Hysterics - Ignorance - Uneducation - Childishness

I hope it's ok to start a new thread, although there are existing threads about this topic, just maybe not from this exact perspective.

Those topics are relatively old, however, so I figured, maybe the rant-section would be good for this, as there are things that seriously piss me off and mystify me about this topic.

We all know the 'feared symbol' of the dreaded, evil, most horrible lines on paper, AAGH, I am shaking, scared just to think about it, and if I saw it, I would probably have to make my eyes commit suicide!

How can anyone, EVER, in the whole human history, past, present, future, any dimension, any entity, be bold, daring, and downright EVIL enough to draw lines on paper! I mean, in a certain way, of course, but still! LINES ON PAPER is the most horrible thing someone can see, it would traumatize a child, it would make your aunt start talking in tongues, it would make your grandpa have a mushroom flashback and it would make even the most hardened, though, tattooed, bald-headed, screaming, hate-make-up-warpainted feminist jump out the window!

Ok, I am dramatizing a bit for effect, but holy macril does this piss me off - it's remarkable that the same thing I am criticizing people for overreacting to, can piss me off for so many separate reasons. Am I a hypocrite, too? Maybe.

In any case, we all know what we're talking about here, the dreaded MANJI symbol, of course!

Most people probably understand what I mean, but there might be someone who thinks at this point, "Huh? Manji? What's that? Sounds like the name of a fruit, and here I thought this poster is talking about something actually EVIL and horrible, like the nazi swastika or something"

Manji is 卍. It's not a nazi symbol, it's what nazis took and reversed.

Japanese teenagers at least used to have a trend, where they'd use this symbol a LOT. They'd end their sentences with it casually, as it sounds like the word 'maji', which is usually said as 'maji de?', meaning, 'really?' or 'seriously?'.

So the trend became 'maji manji'. I think it's pretty funny, but this whole situation reeks of ignorance, hypocrisy, childishness, weak minds and 'uneducation' for the lack of a better term. It also brushes on 'official story vs. facts' (where people always believe the official story, even if the facts say it's impossible, because they're emotionally programmed to turn off their rational mind at certain topics or even words - and yes, even symbols!)

Symbols only have the power we give them. You put symbols on a table, they won't do anything. They have no power. There can't be a 'universal symbol of evil', if we don't give it that power. If we start treating a symbol casually and normally, as an everyday thing, it loses its power.

Everything suffers inflation if you use it a lot. Think about the english "C-word". It used to be super powerful, people would get shocked from hearing it, it would almost stop your heart. Now it's an everyday term that no one cares much about or reacts to. Why do we still keep some symbols in this weird, powerful, elevated status, where they can strike us hard and erase our thinking mind?

It all starts with the temples and shrines, that have used the Manji for a really long time, way before nazis even existed. I don't know the origin of it, some claim the hindus created it, but it has been found in artifacts that are over 12 000 years old, so maybe they even used it in Atlantis.

As this thread accurately shows, it really depicts the Big Dipper and North Star that you can use to determine the season and all:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

A useful symbol, not the least bit hateful (it has been also said that this constellation 'spins in place' in the north pole area, so it hints to 'hollow Earth' and stuff, but I am not quite on board with that explanation yet, but I don't deny it, either).

Now, if this was all there is, things would be fine. Historically, it's a good symbol of life, prosperity, strength, and all that good stuff. Then some a-holes come and rip it off and they should've been sued for copyright, but there you go.

You'd think once that ridiculous hate group died, things would've returned to normal, and this symbol returned to its rightful place, like in some saturday morning cartoon, where everything resets at the end and next episode is like last episode never happened. People would see it again for what it is - a peaceful, harmonious, spiritual symbol that can even be useful.

But no, people had to start being idiots again, and raise all kinds of hell for innocent symbol, because they're weak, hysteric, fear-manipulated children instead of strong adults that make up their own mind as to what to think and how to react. Knee-jerk reaction is all too common.

I mean, it's just a few lines on a paper, why do people give it such power and become so hysterical about it? Think if another planet where there'd be a completely different symbol you've never seen before, and then another version of it that's reversed. Then people would get in hysterics over one of them, and demand removal of the other as well because they mistake it for something it doesn't even depict.

How silly and childish would you think the inhabitants of that planet are? Yes, very. It's the same thing, but because it's emotionally charged with the biggest lie in this planet's history (and anyone that calmly researches the FACTS will realize this - no need for agendas or interviews, no need for lectures or emotional charging up - just check the details of the story, then look at those details against physical laws and other facts and anyone can see how the lie crumbles to pieces. But people rather emote and go to hysterics than research, so never mind)..

So these hysterical and culturally ignorant people (same people rave about 'cultural appropriation', though, but they just GIVE this symbol to nazis without question?) see 'the dreaded swastika' on a Japanese map and vomit inside their brains while screaming at the taxi driver about how horrible, evil racists japanese people are, and I can walk from here.

The worst part is not that these people are childish, hysterical, ignorant of the history of thousands upon thousands of years, but that someone in power actually listens to them, and not only that, cowtows to them.

So now we have Buddhists, Hindus and other monks and such that remove all signs of Manji, anything that even slightly resembles swastika, from every decoration and every ornament, just because someone says 'you can't do that in our country'. Do what? Use a thousands-of-years old, deeply culturally and spiritually entwined symbol in your temple or shrine that's dedicated to preserving that culture and spirituality? Do what? Use a drawing of a few lines, because someone might MISTAKE it for a nazi symbol?

Where's the freedom of speech and expression when you need it. Even the nazi symbol shouldn't be 'banned completely', because that is just an arbitrary, emotional knee-jerk reaction to a few lines, it's not a rational thing to do. Sure, those a-holes did horrible things (though not in as big a scale as people seem to think when it comes to things like 'work camps'), but that's no reason to still let them have so much power they can CONTROL people so much they're not even allowed to draw a few lines!

Can't we ever take anything back? I am reminded of the silly comedy, 'Clerks 2', where someone wants to take the term 'porch monkey' back.

a reply to: Shoujikina

I had never even heard of that term, so it is neutral to me, but some people seemed to find this 'offensive', or whatnot. Logically thinking, there's no reason for it, of course - why would calling someone a 'porch monkey' be anything other than silly and cute? Maybe a term can have 'historical connotations' (a lot like Manji, huh? But no one seems to ever point out that in THAT context), but can't we ever cut those ties and free ourselves to do and say whatever we want, like FREE PEOPLE should be able to do?

I guess people normally make a disclaimer around this point, about 'I don't support blahblah', but I am sick and tired of this kind of weakness. I shouldn't have to do that, if the reader is a rational adult that understands what's right and what's wrong in the world.

I think it's wrong to become hysterical over a few lines (or any symbol), no matter WHAT someone did in history, seriously.

The stupidest part, as I mentioned, is that Japanese government LISTENED to some hysterical morons that do not understand the cultural signifigance of Manji, and started removing them from maps. If you look japanese maps, even in google maps (at least awhile ago), you can see the dreaded 'swastika' symbol all over the place, because it signifies a 'Jinja', which means a 'Shrine'.

This has been done for around a hundred years, if not more - I forget when it was, maybe during the Meiji restoration?

In any case, only because some westerners don't understand that a) it's not the nazi symbol and b) even if it was, so what, it's just a few lines and c) it signifies a temple and d) it has way longer history and deeper meaning than that stupid nazi thing and e) can't we ever forget that crap and start living our lives nazi-free?, just because some weak child-minded emotional ragers can't understand japanese culture, history, or spirituality, the japanese goverment cow-tows and supplicates to these idiots.

If this keeps going, and every government always bows to this kind of people, we soon have no freedoms left, the alphabet will be gone, all beauty will be gone, all artistic freedom and expression will be gone. What's humanity then?

I don't mind japanese government for trying to help foreigners by making easier-to-read maps for them and such, or maybe even changing that symbol for an easier-to-understand pagoda-like symbol for legibility. If I look at it ONLY from the 'confusion avoidance' or 'clarity' viewpoint.

Foreigners wouldn't automatically associate the Manji symbol with a shrine, so whatever, maybe it's a good change among many others (how many would associate X with a... what was it, a police box, for example?)

However, there's something spineless and stomach-wrenching about a government that goes along with misunderstanding and rewards bad behaviour this way. "Oh, you misunderstand our culture, SORRY, our bad! We'll change it for you!"

THAT is not how it should ever go. Culture, country, government should not change because some childish people can't understand history or endure reality. The government should educate those people on why they're wrong, and how this symbol is actually a GOOD symbol, not evil one, no matter what someone with silly moustache ragingly did in history.

If only people had a calm, adult, rational and open-minded reactions instead of knee-jerk emotional hysterics when it comes to certain topics, but its like those topics are buttons that shut off their thinking and rational mind and turn their emotions to eleven, and try to explain how quantum physics has some impossible connotations to a raging toddler that won't eat their meal and they scream your ears out.

I watched some interesting videos, like the 'Japan changes tradition for foreigners':

www.youtube.com...

..and the Asian Boss's "What does this symbol mean to the japanese?" one:

www.youtube.com...

As much as it pisses me off that people of the west are culturally and historically ignorant, hysterical children that rage over a few lines and demand Japan changes its spiritual culture simply because these western ignoramuses can't understand anything, I was surprised to be pissed off about something completely different when watching that video.

Can you guess what that is?

I was actually pissed off about japanese government even more. They don't teach or educate western 'professional misunderstanders' about why and how they are wrong about the symbol, but they ALSO don't teach their own d*mn people about history.

It's quite shocking to see japanese people, seemingly intelligent, normal, rational people, be SO ignorant and downright OBLIVIOUS about what the 'nazis' even were. "Dare dakke, dare dakke..?", meaning 'Who were they again?' (loosely translated) can be heard in that video. People saying they didn't know that symbol had any meaning.

Japanese people actually thought it's just a symbol teenagers use, because 'maji' and 'manji' sound similar, so it became a 'maji manji' meme that everyone ends their sentences with.

How is this even possible? WHAT do they teach at schools? Not history, not english.. is kanji really that big an endeavour to learn that NOTHING ELSE fits in people's heads? Come on, this is ridiculous. Japanese people are not taught english properly (their english teaching system is atrocious), so japanese people don't have confidence when it comes to using english (they don't even practice conversations!).

But history, too? What is japanese government doing when it comes to schools, teaching and education? It's like they're too busy making sure people that are born with brown hair have to DYE their hair black to 'fit in', or they'll be expelled from school (if anyone else thinks this is completely unfair, inappropriate and downright ridiculous, you're not alone). But teaching actual history? Well, that's not as important as teaching people to be 100% conformists.

I realize it's a small country with lots of people, so it gets crowded a lot, and it's better to learn to get along and be predictable in that kind of situation than be individual and unpredictable, which can be dangerous, but this is ridiculous.

The things we consider 'basic history' is not being taught, or at least not being taught effectively. I can only imagine the shock of german people that see that symbol everywhere in Japan and then learn that the japanese people don't even know who the nazis were.

How can they be so ignorant? How can they not be taught this? Japan was even ally of the nazis, is this why? Is the japanese government trying to do an Orwellian 'history erase' that's only going to bite them in the buttocks sooner or later? UN-believable!

So western people are ridiculously ignorant about Asian cultures and history, but Japanese people are JUST as ignorant about the nazis and the recent history of this symbol in Europe! How can this one symbol gather around SO MUCH IGNORANCE on every side?!

People should be educated and taught about recent history, ancient history, other cultures, and ALL the meanings of all these symbols, and then people should relax, understand each other and let everyone use whatever and get along and move on and live their lives and help each other instead of accusing each other of this or that hate crime or whatnot, based purely on a few lines, and just let live!

Hysterics - Ignorance - Uneducation - Childishness

You have just described the young folks of today .

I agree that the confusion of these two symbols is mainly from ignorance. What I would like to know is how the marking for Hitlers third panzer division, from 1941 to 1945, became the symdol most people recognize as peace? This link goes into the multiple meanings and origin of the ‘Peace’ sign.

It seems the Nazis messed up a lot of symbols.

Movies do the same thing. In most movies depecting an ancient Roman Gladiator fight, it ends in thumbs up or down. The problem is most depect this as up meaning let them live. In actuality thumbs up meant finish them off. Thumbs down meant let them live.

Symbols only have the meaning and power people give them.

a reply to: Shoujikina

You have to remember that 99% of people are idiots.

Isn't it interesting how there are movements to "take back" certain things like the n-word which is used heavily by the very people it used to be a slur for, and no one else can touch it, not even to reference it in a quote or in a context that has nothing to do with slurring anyone for any reason. It is said to be taking something back or empowering this way.

It's like young women dressing up in scanty clothing and holding slut walks. They are taking something back and empowering themselves.

But there is no movement to "take back" that symbol or claim that it empowers anyone to use it. Perhaps it's because the world recognizes that true evil appropriated that symbol for its use?