Scientists Achieve Real-Time Communication With Lucid Dreamers in Breakthrough

Here's a study where Scientist communicated with Lucid Dreamers and got correct answers while they were in the midst of a Lucid Dream.

An international team of researchers was able to achieve real-time dialogues with people in the midst of lucid dreams, a phenomenon that is called “interactive dreaming,” according to a study published on Thursday in Current Biology.

www.vice.com...

Imagine a tech that doesn't need Virtual Reality goggles but can create immersive experiences while you're in a Lucid Dream state. I have had Lucid Dreams and if there's a way to control the background of the Lucid Dreamer and have in Ancient Egypt in one dream, then a music star on tour in another.

There's always a dangerous side, because you could lock someone away in their dream and they couldn't wake up. All Lucid Dreams aren't the same either. I have had one where I thought I was awake in the dram but I wasn't sure.

Participants in the study were able to correctly respond to questions, such as simple math problems, while they were deep in the throes of rapid-eye movement (REM) sleep. The research reveals a “relatively unexplored communication channel” that could enable “a new strategy for the empirical exploration of dreams,” the study reports.

“There are studies of lucid dreamers communicating out of dreams, and also remembering to do tasks,” said Karen Konkoly, a PhD student at Northwestern University and first author of the paper, in a call. “But there's a fairly limited amount of research on the stimuli going into lucid dreams.”

“One thing that surprised us is that you could just say a sentence to somebody, and they could understand it just as it actually is,” she added.

www.vice.com...



Hopefully this is huge news but I wouldn't hold my breathe. I remember debating pseudoskeptics on this forum about Lucid Dreams. Some people who adhere to the religion of scientific materialism may not like talking about Lucid Dreams in a scientific way.

What's next? Out of Body Experiences? I had those too. I remember walking around an apartment I used to live in outside of my body. I watched myself sleeping in the bed.

These eye signals, along with facial contortions, were used as a means of communication during the sleep sessions. For instance, the researchers asked an 19-year-old American participant to subtract six from eight while he was in a lucid dream, and he correctly signaled the answer “two” with two eye movements from left to right. When asked again, he repeated the correct answer.

Roughly 18 percent of the trials resulted in this level of clear and accurate communication from the dreamer; 17 percent produced indecipherable answers, 3 percent ended with incorrect responses, and 60 percent did not provoke any response at all.

“It's amazing to sit in the lab and ask a bunch of questions, and then somebody might actually answer one,” Konkoly said. “It's such an immediately rewarding type of experiment to do. You don't have to wait to analyze your data or anything like that. You can see it right there while they're still sleeping.”

What’s more, many participants were able to recall the interactions with the researchers after they woke up, with individuals reporting that the prompts sounded like a voiceover narrator or a radio speaker that was clearly coming from outside of their dream.

www.vice.com...



What people call paranormal is just evidence that doesn't fit their materialist paradigm. Here's a few threads I started with overwhelming evidence for so called "Paranormal" studies.

The evidence for remote viewing is OVERWHELMING
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Psychic Detectives are real vs. celebrity psychics who are cold readers
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Science has provided evidence of the non physical universe
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The Reality of Psi: Leading Journal Publishes Paper Revealing the Evidence
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Yale Psychiatrist show that Psychic Abilities exist
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Yes! I was hoping an ATSer more adept then myself (no stretch here) would post exactly this!

Just in another recent post I posited that “lucid dreaming” exemplifies and expounds upon our “thoughts being things”.

In fact many cultures before our primitively narcissistic technologically materialistic “world” was diluted, actually practiced lucid dreaming for a variety of reasons.

Both practical and otherwise.

Thank You OP, much appreciation. THIS is ATS!

It's almost an extension of when you're asleep and either the TV is on or somebody says something in the background and it then becomes incorporated into your dream. I used to experience more lucid dreams but lately I've been struggling with waking up once I realize the experience is a dream. As to how meaningful this research is or will be, who can really say. It's been known for a while that your mind still processes external stimuli while asleep.

originally posted by: neoholographic
Here's a study where Scientist communicated with Lucid Dreamers and got correct answers while they were in the midst of a Lucid Dream.

An international team of researchers was able to achieve real-time dialogues with people in the midst of lucid dreams, a phenomenon that is called “interactive dreaming,” according to a study published on Thursday in Current Biology.

www.vice.com...

Imagine a tech that doesn't need Virtual Reality goggles but can create immersive experiences while you're in a Lucid Dream state. I have had Lucid Dreams and if there's a way to control the background of the Lucid Dreamer and have in Ancient Egypt in one dream, then a music star on tour in another.

There's always a dangerous side, because you could lock someone away in their dream and they couldn't wake up. All Lucid Dreams aren't the same either. I have had one where I thought I was awake in the dram but I wasn't sure.

Participants in the study were able to correctly respond to questions, such as simple math problems, while they were deep in the throes of rapid-eye movement (REM) sleep. The research reveals a “relatively unexplored communication channel” that could enable “a new strategy for the empirical exploration of dreams,” the study reports.

“There are studies of lucid dreamers communicating out of dreams, and also remembering to do tasks,” said Karen Konkoly, a PhD student at Northwestern University and first author of the paper, in a call. “But there's a fairly limited amount of research on the stimuli going into lucid dreams.”

“One thing that surprised us is that you could just say a sentence to somebody, and they could understand it just as it actually is,” she added.

www.vice.com...

Hopefully this is huge news but I wouldn't hold my breathe. I remember debating pseudoskeptics on this forum about Lucid Dreams. Some people who adhere to the religion of scientific materialism may not like talking about Lucid Dreams in a scientific way.

What's next? Out of Body Experiences? I had those too. I remember walking around an apartment I used to live in outside of my body. I watched myself sleeping in the bed.

These eye signals, along with facial contortions, were used as a means of communication during the sleep sessions. For instance, the researchers asked an 19-year-old American participant to subtract six from eight while he was in a lucid dream, and he correctly signaled the answer “two” with two eye movements from left to right. When asked again, he repeated the correct answer.

Roughly 18 percent of the trials resulted in this level of clear and accurate communication from the dreamer; 17 percent produced indecipherable answers, 3 percent ended with incorrect responses, and 60 percent did not provoke any response at all.

“It's amazing to sit in the lab and ask a bunch of questions, and then somebody might actually answer one,” Konkoly said. “It's such an immediately rewarding type of experiment to do. You don't have to wait to analyze your data or anything like that. You can see it right there while they're still sleeping.”

What’s more, many participants were able to recall the interactions with the researchers after they woke up, with individuals reporting that the prompts sounded like a voiceover narrator or a radio speaker that was clearly coming from outside of their dream.

www.vice.com...

What people call paranormal is just evidence that doesn't fit their materialist paradigm. Here's a few threads I started with overwhelming evidence for so called "Paranormal" studies.

Psychic Detectives are real vs. celebrity psychics who are cold readers
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Science has provided evidence of the non physical universe
www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Morbidlynx
Hmmm okay “known for awhile that your mind processes external stimuli”

Vs.

Answering researchers questions....

Not exactly thunder, or a dog wanting to be let outside

Kind of like Sword Art Online.

There is an Astr0 thread here on ATS that may be relevant to this...

assuming things are interconnected..

Have at it kids..

a reply to: neoholographic

I saw this yesterday, and I was surprised that anyone was surprised. I didn't think this was uncommon. I've done this my entire life. Never could keep a secret from my sister, because she'd just question me in my sleep. I walk and carry on conversations in my sleep too. I used to get up in the middle of the night and sit with my mom while she was painting, have conversations, then go back to bed and never remember a thing. I've done it with my husband too. (LOL! Heaven help me if I ever decided to have an affair!!!)

We all just think it's funny. We never thought there was anything significant about it.

a reply to: neoholographic

This to me is a wild advancement and may be the fore-runner of our being able to interact with others while in a lucid state which has been something I've wondered about for years.

Very interesting times were living in.


Johnny

a reply to: neoholographic

You're using Vice as a source. How about something with peer review?

Is known that some people can talk to you when they sleep 💤.

This is about scientists trying to harvest a new field. Dreams are meant to be personal, nobody is supposed to access to them unless you want to share.

Develop this technology and connect it to a computer, first step towards the matrix.

originally posted by: neoholographic
Hopefully this is huge news but I wouldn't hold my breathe. I remember debating pseudoskeptics on this forum about Lucid Dreams. Some people who adhere to the religion of scientific materialism may not like talking about Lucid Dreams in a scientific way.

I don't know why you say that. Lucid dreaming doesn't pose any conflict with scientific materialism, though some of the other threads you linked in your OP might if they weren't woo.

According to some research, half of people have had at least one lucid dream and 11% have had two or more. I'm part of the 50% who have had lucid dreams, but still they are rare for me with only about one per decade on average and even with so called "frequent" lucid dreamers they are still not common, making it a difficult, but not impossible, subject to research.

Is It a Good Idea to Cultivate Lucid Dreaming?

spontaneous LD is not frequent. About 50% of individuals have experienced at least one lucid dream in their lifetime, and only 11% report having two or more lucid dreams per month (Schredl and Erlacher, 2011; Saunders et al., 2016; Vallat et al., 2018)...

The experimental investigation of LD is challenging given the difficulty to get LD in the lab. Indeed, LD is rare and unpredictable even for frequent lucid dreamers, especially in an unfamiliar experimental setting.

originally posted by: AaarghZombies
a reply to: neoholographic

You're using Vice as a source. How about something with peer review?

The Vice article links to this article in Frontiers in Psychology, though I have no idea if it's peer-reviewed:

Real-time dialogue between experimenters and dreamers during REM sleep

The research could be valid, but it seems somewhat shaky. I would be interested in seeing replication experiments without as many issues as this study and if it's confirmed I'm fine with that, but so often research on the frontiers of psychology is not confirmed. Some things to note from the research:

The percentage of people researchers claimed to have communicated with seems rather small to me:

Across all teams, we observed a correct response on 18.4% of these trials; the independent experts unanimously scored the polysomnographic evidence as indicating REM sleep for 26 of these 29 trials. On a further 17.7% of the trials, expert raters did not agree on deciphering the response (and on 9 of those trials two raters thought there was no response). An incorrect response was produced on 3.2% of the trials. The most common outcome was a lack of a response (60.1% of the trials).

They asked the lucid dreamer a question like "what is 8 minus 6?" and the dreamer was supposed to make two particular eye movements to indicate the answer was two. But, the results are not based on unambiguous scoring, only 3 of 4 reviewers needed to think the two eye movements were observed and correct, if it was really that clear, why not make it 4 of 4? (because it's not that clear which is a common issue with psychology research):

Three additional raters, while blind to condition, rated the number of eye movements or muscle contractions after each two-way communication attempt. An experimenter was included as a fourth rater. The identity of each signal, or the absence of a signal, was determined based on consensus (at least three of the four raters). If there was no such consensus, the signal was counted as an ambiguous response.

So the research seems a bit less than entirely convincing to me for those reasons, but maybe future research can provide clear and less ambiguous criteria where we don't have to use such sloppy confirmation criteria as "3 of 4 people agree". If it was really clear research I don't see why 4 of 4 people couldn't agree on it.

This research also seems less than robust because adding or subtracting zero gives the same result, not much of a math problem:

we presented visual stimuli consisting of alternating colors and corresponding to a Morse-coded math problem “4 minus 0.” The participant produced the correct answer “4” using left-right eye movements (LRLRLRLR). In his description of the dream, he maintained that he heard the message “4 plus 0” and answered accordingly.

So they scored that a "correct" answer even though he answered a different question than the one they asked. Now if the researchers had asked for 4 minus two, and if the dreamer thought they said 4 plus 2, he would have given an answer of 6,
which would not be a correct answer if they were expecting an answer of 2.

Lucid dreams aren't paranormal, what gets into paranormal claims is incorrectly interpreting dreams like thinking people having "out-of-body" experiences are really leaving their body. I used to have such dreams of leaving my body and flying around, even when I was young. I thought maybe I was really leaving my body back then, and was even a little worried that I might not be able to find my way back to my body, but after reading a lot of research, now I don't think I actually ever left my body, it's just an illusion. I can do all kinds of other nonsensical things in dreams too that will never happen in the real world, like pour 16 liters of water in an 8 liter bucket, and have it all fit.

One thing I've hoped researchers could eventually do, is hook up some kind of machine up to the sleeping person's head that will allow researchers to view the dreaming person's dream on a monitor. I don't know if that will ever be possible or not; if so I think it's a long way off and it may never be possible, but if it ever becomes possible, that will really be really interesting.

originally posted by: JohnnyAnonymous
a reply to: neoholographic

This to me is a wild advancement and may be the fore-runner of our being able to interact with others while in a lucid state which has been something I've wondered about for years.

Very interesting times were living in.


Johnny

Read to the end...

What could be useful about interacting with people in a lucid state?

I suppose perhaps this could advance hypnotic therapy and regression? I don't think so but I'm sure there are some usefulness to this.

I have been lucid dreaming for about 15 years now. One morning I woke up and realized I had had a lucid dream. It was the best experience I had ever had while asleep and I definitely wanted more of that! At this time I was pretty good at meditation so I meditated on it and began lucid dreaming every single night from there on out. These days I don't pay much attention to it and so only have about 1-2 a week. Usually I fly around a lot.

Once I decided when I went to sleep that night that I would fly to the moon. That night I remembered my task and what happened next was very very strange. I don't have time at this moment to get into detail but if you respond to this post I'll tell you all about the moon flight and lots more about lucid dreaming and a few things about Astral projection later this afternoon.

a reply to: neoholographic

I can instantly see the dark and the narcissistic uses of such a technology and I fear that will always be one outcome of such including enhanced mind programming and brainwashing techniques.

Other outcomes may not be so dark, learn while you sleep, a superior version of virtual reality but of course both of these pose the danger of damaging the conscious mind, leaving a person unable to tell what is reality and causing insanity.

One potentially beneficial spin off may be the potential that from this research a spin off application may allow communication with people claimed to be in persistent vegetative states, often in the past doctors have declared such people brain dead but when on the very rare occasion someone has recovered sometimes after there family refused to have life support terminated they have born testimony to being aware but unable to move or communicate - or had out of body experiences of other realms which given the nano tubules that some now believe are a link to the quantum realm meaning the brain is quantum interface of sorts.
www.sciencedaily.com...

This opens up other possibility's.

The Danger that opening any door may be a two way system but also the possibility that we may be able to explore those realm's - which may not be a good thing since by nature that realm of quantum consciousness is very alien to our earthy existence, I am more intrigued by the possibility of in the future mapping the exact quantum micro layout of the human brain and perhaps allowing a consciousness SHIFT, not a duplication but an exact shift which would allow the consciousness to move from one body to the duplicate body which in terms of terminal disease would be beautiful BUT there remains the possibility no probability that the soul if we may call the quantum consciousness that is actually CREATED at the body, yes some may think and believe in reincarnation but I personally believe that may be a form of parasite rather than symbiotic interaction so such a unpopulated copy may actually generate it's own soul or have a very short time before something tried to force it's way in and such would make such a transfer a very time limited function, perhaps having the soul in two body's simultaneously and a more gradual soul transfer of the living soul being the only way for that to work.

The danger then is that we are keeping the soul in it's embryonic, body, state, what damage could that cause by suppressing the natural life cycle of a quantum entity?.

IIt's a lucid freaking dream, I've had them often my entire life. They're nothing special, just a dream state. Whoopie doo.

Cool breakthrough on the researchers' parts, though. My younger brother is a sleepwalker, always has been. I guess I should consider his ordering Mickey D's happy meals to my bedroom door when we were kids & me fake-ringing him up to get him back to bed loosely related.

a reply to: Nyiah

That is one definite potential beneficial spin on the technology, learning to control peoples sleep walking which as you know is thought to be the result of the part of the brain that shuts down our ability to move while asleep not working properly for some reason, it can also in some people lead to there suffering sleep paralysis episodes which occurs when they are partially awake but there body is still in the lucid dream state with the conscious part of the brain detached from motor control, this is the opposite of sleep paralysis and for many a far more terrifying prospect.

A dark side use of it though could be to use it to turn people into literal sleeper agent's and all the nefarious potential of such an application, especially if as JohnnyAnymous suggests a kind of potential communication method, that sounds cool an alternative for the internet and virtual presence were people could cooperate around the world in a dream space BUT it also posits all the negative potential of such a communication system, control, remote orders etc.

a reply to: AaarghZombies
There is a link in Vice's article.

Very interesting. Thanks for posting OP.

I wonder what the possibilities for this will be?
Ive had trouble maintaining a long lucid state as if i get too excited i wake up.

originally posted by: AaarghZombies
a reply to: neoholographic

You're using Vice as a source. How about something with peer review?

The study is linked in the article.

It was really hard to find. I wrote a series of algorithms that narrowed down where they linked the source and then used that information to manually scan for the hidden link. It was an exhausting process that took hours, but I finally found it buried deep within the third sentence.

Obviously they were trying to hide it from all but the most dedicated truth-seekers.

a reply to: neoholographic

It’s this the same Idea the the CIA had with '___' and MK-Ultra.

How do you get someone into Lucid dream state?

originally posted by: slatesteam
Yes! I was hoping an ATSer more adept then myself (no stretch here) would post exactly this!

Just in another recent post I posited that “lucid dreaming” exemplifies and expounds upon our “thoughts being things”.

In fact many cultures before our primitively narcissistic technologically materialistic “world” was diluted, actually practiced lucid dreaming for a variety of reasons.

Both practical and otherwise.

Thank You OP, much appreciation. THIS is ATS!

Thanks and I agree.

Sadly, scientific materialism has become a religion for some.

originally posted by: AaarghZombies
a reply to: neoholographic

You're using Vice as a source. How about something with peer review?

Really?? Did you even bother to read the article before posting? They link to the peer reviewed paper in Current Biology.

Current Biology