Where Christmas Really comes from?

originally posted by: PapagiorgioCZ
a reply to: Terpene

Unfortunately not. The red robe of Nicolas (who was made up by the church) is coincidentally similar to Amanita.
The character goes... eh, why do I bother. 😃

It also looks like a Siamese Fighting Fish. Or a Yarrow flower. Lots of things are red and white.

originally posted by: musicismagic
there is no fkn devil
only in the mind of weird imagination

I don't know what world you live in - but when I look around - the only explanation I can come up with for the evil I see is - Yes, there is a devil.

originally posted by: PapagiorgioCZ
Hands off. It's so obviously toxic and demonic. How can people expose their kids to this evil is beyond me.
Little do they know I guess. Following video goes into Germanic roots and all the way to the fish god Dagon.

Im a pastor's kid.
I have a kid, now a new adult. I never taught her to believe in Santa and I was never raised to believe either. But told about Santa and what others believed. I did the same with my kid. I don't celebrate it as any religious day and quite frankly, do it out of annual habit more than anything. I decorate not with Christmassy Santa stuff, but winter stuff.

My dad celebrates as the birth of Jesus, even tho he knows this is not when Jesus was born - but since that is what everyone does.....

And as I write this, I actually fail to see the point in all of it anymore lol I have a fractured family, so its not some big famiy get together anymore.

I sound like the grinch. Disclaimer, I did not watch the video.


On that note, Halloween I love. Im not in to witches and satan and all of that - but love love love to decorate and dress up. *shrug*

a reply to: shaemac

Yet if you grew up in Prechristianized Norway and were male you would grow up looking forward to raping conquered women and looting their settlements. The only guiding religious principle would be "To be rewarded in Valhalla I must serve the clan best by raping and stealing honorably for my kindred.

Honestly. Prechristianized Norse. Their afterlife was like American Afterlife only rewarding the soldiers with the most verified kills.

So you're both right.

Even what is seen as evil is in constant flux. What is viewed as evil in Judeo-Christian society has commonality but is not absolute across the board.

And it wasn't common in Norway until Christians showed up and reworked the Norse Mythology until it fell into line with theirs. They still raped a lot though.

It's a f***** world.

Morality in African tribal culture uses domination and mutilation to battle out for control. Uncontacted tribes throw spears at helicopters observing them. Probably still thinking something lost in time. Weird ones like us flying wind breathing serpents. Something completely right to them lacking cultural immersion. If anything was absolute and encoded by default it wouldn't need to be taught to be incorporated.

Not to come down the mountain on you but there is really no such thing as "Absolute Morality". Good and Evil are culturally adapted constructs. There is natural animal empathy and self preservation, and there are influencers who's morality sets the stage (Like Jesus vs. Rome) and many more who follow. To the point it is ingrained into inherited archetypes and collective trauma.

That's just my opinion though. My own attempt at a master morality that's really just a default philosophic slave morality. Sort of an infinite regregress conundrum.

Still, many societies play follow the leader. And our leaders, for the most part, still have a monotheistic good/evil base to them. Muslims kinda did their own thing with that.

One thing you can count on is right and wrong being forever redefined organically but there still always being a fighting moral concensus on what is most cultural respectful.

Not like people agree with William Randolph Hearst like they did in 1912. Up to 20 States now. But at one point morality could attach it to Mexican filth and turn it into a cultural evil. And all it took was one dude protecting his timber assets to lead the morality.

All morality spreads in a similar bottom-up fashion.

So nothing. Lame.

a reply to: PapagiorgioCZ

It’s old esoteric magic elites know about, they just changed the name and meaning to keep regular people confused. Sanctus Clasutrum is the Holy of all holes. It’s the empty part of our brain that holds this oil called christos. If you sustain from sex at the right time each month you can greatly benefit from it. Look up a guy named Santos Bonacci if you want to learn more about it.

originally posted by: shaemac
My dad celebrates as the birth of Jesus, even tho he knows this is not when Jesus was born

When was Jesus born? I'm a PK, too.


TCB

originally posted by: TrulyColorBlind
Oh, gee.... it's the Christmas season and people are bashing Christianity. Again. I didn't see that coming.

A writer in Britain’s Catholic Herald observed: “Gradually, with increasing general affluence, many of the unfortunate aspects of the middle-class Christmas ritual have become widespread. Simplicity and generosity have been overtaken by competitiveness and oneupmanship. The homely feasting which was once a genuine treat has been replaced by orgies of over abundant heavy food. Families are forced by this new tradition to spend days together whether they like it or not, playing games which some of them despise, watching television some of them hate, cutting out contact with neighbours and outsiders at the one time when goodwill and general friendliness are supposed to reign.

“And if one says this, if one ventures to criticise either the commercialism or the mere social conventions of it all, one is labelled a Scrooge. To my mind Christmas has gone horribly wrong in recent years.”

That quote was from the 1980's, I guess it's a Grinch now instead of a Scrooge (the OP was already called a Grinch in this thread).

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Klassified
a reply to: PapagiorgioCZ

Merry Saturnalia, you Grinch.

Saturnalia is from the 17th Dec to 23 Dec.

Yep. It sure is.

Source. Haddon Sundblom and the Coca-Cola Santas

Coca-Cola Helped Shape the Image of Santa In 1931 the company began placing Coca-Cola ads in popular magazines. Archie Lee, the D'Arcy Advertising Agency executive working with The Coca-Cola Company, wanted the campaign to show a wholesome Santa who was both realistic and symbolic. So Coca-Cola commissioned Michigan-born illustrator Haddon Sundblom to develop advertising images using Santa Claus — showing Santa himself, not a man dressed as Santa. For inspiration, Sundblom turned to Clement Clark Moore's 1822 poem "A Visit From St. Nicholas" (commonly called "'Twas the Night Before Christmas"). Moore's description of St. Nick led to an image of a warm, friendly, pleasantly plump and human Santa. (And even though it's often said that Santa wears a red coat because red is the color of Coca-Cola, Santa appeared in a red coat before Sundblom painted him.) Sundblom’s Santa debuted in 1931 in Coke ads in The Saturday Evening Post and appeared regularly in that magazine, as well as in Ladies Home Journal, National Geographic, The New Yorker and others.

👽

a reply to: whereislogic

That quote was from the 1980's, I guess it's a Grinch now instead of a Scrooge (the OP was already called a Grinch in this thread).

that's just comparing the clash of 2 middle class social engineering projects.. Victorian British vs Post modern American.. its replete through the world and our society, the red vs the green, father Christmas vs Santa Claus etc etc all the way down to the obsession with sex based stereotypes that become the go to costume for a middle class that cos plays the latest indulgences..

scrape away the surface and the poor continue to observe there own traditions which has always been an eclectic mix of Christian ,pagan, neo pagan and everything that makes them happy.

my family had a long sit down discussion this year about this topic as we've let slip many of our traditions in recent years, from the pre Christmas December family dinner party (family version of the works do), to Christmas eve drinks in the pub followed by semi drunk midnight mass and a few drinks down the pub pre Christmas day lunch..

All of which eliminate the pressure to turn up and sit through a tedious lunch on Christmas day as you end up spending more/better qwuality time with family f=getting drunk and singing carols..

the only think missing this year was meeting up for a drink on boxing day as part of the boxing day sales which seem to have been eliminated this year in favour of the American black Friday sales.. I'm sure it'll come back as retailers realise they are missing significant traditional revenue streams..

a reply to: TrulyColorBlind

that's a very middle class occupation.. as they bounce between high church and no church.. the poor on the other hand follow their own Christmas traditions as they don't have the kind of wealth to pick and choose..

Christmas simply comes from the observation that the days get shorter, the Sun rises lower in the sky and plant life dies .... and then, one day, the days start getting longer again, the Sun rises higher and plants spring back to life .... It marks the turn of the year and the relief that once again we've avoided the end of the world. So let's have some drinks, roast a boar, and party!

Everything else is a modern addition.

a reply to: AndyMayhew

Everything else is a modern addition.

except the excuse to be merry, its why when you look back down the ages the key components for this time of year is food/dinking/dancing/singing and games..

Some ancillary info you may or may not have known…..

Source The Physics of Santa and His Reindeer

This tongue-in-cheek scientific analysis of Santa's toy delivery mechanisms is believed to have originated with an article published in (the now defunct) Spy magazine at the end of 1990, although some readers claim to have encountered the Internet prior to its publication in Spy.

The Physics of Santa and His Reindeer

No known species of reindeer can fly. BUT there are 300,000 species of living organisms yet to be classified, and while most of these are insects and germs, this does not COMPLETELY rule out flying reindeer which only Santa has ever seen.

There are two billion children (persons under 18) in the world. BUT since Santa doesn't appear to handle the Muslim, Hindu, Jewish and Buddhist children, that reduces the workload to 15% of the total — 378 million according to Population Reference Bureau. At an average (census) rate of 3.5 children per household, that's 91.8 million homes. One presumes there's at least one good child in each. Santa has 31 hours of Christmas to work with, thanks to the different time zones and the rotation of the earth, assuming he travels east to west (which seems logical). This works out to 822.6 visits per second. This is to say that for each Christian household with good children, Santa has 1/1000th of a second to park, hop out of the sleigh, jump down the chimney, fill the stockings, distribute the remaining presents under the tree, eat whatever snacks have been left, get back up the chimney, get back into the sleigh and move on to the next house.

Assuming that each of these 91.8 million stops are evenly distributed around the earth (which, of course, we know to be false but for the purposes of our calculations we will accept), we are now talking about .78 miles per household, a total trip of 75½ million miles, not counting stops to do what most of us must do at least once every 31 hours, plus feeding and etc. This means that Santa's sleigh is moving at 650 miles per second, 3,000 times the speed of sound. For purposes of comparison, the fastest man-made vehicle on earth, the Ulysses space probe, moves at a poky 27.4 miles per second — a conventional reindeer can run, tops, 15 miles per hour.

If every one of the 91.8 million homes with good children were to put out a single chocolate chip cookie and an 8 ounce glass of 2% milk, the total calories (needless to say other vitamins and minerals) would be approximately 225 calories (100 for the cookie, give or take, and 125 for the milk, give or take). Multiplying the number of calories per house by the number of homes (225 x 91.8 x 1000000), we get the total number of calories Santa consumes that night, which is 20,655,000,000 calories. To break it down further, 1 pound is equal to 3500 calories. Dividing our total number of calories by the number of calories in a pound (20655000000/3500) and we get the number of pounds Santa gains, 5901428.6, which is 2950.7 tons.

The payload on the sleigh adds another interesting element. Assuming that each child gets nothing more than a medium-sized lego set (two pounds), the sleigh is carrying 321,300 tons, not counting Santa, who is invariably described as overweight. On land, conventional reindeer can pull no more than 300 pounds. Even granting that "flying reindeer" (see above) could pull TEN TIMES the normal amount, we cannot do the job with eight, or even nine. We need 214,200 reindeer. This increases the payload (not even counting the weight of the sleigh) to 353,430 tons. Again, for comparison, this is four times the weight of the Queen Elizabeth. 353,000 tons traveling at 650 miles per second creates enormous air resistance — this will heat the reindeer up in the same fashion as spacecraft re-entering the earth's atmosphere.

The lead pair of reindeer will absorb 14.3 QUINTILLION joules of energy. Per second. Each. In short, they will burst into flame almost instantaneously, exposing the reindeer behind them, and create deafening sonic booms in their wake. The entire reindeer team will be vaporized within 4.26 thousandths of a second. Santa, meanwhile, will be subjected to centrifugal forces 17,500.06 times greater than gravity. A 250-pound Santa (which seems ludicrously slim) would be pinned to the back of his sleigh by 4,315,015 pounds of force.

In conclusion: If Santa ever DID deliver presents on Christmas Eve, he's dead now.

👽

a reply to: Ophiuchus1

These guys did well, some other of their vids do well explaining realdom also imo



www.youtube.com...