Lost Roman Map has ATLANTIS at Eye of Sahara Africa! (Richat Structure)

But a counter argument is that SOMEONE was mining a hell of a lot of copper in north America and Copper plus Tin of course Equals bronze.

Indeed they were .
I have also personally visited some ancient copper mines in the Greek island of Crete.
I’m pretty sure there were other Tin mines in Europe though too, eastern Turkey region, but I may be remembering incorrectly .
a reply to: LABTECH767

originally posted by: LABTECH767
But a counter argument is that SOMEONE was mining a hell of a lot of copper in north America and Copper plus Tin of course Equals bronze.

The people mining that copper left more behind than just holes in the ground. And they weren't making bronze.

Harte

originally posted by: havanaja
BUT! Have pottery, houses, or ship, or weaponry relics or any related signs of a city been excavated at the site?? a reply to: 727Sky

Like the rest of the world your focus was taken off the target, and on to a "fiction". Realistically the "Ringed City" was only part of a vast network, not unlike today's city surrounded by suburbs. Because of the nature and force of the "event" very little remains of the center island, except maybe massive building foundations, in ruin. All other items were washed away in the very powerful flooding "event". The chances of "discovery" are far higher in the outer rings and along the path the water took to the ocean. Massive building blocks can be found scattered to the south in the "Flood Zone". Only 3 remained in the center island.

Suspected Building foundations in the Center Island.













When I view this site and the surrounding sites, I dont think the "Jetsons" . I think, the "Flintstones". Advanced in many ways, but at the same time, very primitive.

originally posted by: bluesfreak

Its a comment from afictional book about a fictional event it is not evidence of anything.

..say the self appointed guardians of our knowledge.

Dismissed as being from someone one with little to no knowledge

You can just pretend it has no significance , wave it away with a flick of your overconfident hand.

Yep, hearsay is pretty unimportant and if you add a complete lack of any evidence for the place ....

Plato still talks about the Americas , before any other Greek, you can’t erase that.

Nope, again you don't understand what you are talking about.

No Greek maps show said "continent". What is the Greek word for 'continent'?

originally posted by: bluesfreak

But a counter argument is that SOMEONE was mining a hell of a lot of copper in north America and Copper plus Tin of course Equals bronze.

Indeed they were .
I have also personally visited some ancient copper mines in the Greek island of Crete.
I’m pretty sure there were other Tin mines in Europe though too, eastern Turkey region, but I may be remembering incorrectly .
a reply to: LABTECH767

No one would take a year long journey to NA when the mines of Cyprus (which name means copper) were available as were many other sites in the MED. Tin however was rare and had to be sought out in Europe and Asia.

If you want some fun take a map and plot how a person from the Levant would get to the copper fields around Lake Superior. Oh and remember all the current canals didn't exist.

There is no evidence Old world folks were going to the NA for copper.

originally posted by: All Seeing Eye


All other items were washed away in the very powerful flooding "event". The chances of "discovery" are far higher in the outer rings and along the path the water took to the ocean. Massive building blocks can be found scattered to the south in the "Flood Zone". Only 3 remained in the center island.

No such flooding event happened if you mean that fantasy youtube. As noted (you really need to read the existing science then you wouldn't be led so easily astray) there is no 'delta' of debris - the fellow in the youtube lied to you about what was a subsurface land slide. The whole things is fantasy - I would recommend you look at a geological map of Africa and figure out how a wave went 2400 kilometers up and down various heights.....

Yep there are/were people living in that area - that isn't the question - the question is there a wildly old city called by Plato Atlantis there?

The only way to determine that is to go there and do an actual excavation - but that would mean organization, money and actual work.

No one would take a year long journey to NA when the mines of Cyprus (which name means copper) were available as were many other sites in the MED. Tin however was rare and had to be sought out in Europe and Asia. If you want some fun take a map and plot how a person from the Levant would get to the copper fields around Lake Superior. Oh and remember all the current canals didn't exist. There is no evidence Old world folks were going to the NA for copper.

Ah the master distractor at work again.
Where did I say that people went from the Levant to NA?
I didn’t did I?
I simply refuted your stupid childish argument that sailing an ocean was the same as coast hugging .
Which it isn’t .

Yep, hearsay is pretty unimportant and if you add a complete lack of any evidence for the place ....

Ah except when YOU want to believe the word of one Greek guy over another , both living thousands of years after the event they describe.
Literally no evidence for Herodotus GP claims , just hearsay, he didn’t return with any actual documents just “ they told me” . That’s hearsay. And you are perfectly happy to believe it as truth.

Did you manage to get Hartes clown make up finished?
Sit still, as he’s probably working on yours right now . a reply to: Hanslune

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: All Seeing Eye


All other items were washed away in the very powerful flooding "event". The chances of "discovery" are far higher in the outer rings and along the path the water took to the ocean. Massive building blocks can be found scattered to the south in the "Flood Zone". Only 3 remained in the center island.

No such flooding event happened if you mean that fantasy youtube. As noted (you really need to read the existing science then you wouldn't be led so easily astray) there is no 'delta' of debris - the fellow in the youtube lied to you about what was a subsurface land slide. The whole things is fantasy - I would recommend you look at a geological map of Africa and figure out how a wave went 2400 kilometers up and down various heights.....

Yep there are/were people living in that area - that isn't the question - the question is there a wildly old city called by Plato Atlantis there?

The only way to determine that is to go there and do an actual excavation - but that would mean organization, money and actual work.

For a non believer you certainly appear to want to take charge, and show the way lol lol lol "You Must" "You Need". lol lol

How about "There’s More Than One Way To Skin A Cat " lol lol lol

Why dont you write a book describing how all the evidence, is not evidence lol Your really wasting your time here.......

a reply to: Hanslune

This is true BUT the knowledge of how to make bronze despite the outdated 18th century adherence to Isolationism that still lingers may very well have reached the new world, however a distinct lack of any bronze artifacts would argue that even if it did it was then not used by any of the existing cultures that WE know of in the new world at that time.

Bronze though probably instead reached it's zenith in China were we have such ancient and indeed magnificent wonders as the famous sword found in a tomb in Xinyang that was from the late bronze age warring states period, still sharp enough to cut silk and still untarnished perhaps due to claims it had a thin layer of chromium on it probably deposited through a chemical process but possibly electroplated as well that still shines untarnished.

Even after the spread of iron working knowledge in the old world Bronze due in part to it's beauty remained desirable if not as practical for warfare among many cultures.

So I do concede your point there and you make a very obvious observation, however there was a huge and not a tiny amount of copper smelting that went on in the great lakes region of North America, this copper culture must have had an extensive trade network that at the very least must have spread across the America's and just possibly even to other continents.

Now admittedly I also concede that trans Atlantic and trans pacific trade during that time seems on the surface to be unlikely BUT genetic evidence has shown that contact between peoples DID occur, this in turn throws into doubt even further the old isolationist ideology and suggests that if people traded genes they may very well nave traded far more than that.

Now I am not very coherent at the moment (ocular migraine or rather the painful after affect of one that stay with me for a day or two after each episode) so please forgive me if I am not more concise.

My belief opinion is of course just an opinion but I feel it is arrogant to deny that trade and contact existed even if it only existed mostly as a peripheral interaction.

Something say's to me though that we are missing a huge piece on the jigsaw, much as others have a belief I do believe that there is a very strong suggestion of a lost culture that once connected many other cultures in the world.

I do not call this lost culture or perhaps NOT a culture but perhaps a pre cataclysmic period of human contact and interaction Atlantis however but I tend to believe that the human story is far more complex than we are currently told by the current historical theory and model of humanity that so many of you adhere to so devoutly like accolyte's of a faith in fact.

So while I am a Christian with my own faith, one that DOES suggest that we had a root culture i.e. the tower of Babel be that a tower or an entire civilization that was scattered and broken take that as you shall and my faith is far from the only religion to share the idea of a lost golden age though for us as Christians it was not so much a golden age as one in which an overly ambitious used the power he had over his people to attempt to challenge heaven stepping far beyond what they were at that time permitted and before we were ready as a race, firing an Arrow into heaven (launching a rocket perhaps?).

I accept that other ideology's exist.

In the western world rooted in a hatred for the Church men such as Voltaire inspired many secret brotherhood members that have had such a strong influence upon society, set up fraternity's and invented the PEER review concept with there scientific brotherhoods that were really just Lodges in disguise such as the Royal Society based in London for example which acted to destroy the reputations of scientists that did not tow the line they wanted them to and which for a long time controlled the purse strings of much of the scientific endeavour within the western world along with it's fellow fraternity's in other nations.

This corruption stymied and eventually sought to eradicate biblical believers from the mainstream of science, it also with far less zeal attacked other religious believers and yet was all along enforcing it's own semi religious adherence to the what it regarded as Acceptable upon it's fellows (literally a title such as a Fellow of the Royal society as if that makes one an expert when in fact it really just means one is a good little lackey and does not shake the boat too much but does give something useful that the fraternity will accept), but needless to say I digress and am not feeling awfully coherent at the moment.

But what I am saying is think outside the box, you are correct on your point I concede that but there is still far more than that what is acceptable to the paradigm enforced by PEER review and and ESTABLISHED theory's and SOCIETYS that police our knowledge of the past.

These group for example tried and continue to try to maintain the flawed and based in anti Christian (anti Church) Sentiment theology of there own new religion.

And what they have done has worked a real number on western society, destroyed it's foundational morality and central pillar of belief, this is NOT advancement of humanity as so many would falsely claim.

They have schemed and tried to eradicate religion in particular Christianity and the church's power in the west with the obvious disastrous impact that the loss of faith due to this false teaching has had upon society as a whole as it's very foundation was broken up by supposed men of learning whom were really just a bunch of fruitcakes that were members of a loony brotherhood that hated the church.

Let's be fair that is the root and stem of the bloody problem now isn't it, anything outside of what is acceptable to that model then becomes Heresy against the NEW anti God religion that has pervaded so much of our western sciences including History.

The truth is what is really important is TRUTH, not fellowship or brotherhood in some esoteric sect no matter how respectable they try to make themselves out to be while worshipping pagan ideals and offering a poison carrot on a stick to the poor people whose society they have usurped from them as if they were nothing but donkey's.

Sorry I am not very lucid at the moment due to my migraine and it's after affects and probably shan't be for a day or two.

Not getting at you just blowing some steam and I am really fed up with all the nonsense, yes if I am wrong then I am wrong but that is not the point, we are all seeking Truth but what some forget is that there is only ONE truth, which one is it that is the question, certainly not the truth of a bunch of Pagan weirdo's that think Voltaire was a dark saint of there anti Christian God.


(after thought, I'll leave that little rant up but know it sound disjointed and not very lucid, not feeling the whole shilling at the moment if you catch my meaning).

a reply to: LABTECH767

(after thought, I'll leave that little rant up but know it sound disjointed and not very lucid, not feeling the whole shilling at the moment if you catch my meaning).

You did a fine job. After all, the subject is quite involved..

Dismissed as being from someone one with little to no knowledge

Ah , to be dismissed by the Self Appointed Guardians of our knowledge. Thank you. It’s an honour.
Especially with your self appointment, it’s even more satisfying.
Dismiss , refute , deny , attack .
That’s all you actually do here, a mirror of the academic world in which you live and that you try to paint as intellectual and measured.
Which is a total joke , as we have all seen evidenced in Hancocks series where people like you, from your ‘team’ deny site access to those with different ideas.
You can blame the park rangers etc for it, but everyone knows why , and everyone can watch as the archaeological ‘establishment ‘and its games that you so deny exists is alive and well.
You guys got shown up for what you really are there.
And you all have to take that hit whether you like it or not.

Maybe others in the class should ‘dismiss’ the nonsense you spout too, ( your attachment to made up guesses and estimates of GP numbers , figures, timeframe for construction, you know , that completely Made Up stuff you cling to so desperately, as one example ) your self appointment, your rudeness and your willingness to try to demean others on here consistently .
Dismiss me all you like, I’m still here .
a reply to: Hanslune

Geological mechanism are whole world wide affair not just related to Atlantis - they aren't anything but a mechanism not evidence something might be there. That something could possibility have happened is not evidence it did happen.

Youv e just proved to me how little you have studied the mid Atlantic ridge .
Are you aware that the first team to dredge seamounts at the Azores concluded that the area had seen ‘vertical uplift ‘ in the past , up to the late Pleistocene , sub aerially eroded limestone , unexpected shorelines,unexpected shallow water fossils and fauna only found at shallow depths , in bays and coves .
Are you aware of this?
This was done in 1947 with a group who went there completely open minded , and were quite shocked by what they discovered .
Are you even aware this happened?
Plato speaks of a large island, facing the POH that sank around 11,600 years bp.
The mechanisms there match what Plato describes .

That means “ it could have happened” .
If the mechanisms there DIDNT exist, I could understand it being refutable , however, the fact that these mechanisms are present opens the door to further investigation concerning Platos description.

Whether you like it or not .

a reply to: Hanslune

originally posted by: bluesfreak

...

... Hancocks series where people like you, from your ‘team’ deny site access to those with different ideas.

You're presumably referring to this.

You can blame the park rangers etc for it, ...

Here, the Serpent Mound ticket lady, (about 0:30), states that the reasons why Hancock's team were refused permission were connected with logistics: the number of days required, and the fact that the filming would apparently have taken place over a holiday period.

... Maybe others in the class should ‘dismiss’ the nonsense you spout too, ( your attachment to made up guesses and estimates of GP numbers , figures, timeframe for construction, you know , that completely Made Up stuff you cling to so desperately ...
a reply to: Hanslune

Because of the very nature of the GP, much of the discussion about how it was built has to be based on best estimates, following extensive study over the years.

Obviously, after 4,500 years, one cannot expect corroborative documentary evidence to emerge.

Except when it does ...

Here, the Serpent Mound ticket lady, (about 0:30), states that the reasons why Hancock's team were refused permission were connected with logistics: the number of days required, and the fact that the filming would apparently have taken place over a holiday period.

Well, you can believe the Ticket Lady if you like ,and no disrespect to her , but Hancock showed and read the letter he received regarding this, and it DEFINITELY talks about “ideas” that don’t conform to their own interpretations regarding this beautiful man made structure , so he was denied access.
You can try and defend this decision all you like, yet anyone with half a brain can see through it , and knows the reasons for his denial.
It proves everything he says about challenging narratives .
He didn’t need to do much to prove his point did he? Your ‘lot’ did it for him!

And as for the GP- (and many AE narratives ) the further one digs, if you pardon the pun, into the data , it becomes apparent that ‘you guys’ (the defenders of the status quo) really don’t know many things, you just surmise, and all nod together on something you can all agree on:

Herodotus ‘ “story” of the timeframe for construction :
HEARSAY, NO EVIDENCE AT ALL. NO EVIDENCE. NONE.

Number of blocks : A GUESS, AN ESTIMATE , made up numbers with different groups offering other ‘made up’ calculations.

Blocks per minute conundrum:
INSANE projections for moving 2+ tonne stones
again, MADE UP FIGURES that differ, throw up so many unanswerable logistical questions.

Ramp: MADE UP THEORIES which NONE OF YOU can decide on - one ramp? Two ramps? A ramp on each side ? Spiral internal seems the most plausible construction-wise, but all we hear from these unimaginative Egyptologists and Archaeologists is ramps up the side , SOMEHOW.
Literally NO EVIDENCE for any , again supposition and SPECULATION.

These ‘guesses’ are the things you decry the fringe for , and they are EVERYWHERE once you actually start taking a hard look at the data .
Supposition, speculation dripping from Egyptology .
Oh what temerity we have calling it out ,too.

So it’s learned people who GUESS A LOT versus other people they don’t like, who Guess other stuff they don’t agree with .
Your lies vs what you perceive as their lies.

Great .


Ps- merer says nothing about timeframe, construction methods , number of blocks or logistics that would help your cause - he is bringing Tura limestone for the outer casing , yet he doesn’t say at what stage they GP is at during his ferrying , does he?
So you don’t know if the outer casings were added post- internal structure , or were done simultaneously .
Each throws up a multitude of questions.
Merers diary IS amazing that it survived , a wonderful document , but it’s basically a shipping manifest, not a social or construction document .

a reply to: Hooke

The letter plainly states
“ Because the presenter of this series ,Graham Hancock proposes a theory and story that do not align with what we know to be true about Serpent Mound , your request is denied.”

There we have it .
A theory and story that do not ‘align’.
“What we know to be true “

The sheer arrogance on display is sickening .
This is closed , dare I say it , Fascist ‘ Science’.

I hope you guys Hooke, Harte, and Hans, who so defend the ‘establishment ‘ itself and its models, are proud of what this represents .

Any backlash against these methods is deserved .

We see you now . It’s all out in the open at last .

Now, as much as I think Jimmy from ‘bright insight’ and his bull# pretence of discovery of things is a big ridiculous con job, and as much as I think that Brien Forster may go on a bit too much about Coronal ejections , there’s no way I would have them banned from the Giza Plataeu, for instance , simply because they don’t ‘align’ with what , say Zahi says .

Your ‘team ‘ looks very very bad here, and you all have some deep thinking to do .

I can’t believe they ACTUALLY wrote that.
It’s disgusting .
a reply to: Hooke

the Self Appointed Guardians of our knowledge.

Actually true to some degree. But not completely. At the core of this "cult" of ignorance lay the benefactors who benefit from humanity's "Hood Winked" ignorance, as the children follow the Pied Piper..

Its the ancient black magic, today, we call Psychology. The cult are given directives as to what can and can not be known by the children, sheep. The word goes out to all the lodges involved. The members fabricate the "story" , then by blood oath they all support each other in spreading the "Hood Winking". A member will sell the idea via a book he wrote, other members will completely agree with the premises, as the other members are in positions of influence and power, the ignorant masses buy into the train of thought, ideas . It then becomes the Accepted "Norm" for the subject. And all the while the children never learn the cult associations of the mouth pieces pushing the trash. All subjects today have been infected with this hood winking. How many of you actually believe their is a missing planet by the name "Nibiru"?

In truth they are the self appointed Fabricators, of our truths... And if you stand up and point out the errors in their "Story" they will ignore, defame, ridicule, and insult you. They will call in other cult members to gang up on you, until you give up.

And to expose the truth of the ringed city, exposes the hidden benefactors! "I have no evidence" lol lol lol

Too many "smart monkeys"? to deal with? Its Cull time (Jab). There really is a core to the corruption, that uses, bad monkeys.........Brother!!!!

In truth they are the self appointed Fabricators, of our truths... And if you stand up and point out the errors in their "Story" they will ignore, defame, ridicule, and insult you. They will call in other cult members to gang up on you, until you give up.

Indeed.

These Cleopatronisers Harte and Hans don’t even smell the stench of their own utter hypocrisy.

It’s laughable in a horrible , pitiful way, really, yet on the other hand, watching two people defend made-up calculations as if it’s truth has a beautiful irony regarding the ‘fringe ‘ they so hate .

It’s archao-comedy .

They believe they have a right here to insult peoples intelligence , demean them, talk down to others, as they have got away with it for so long, it’s normal to them.
In the street they’d both be knocked on their asses for talking to others how they do. And they know it. That’s why they do it here.
They go home with their poky little b*ners knocking together as they believe in their victories defending MADE UP info about the GP, for example.

Keep defending that made up sh*t lads, such a good look for YOUR intelligence.

a reply to: All Seeing Eye

originally posted by: LABTECH767
a reply to: Hanslune
So I do concede your point there and you make a very obvious observation, however there was a huge and not a tiny amount of copper smelting that went on in the great lakes region of North America, this copper culture must have had an extensive trade network that at the very least must have spread across the America's and just possibly even to other continents.

That's very unlikely to say the least.
You need to know that they were mining copper in pure form, not smelting it, and they were doing it for a thousand years or so, not a big bunch at a time, in other words.
Also, there is no good way to estimate how much copper was taken. The amount bandied about by the fringe is simply made up - it exceeds the volume of the known holes where they mined.
Even so, you can't just take the volume of holes as your estimate either, when you don't know what was in them - a giant piece, dozens of small chunks, couple hundred nuggets, who knows?
Lastly, I've read that people that live in the area have baskets full of the copper artifacts they've found stashed in their barns and garages.

Harte

originally posted by: paraphi
If you are a geologist, or someone interested in geology, then you would have heard about this natural structure.

The argument that the narrator "has not heard of this before" just means that he's learning what loads of people already know.

The Richat structure is not Atlantis, no matter how many tenuous facts he tries to introduce to make the fantasy come alive. It is a geological feature that is understood by geologists. Contrary to what the narrator asserts, there are other - similar structures - found else where, so the structure is not even unique.

God, please educate the ignorant.

In the story of Atlantis, the ring features are said to have been created directly by Poseidon. The canals cut through them to connect them so boats could sail through are attributed to human effort.

Generally when the ancients say that a "god did" something, they mean it was a natural feature.

It is of course possible that there could be other similar structures elsewhere.

originally posted by: Hanslune

originally posted by: bluesfreak

But a counter argument is that SOMEONE was mining a hell of a lot of copper in north America and Copper plus Tin of course Equals bronze.

Indeed they were .
I have also personally visited some ancient copper mines in the Greek island of Crete.
I’m pretty sure there were other Tin mines in Europe though too, eastern Turkey region, but I may be remembering incorrectly .
a reply to: LABTECH767

No one would take a year long journey to NA when the mines of Cyprus (which name means copper) were available as were many other sites in the MED. Tin however was rare and had to be sought out in Europe and Asia.

They would if another guild had claimed it all.

If you want some fun take a map and plot how a person from the Levant would get to the copper fields around Lake Superior. Oh and remember all the current canals didn't exist.

You would leave your ship at the coast and hike up river, and then build a new wooden barge every time you wanted to transport some copper from there back down to the coast.

There is no evidence Old world folks were going to the NA for copper.

If they were there, they must not have brought any pigs with them. Otherwise the native peoples would already have been exposed to small pox.

The argument that the narrator "has not heard of this before" just means that he's learning what loads of people already know.

I agree with Paraphi, the new ‘hype’ around the Richat is exactly that- Hype.
It’s not newly discovered , in fact, I’m pretty sure there is a book from the early/mid 80’s by a French couple, I believe, who explored it on foot.
It was seen from space way before that too.


There are so many great independent researchers out there , but for me Jimmy from ‘bright insight ‘ channel isn’t one of them .
He pretends he is the first to think of a subject , when what he really means is ‘ Ive only just found out about this’
He piggy backs onto the research of others without crediting them. Everything he finds has already been ‘found’ .

Jimmy doesn’t really mind though, as the money he gets from his click bait each month from YouTube would probably make your jaw drop.

Seriously guys, if you’re into this Richat idea, take a delve and find out that this has been known about for a long time .
If Jimmy believes Plato that Atlantis existed, why doesn’t Jimmy acknowledge that the Richat is 27 miles across or something , which is not what Plato describes, neither WHERE plato describes .

Don’t let Jimmy (or Harte, for that matter) tell or teach you how to think:
Do it for yourself .
a reply to: bloodymarvelous