccine.

There was some vaccine apologies but when a vaccine is withdrawn there are no other words to describe the situation. Only excuses

originally posted by: Grenade
a reply to: nonspecific

The same medical professionals, politicians and corporations who pushed vaccines are the ones who advised governments on implementing lockdowns.

Either way it’s their mess and they are to blame for the situation.

Lockdowns don’t work, masks don’t work, quarantines don’t work, mRNA vaccines don’t work. Just as I’ve been saying all along while the cheerleaders sat on their high horse riding us straight into this mess.

People who’ve been consistently wrong during the pandemic should just STFU now.

I would suggest all the evidence suggests that:-

1) Lockdowns worked to slow the spread. this is common sense.
2) Masks worked up to a point. They stopped the spread of large particles.
3) Quarantine clearly worked, this is just basic common sense, it stopped the spread.
4) Vaccines did what they said they would do, stopped serious illness/hospitalisation in the majority.

I don't know where you're getting your weird data from...

All sensible people, with common sense and the capactiy of critical thinking agree with this statement...

PA