China lands on Mars

www.bbc.co.uk...

China has successfully landed a spacecraft on Mars, state media announced early on Saturday.

The six-wheeled Zhurong robot was targeting Utopia Planitia, a vast terrain in the planet's northern hemisphere.

The vehicle used a combination of a protective capsule, a parachute and a rocket platform to make the descent.

After spending some time in orbit photographing potential landing sites, China finally bit the bullet and landed its rover on Mars.

The fact that they were doing it was well-flagged, largelt thanks to enthusiastic followers of China's missions detecting changes in the radio signals coming back from the orbiter, like this:

twitter.com...

We now have craft from the USA, India, UAE and China in orbit, and the USA and China on the surface.

a reply to: OneBigMonkeyToo

Does China use the DSN?

a reply to: OneBigMonkeyToo

Good for them ! Maybe with all the angst that China has generated around the world another space race will go into high gear ! Velcro for everyone !! (sarc)

I really do hope there is some kind propulsion break through this time around.

Maybe it's just where we are technology-wise, but with all the interest in Mars there has to be something financial at stake it's not all scientific curiosity and ego.

If there is money to be made I could see both Lunar and Mars bases with 25 years.

www.spacesafetymagazine.com...

The Moon—“Persian Gulf” of the Solar System
Professor Ouyang Ziyuan, the chief scientist of the Chinese Lunar Exploration Program (CLEP), has said that the Moon is so rich in He-3, that this could “solve humanity’s energy demand for around 10,000 years at least.

China is now leading the world into an industrial and scientific revolution, the sheer scale of which will of necessity soon require an entirely new form of energy, never before mastered on Earth: controlled thermonuclear fusion power, using helium-3 (He-3) as its fuel. The He-3 isotope is extremely rare on Earth, but exists in abundance on the Moon, and the Chinese leadership has already begun an ambitious program to acquire it. About three-fourths of China’s energy is now produced by coal-fired power plants, but a typical coal train of more than a kilometre long, carrying 5,000 tonnes of coal, would be replaced by just 40 grams of He-3, dramatically reducing transportation costs. Just eight tonnes of He-3 in fusion reactors would provide the equivalent energy of one billion tonnes of coal, burned in power stations. China’s plan to bring back He-3 from the Moon will benefit not only the Chinese, but all mankind, just as any scientific breakthrough anywhere in the world has always done. Moreover, China is not alone in needing huge new supplies of energy. Human civilisation now and in the foreseeable future already requires orders of magnitude more energy, while per capita energy consumption must also rise dramatically, if we are to eliminate poverty and transform industry, agriculture, transport and water management everywhere.

a reply to: putnam6

The "abundance" of 3He on the Moon is theoretical as yet, and would require massive mining operations (in situ) to exploit even if it is as abundant as theorized.

Bringing 3He back from the Moon won't do much good until there are fusion reactors which can use it. We can't even produce energy by fusing hydrogen yet. Any such investment would be very long term, indeed. With no near term returns on that investment.

originally posted by: 727Sky
a reply to: OneBigMonkeyToo

Good for them ! Maybe with all the angst that China has generated around the world another space race will go into high gear ! Velcro for everyone !! (sarc)

I really do hope there is some kind propulsion break through this time around.

China lands on Mars and now Perseverance has caught COVID.

Seriously though as far propulsion goes, Id think nuclear fits once they get in orbit, but launching it up there on huge rockets just doesn't seem safe. But more than likely it will need redundant and different propulsion systems nuclear and solar winds. Eight now we are severely limited by rocket fuel propulsion only.

This means an orbital space dock or platform we launch spacecraft parts and or modules to the space dock to be put together, readied for travel to the moon or beyond.

a reply to: putnam6

Nuclear, how? You mean pooping small nukes and using the blast for thrust (the old Orion concept)? Bumpy ride.

Or are you thinking a nuclear powered ion drive? Getting electricity directly from nuclear energy is pretty far down the road. But ion drives are slow, and sunlight provides enough power for that. At least in the inner Solar System.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

The "abundance" of 3He on the Moon is theoretical as yet, and would require massive mining operations (in situ) to exploit even if it is as abundant as theorized.

Bringing 3He back from the Moon won't do much good until there are fusion reactors which can use it. We can't even produce energy by fusing hydrogen yet. Any such investment would be very long term, indeed. With no near term returns on that investment.

Of course, it's theoretical this is the first step to discoveries we likely can't fathom yet, but Ponce Deleon didn't build condos and beach resorts in Florida the week of his first trip either.

Still, the conspiracy theorist in me says the is more to all the interest in space the Moon and Mars. It's not just about learning if Mars had ancient life

a reply to: putnam6

but Ponce Deleon didn't build condos and beach resorts in Florida the week of his first trip either.

But he was definitely working for the good of mankind. Too bad he never found that fountain.

Probably won't be any beach resorts on the Moon. I reckon.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

Nuclear, how? You mean pooping small nukes and using the blast for thrust (the old Orion concept)? Bumpy ride.

Or are you thinking a nuclear powered ion drive? Getting electricity directly from nuclear energy is pretty far down the road. But ion drives are slow, and sunlight provides enough power for that. At least in the inner Solar System.

Just spitballing here though I have heard of that concept. We have been using nuclear propulsion since the '60s and '70s in subs and aircraft carriers, its space-saving and long supply life make it a candidate but there is a myriad of possible future systems.

a reply to: OneBigMonkeyToo

Congratulations China , looks like all those NASA hacks paid off , standing on the shoulders of giants.

a reply to: putnam6

We have been using nuclear propulsion since the '60s and '70s in subs and aircraft carriers

Not exactly nuclear propulsion. Steam power, actually.

The reactors boil water. That's the extent of the tech. Not really applicable to space travel.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

but Ponce Deleon didn't build condos and beach resorts in Florida the week of his first trip either.

But he was definitely working for the good of mankind. Too bad he never found that fountain.

Probably won't be any beach resorts on the Moon. I reckon.

If they can do this in 9 years imagine in another 25 or 30. Though I have heard the moon sand is extremely abrasive so it would be hell on beach balls and floats

www.mirror.co.uk...

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

We have been using nuclear propulsion since the '60s and '70s in subs and aircraft carriers

Not exactly nuclear propulsion. Steam power, actually.

The reactors boil water. That's the extent of the tech. Not really applicable to space travel.

NASA seems to think otherwise at least as recently as 2018

I saying it's been used for 50 plus years relatively safely , everything else is purely at a conceptual stage.

www.nasa.gov...

Today’s advances in materials, testing capabilities, and reactor development are providing impetus for NASA to appraise Nuclear Thermal Propulsion (NTP) as an attractive 21st century option to propel human exploration missions to Mars and other deep space destinations.

Utilizing nuclear technology as an ingredient of NASA’s exploration prowess is not new. NTP research is part of the space agency’s storied history. In 1961, NASA and the former Atomic Energy Commission jointly embarked on the Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application (NERVA) program – an effort that over several years led to the design, building, and testing of reactors and rocket

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

Nuclear, how? You mean pooping small nukes and using the blast for thrust (the old Orion concept)? Bumpy ride.

Or are you thinking a nuclear powered ion drive? Getting electricity directly from nuclear energy is pretty far down the road. But ion drives are slow, and sunlight provides enough power for that. At least in the inner Solar System.

Nuclear thermal propulsion such as the Nerva NRX-A6 which stands for "Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Propulsion" and achieved an SI of 869 seconds back in the 60s..the best chemical rockets can do is around 400 in space) The NERVA program was successful but was cancelled by Nixon due to budgetary constraints.

The USA, China, and Russia are all working on nuclear propulsion for space flight. Who gets that right will be the one to open the solar system for exploration.

a reply to: putnam6

I remember 1961. Barely.
You'd think that it would be in use by now. But it's still in the conceptual stage. Feasibility studies.

We'll see what happens. My bet is on an Epstein drive.

If they can do this in 9 years

Don't hold your breath.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: putnam6

I remember 1961. Barely.
You'd think that it would be in use by now. But it's still in the conceptual stage. Feasibility studies.

We'll see what happens. My bet is on an Epstein drive.

NASA seems to think otherwise at least as recently as 2018

I saying it's been used for 50 plus years relatively safely , everything else is purely at a conceptual stage.

www.nasa.gov...

Today’s advances in materials, testing capabilities, and reactor development are providing impetus for NASA to appraise Nuclear Thermal Propulsion (NTP) as an attractive 21st century option to propel human exploration missions to Mars and other deep space destinations.

Utilizing nuclear technology as an ingredient of NASA’s exploration prowess is not new. NTP research is part of the space agency’s storied history. In 1961, NASA and the former Atomic Energy Commission jointly embarked on the Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application (NERVA) program – an effort that over several years led to the design, building, and testing of reactors and rocket

a reply to: putnam6

Wow, pictures and everything.
And yet, after 50 years, it isn't being used for space travel.

a reply to: putnam6

Looking into the future, Mitchell as the NTP project manager would like to see us explore large portions of the solar system by century’s end. “And that’s where we have to open up a new technology,” he says, and the potential capability of NTP is game changing for space exploration.

Houts emphasized that there is an expanding list of applications for NTP to help enable detailed exploration of the solar system, including wide-ranging development and use of cislunar space. An NTP reactor could be used in blueprinting robust human exploration missions to Mars and beyond in the future.

I like the sound of that. The problem with tech like this is that most, or none of us will be around to see it fully realised, and those who are around won't be anywhere near as excited to see it come to fruition as we would be.

Like mobile phones, kids take them for granted, but I remember as a kid wondering when I would be able to carry a computer around in my pocket.

As for china landing on mars, unless things on earth change drastically, things way out there won't be much different. The tv show For All Mankind, come to mind.. just replace china with russia.

Have Chinese government in your land is always a bad thing, no matter which planet you are.

For that reason, we might see strange things happening on Mars surface in the next days. Triggered locals showing discomfort will be the final evidence to confirm life in Mars.

Thanks China.