Polish Justice Minister announces online freedom of speech bill

An interesting development from Poland. Their Justice Minister has brought forward a new bill called the law on freedom of expressing one's own views and searching and disseminating information on the internet. which blocks social media from removing content that doesn't violate Polish law and would allow users to file a complaint within 48 hours of any such content that'a removed.

I guess essentially turning the Polish internet into 8chan.

It would seem to be a pushback against everything that's been happening lately.

Personally, I don't really agree with this about as much as I disagree with the rampant censorship. I think this goes too far in the other direction though.

polandin.com...

Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro announced a legal initiative on Thursday aimed at enabling internet users to file complaints against the removal of online posts as well as the creation of a special court for freedom of speech.

Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro said the aim of the bill was to give internet users the feeling that their rights are protected and that their posts cannot be arbitrarily removed from online platforms.

Under its provisions, social media services will not be allowed to remove content or block accounts if the content on them does not break Polish law. In the event of removal or blockage, a complaint can be sent to the platform, which will have 24 hours to consider it. Within 48 hours of the decision, the user will be able to file a petition to the court for the return of access. The court will consider complaints within seven days of receipt and the entire process is to be electronic.

I think there needs to be some kind of middle ground. I'm not sure how any kind of line can be drawn, but treating facebook, twitter, the big society altering players that have become the new defacto public space the same as small website communities with the same kinds of laws around moderation, censorship or whatever is not reasonable.

Yet any kind of significant changes to laws the way they've been proposed will have a big impact on smaller platforms.

I don't think Poland's solution is going to work in the long run, I don't think the way things are working now is sustainable for society and none of the solutions i've seen proposed really seem like the answer.

a reply to: dug88

I don't like Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and the rest of that ilk. My solution is that I don't use them.

I have been around the WEB since the mid to late 80's, long before My Space and Facebook, before America On Line for that matter. The world will not come to an end if people just stop using social media.

They still have the post office and cell phones. 😊

a reply to: dug88

Like I've been telling our resident Big Tech cheerleaders who think this is all wonderful, when you are making other heads of state nervous because it's sinking in that if these places can completely erase the online presence of the president of the US, the who can't they erase? They ought to pause and think.

These companies can erase heads of state if they so choose with no repercussions. That should make anyone nervous.

And I think people who actually think are starting to realize this is not a good thing what's been going on. Certainly the European leaders and teh ACLU are starting to get it, even if our resident lefties are still a bit thick.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dug88

Like I've been telling our resident Big Tech cheerleaders who think this is all wonderful, when you are making other heads of state nervous because it's sinking in that if these places can completely erase the online presence of the president of the US, the who can't they erase? They ought to pause and think.

These companies can erase heads of state if they so choose with no repercussions. That should make anyone nervous.

And I think people who actually think are starting to realize this is not a good thing what's been going on. Certainly the European leaders and teh ACLU are starting to get it, even if our resident lefties are still a bit thick.

No fan of Angela Merkle and we know she is no fan of Trump

Angela Merkel Calls Trump Twitter Ban Problematic as Freedom of Opinion Is Fundamental Right

Sometimes it takes persons outside the fray to make good points

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dug88

Like I've been telling our resident Big Tech cheerleaders who think this is all wonderful, when you are making other heads of state nervous because it's sinking in that if these places can completely erase the online presence of the president of the US, the who can't they erase? They ought to pause and think.

These companies can erase heads of state if they so choose with no repercussions. That should make anyone nervous.

And I think people who actually think are starting to realize this is not a good thing what's been going on. Certainly the European leaders and teh ACLU are starting to get it, even if our resident lefties are still a bit thick.

Well said.

a reply to: putnam6

Well if a leader of any country knows how this plays out, she might. The thing about what she meant by “problematic” is curious as it’s difficult without context

I wish she’d taken a stronger, more decisive stance.

I suppose speaking up at all is reason someone, somewhere is probably demonizing her online at this very moment and getting likes for it. Hopefully not $...

One might say deciphering her intentions here might be -

“Problematic”

originally posted by: dug88
An interesting development from Poland. Their Justice Minister has brought forward a new bill called the law on freedom of expressing one's own views and searching and disseminating information on the internet. which blocks social media from removing content that doesn't violate Polish law and would allow users to file a complaint within 48 hours of any such content that'a removed.

I guess essentially turning the Polish internet into 8chan.

It would seem to be a pushback against everything that's been happening lately.

Personally, I don't really agree with this about as much as I disagree with the rampant censorship. I think this goes too far in the other direction though.

polandin.com...

Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro announced a legal initiative on Thursday aimed at enabling internet users to file complaints against the removal of online posts as well as the creation of a special court for freedom of speech.

Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro said the aim of the bill was to give internet users the feeling that their rights are protected and that their posts cannot be arbitrarily removed from online platforms.

Under its provisions, social media services will not be allowed to remove content or block accounts if the content on them does not break Polish law. In the event of removal or blockage, a complaint can be sent to the platform, which will have 24 hours to consider it. Within 48 hours of the decision, the user will be able to file a petition to the court for the return of access. The court will consider complaints within seven days of receipt and the entire process is to be electronic.

I think there needs to be some kind of middle ground. I'm not sure how any kind of line can be drawn, but treating facebook, twitter, the big society altering players that have become the new defacto public space the same as small website communities with the same kinds of laws around moderation, censorship or whatever is not reasonable.

Yet any kind of significant changes to laws the way they've been proposed will have a big impact on smaller platforms.

I don't think Poland's solution is going to work in the long run, I don't think the way things are working now is sustainable for society and none of the solutions i've seen proposed really seem like the answer.

You either have freedom of speech or you endorse some form of censorship. Personally I’d prefer freedom. Yes there are crazy people in this world, there always have been, but the majority and sensible and should not be shackled by the tiny minority.

Wasn’t it Saint Obama who suggested ‘more talking’? Or was that only talking in the politically correct and sanitised sense?

a reply to: ARM1968

Yes, i prefer freedom of speech, but this polish bill goes a step too far and forces websites to essentially be forced to promote whatever speech any user wants as long as it's legal, thereby violating the website owner's right to free speech.

This whole thing is a tricky balance i feel can't be solved while treating the big players equally to the small ones. The stakes aren't the same, the influence isn't the same and the resources aren't the same.

This law, much like america's section 230 and the alternatives by just straight repealing it aims to treat any social media network the same as any other. Anyone with half a brain can see this is ludicrous. Some clearly have more influence over the public sphere and should be treated as such.

There are tons of legalities and miles of red tape for every business. If I want to start a business (of any kind) I have to follow a bunch restrictive laws, why shouldn't the big players follow the same rules too? If there are too many regulations and laws that bog down a business, it's time to find something else or move to a different area with less laws.

Of course now a days a business runs the risk of getting shut down by activist law makers, judges and groups (both private and public) that want you gone because of the popular socialist coup and their crusade to destroy conservative values and to change history. They will purge and cleanse you out of business if you have conservative policies that support the wrong people and ideas.

I suggest that in order to operate a business in today's political environment, it must be corrupt, pay off the right people and join the proper organizations. They are leading us straight into a Banana Republic, third world business model where bribes, kick backs and favors are the basis of any successful business endeavor. An honest business that follows the rules and plays it straight will be marginalized if not blacklisted and made a target for "peaceful" protests by the "woke" enlightened ones.

originally posted by: MichiganSwampBuck
There are tons of legalities and miles of red tape for every business. If I want to start a business (of any kind) I have to follow a bunch restrictive laws, why shouldn't the big players follow the same rules too? If there are too many regulations and laws that bog down a business, it's time to find something else or move to a different area with less laws.

Of course now a days a business runs the risk of getting shut down by activist law makers, judges and groups (both private and public) that want you gone because of the popular socialist coup and their crusade to destroy conservative values and to change history. They will purge and cleanse you out of business if you have conservative policies that support the wrong people and ideas.

I suggest that in order to operate a business in today's political environment, it must be corrupt, pay off the right people and join the proper organizations. They are leading us straight into a Banana Republic, third world business model where bribes, kick backs and favors are the basis of any successful business endeavor. An honest business that follows the rules and plays it straight will be marginalized if not blacklisted and made a target for "peaceful" protests by the "woke" enlightened ones.

That IS how it works already I though.

a reply to: slatesteam

It's because they really, really don't like Trump and populism in general. The ACLU had the same trouble. They can't defend him and conservatives, but they realize they have to speak up because at its base, what's happening is wrong and they know it.

So they're trying to find ways to say it's wrong without defending people they hate. If we weren't in such dangerous times, and the issue weren't so deadly serious, it would be truly amusing to watch.

a reply to: dug88
Hats off to Poland! Their move is as much about sovereignty as freedom of speech. Good to see a nation state stand up to the corporatocracy that has shown contempt for both sovereignty and democracy. It is right that no extranational entity should be able to impose any stricture not in keeping with national or sovereign laws or value systems.