Can you really say Evolution has no Meaning ?

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain

Have you ever heard of the term selection? You know, the circumstances that lead to determine what mutations would be useful and therefor benefiting survival or spread into the gene pool of certain individum.

According to the theory they are selecting randomly mutated genes. But when genes are selected for evolutionists assume it was randomly mutated. But very often they are adaptation variables already present in organisms. Like in antibiotic resistance the microbe is, in one example, turning up expression of a detoxification pump to allow higher antibiotic load.

It's not mutating anything, it is a predisposed potential within the genome. This is antithetical to evolution because there is no mechanism for how random mutation would be able to generate such detailed modulation.

Phantom doesn't understand what I'm saying though. Or at least she responds and avoids my point. The difficulty for evolution to accommodate observable microbiology is the interdependence of mostly all enzymes, co-factors, etc. Since these are interdependent, meaning they rely on eachother, they could not have come to be in a piece-by-piece evolutionary manner. Darwin himself saw this potential Achilles heel from the beginning.

This is one of the many, many reasons why evolution does not make sense anymore. The interdependence is present on every scale of an organism too. Molecules are interdependent, proteins, DNA, organelles, cells, tissues, and organs - they all are communicating and depend on other aspects of the organism to ensure proper fubctionability.

What came first, complex I, I, III, or IV of the electron transport chain? Because the electron transport chain doesn't work unless they're all present. These aren't rinky-dink proteins either, atp synthase (complex IV) resembles a turbine that generates energy similar to a hydrogen fuel cell. It is phenomenal engineering.

Natural selection of randomly mutated genes cannot create something so wonderfully interdependent.

You will see by phantom's lame response (often appealing to semantics, or appealing to authority) because she either doesn't know what im talking about, or secretly knows she's wrong but her dogma and pride won't allow her to concede. So she distracts and insults to avoid admitting evolution of interdependent parts is not possible

Okay, so show the class exactly where god exists in the mechanics you described. We want to see some kind of signature indicating an intelligent presence bestowed their genius engineering skills on our genome. Like one of those cute cartoons that manufacturers draw on tiny computer chips to let you know who is responsible for such amazing technology.

originally posted by: TzarChasm
We want to see some kind of signature indicating an intelligent presence bestowed their genius engineering skills on our genome.

3.2billion nucleotides sequenced to form the a majority of our endogenous macromolecular machinery isn't enough for you? Do you know that it can also self-replicate and self-regulate? What would suffice for you as evidence? Perhaps if someone rose from the dead in the name of God?

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: TzarChasm
We want to see some kind of signature indicating an intelligent presence bestowed their genius engineering skills on our genome.

3.2billion nucleotides sequenced to form the a majority of our endogenous macromolecular machinery isn't enough for you? Do you know that it can also self-replicate and self-regulate? What would suffice for you as evidence? Perhaps if someone rose from the dead in the name of God?

This god creature manifesting in a very physical and interactive manner not unlike Morgan Freeman but on a much more global scale. Maybe a 60 minutes interview, some cheek swabbing, a fund raising campaign while he hangs out and engages with followers the way YouTube celebrities do. Curing covid-19 would be a fantastic bonus.

originally posted by: TzarChasm


This god creature manifesting in a very physical and interactive manner not unlike Morgan Freeman but on a much more global scale. Maybe a 60 minutes interview

There's an entire book written on it. Way more than a 60-minute interview.

, some cheek swabbing,

Shroud of Turin, or the countless other miracles that have occurred in His name.

a fund raising campaign while he hangs out and engages with followers the way YouTube celebrities do. Curing covid-19 would be a fantastic bonus.

Charity is a fundamental part of the Christian philosophy. Churches all around the world continue to donate funds to those in need.


The problem with you is you're treating God like your doG... you're thinking of Him backwards, and want him to do tricks for you on demand.

a reply to: cooperton

There's an entire book written on it. Way more than a 60-minute interview.

The Lord of the Rings trilogy was better. And so was the Bruce Almighty movie. Give us something new and incredible that matches the pace of modern technology.

Shroud of Turin, or the countless other miracles that have occurred in His name.

You mean the fake shroud? And what other miracles are happening today that can be tested in a clinical environment to identify spiritual properties actively affecting the physics of our world?

The problem with you is you're treating God like your doG... you're thinking of Him backwards, and want him to do tricks for you on demand

Let's ask Job what he thinks about people being treated like circus animals for someone's amusement.

A leader, a king, a savior serves his people. Not the other way around. A real god would have put himself on the cross instead of impregnating a human woman without her consent and forcing the child to sacrifice himself. I don't see any charity in such barbaric rituals. As far as the narrative has indicated, Jesus died for his father's sins, not ours.

My request remains unanswered. Want to try again? 👇

Okay, so show the class exactly where god exists in the mechanics you described. We want to see some kind of signature indicating an intelligent presence bestowed their genius engineering skills on our genome.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Lol why do I argue with people who think their ancestors were mutants

originally posted by: cooperton
a reply to: TzarChasm

Lol why do I argue with people who think their ancestors were mutants

Because if you left the arguing up to god, his absence would speak for itself.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

Because if you left the arguing up to god, his absence would speak for itself.

Who do you think you've been arguing with? My mind can become one with God. That's why you guys can't refute the things I say. Notice how whenever your scientific beliefs are backed against a corner you turn it on me? It's because you can't defend what you believe. You believe blindly, just like the religious folks you so loathe for doing the same. Such irony.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: TzarChasm

Because if you left the arguing up to god, his absence would speak for itself.

Who do you think you've been arguing with? My mind can become one with God. That's why you guys can't refute the things I say. Notice how whenever your scientific beliefs are backed against a corner you turn it on me? It's because you can't defend what you believe. You believe blindly, just like the religious folks you so loathe for doing the same. Such irony.

I can leave this thread right now and you will be exactly the same place you started. You can call it god you want but I call it futility. Not one mind has changed, not one divine omen witnessed, not one soul saved. And not one inch closer to proving evolution is the work of some cosmic intelligence harvesting humans for their mythical palace in the hereafter.

Just a couple more generations and creationists will be extinct. A few more than that and we'll see the rapid decline of religion generally worldwide. Religion is gradually being removed from daily life; from schools, to politics and law.

My son's children will barely know what religion is, and that's a comforting thought.

originally posted by: TerraLiga
Just a couple more generations and creationists will be extinct. A few more than that and we'll see the rapid decline of religion generally worldwide. Religion is gradually being removed from daily life; from schools, to politics and law.

My son's children will barely know what religion is, and that's a comforting thought.

Yeah teach them they're meaningless mutants and a microbe is their greatest-grandfather... so noble

You scoff at the nobility of the microbe?

How would you know? After all, it appears that you have never experienced the state yourself.

Harte

originally posted by: Harte
You scoff at the nobility of the microbe?

How would you know? After all, it appears that you have never experienced the state yourself.

Harte

Microbes remain microbes. That is their place. Birds remain birds. That is their place. I was more so emphasizing the alleged meaninglessness that is unavoidable with the theory of evolution. It is one of the most dangerous philosophies you can teach someone - that their actions will have no enduring effect because all returns to naught.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Harte
You scoff at the nobility of the microbe?

How would you know? After all, it appears that you have never experienced the state yourself.

Harte

Microbes remain microbes. That is their place. Birds remain birds. That is their place. I was more so emphasizing the alleged meaninglessness that is unavoidable with the theory of evolution. It is one of the most dangerous philosophies you can teach someone - that their actions will have no enduring effect because all returns to naught.

You're obviously very insecure about your mortality.

The religious, and especially the fundamentalists like Cooperton, are simply waiting to die so they can enter heaven. Their lives on Earth mean little. What a waste of human life.

a reply to: cooperton

Yeah teach them they're meaningless mutants and a microbe is their greatest-grandfather... so noble

Please cite a textbook or research paper that reflects your opinion. You failed on randomness. You'll fail on this one too.

Your crackpot cult is already dwindling. Soon to be relegated to the trash bin of history.

originally posted by: cooperton

originally posted by: Harte
You scoff at the nobility of the microbe?

How would you know? After all, it appears that you have never experienced the state yourself.

Harte

Microbes remain microbes. That is their place. Birds remain birds. That is their place. I was more so emphasizing the alleged meaninglessness that is unavoidable with the theory of evolution. It is one of the most dangerous philosophies you can teach someone - that their actions will have no enduring effect because all returns to naught.

Absurd.
Actions have the consequences they have, enduring or otherwise, regardless of anyone judging them.

Harte

originally posted by: TzarChasm

You're obviously very insecure about your mortality.

I don't fear dying at all. Are you excited to return to eternal nothingness, according to your belief?

originally posted by: TerraLiga
The religious, and especially the fundamentalists like Cooperton, are simply waiting to die so they can enter heaven. Their lives on Earth mean little. What a waste of human life.

You have no idea what I believe. You don't know your own evolutionary dogma, I wouldn't expect you to know Christian philosophy. You're supposed to find Heaven while you live.

originally posted by: Phantom423

Please cite a textbook or research paper that reflects your opinion [that the ancestor of all biological life is a microbe]

Lol this again. Remember when you said evolution didn't involve populations of organisms changing? You don't even know your own religion. The theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life. Of course, this is nonsense... microbes remain microbes.

originally posted by: Harte

Absurd.
Actions have the consequences they have, enduring or otherwise, regardless of anyone judging them.

Harte

Nah if evolution is true then no conscious being lasts.. so it all becomes nothing. If evolution is true then There's no enduring meaning, memory, or purpose once the world inevitably ends. If it is true then everything returns to eternal non-existence eventually. Luckily the theory is garbage and our lives have enduring meaning

a reply to: cooperton

Lol this again. Remember when you said evolution didn't involve populations of organisms changing? You don't even know your own religion. The theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life. Of course, this is nonsense... microbes remain microbes.

Please find that quote. You have a poor memory. I said that organisms on this planet have a COMMON ANCESTOR. This has been proven through DNA commonality studies.

The theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life. Of course, this is nonsense... microbes remain microbes.

This statement is proof positive that you're a liar and a fraud. Nowhere in evolutionary biology does it confuse abiogenesis with evolution. They are two separate issues.

And I have NEVER "theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life".

You're a terrible liar. You think that people buy your crap merely because you post it over and over ad infinitum.

originally posted by: Phantom423
a reply to: cooperton

Me: "Remember when you said evolution didn't involve populations of organisms changing?"

Phantom: "Please find that quote."

Link to where she asks me to find a textbook that says population of organisms can change

I said that organisms on this planet have a COMMON ANCESTOR. This has been proven through DNA commonality studies.

Proven? Yeah, and macbook air evolved from the original Macbook. Or, no, it makes more sense that they have a common designer. Computers don't come to be without intelligence. Neither do biological organisms.

"The theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life. Of course, this is nonsense... microbes remain microbes."

This statement is proof positive that you're a liar and a fraud. Nowhere in evolutionary biology does it confuse abiogenesis with evolution. They are two separate issues.

Ugh I should have known you wouldn't know what progenitor means. I pick my words carefully and this is exactly what I meant:

Progenitor: a person or thing from which a person, animal, or plant is descended or originates; an ancestor or parent.

So when I called a unicellular organism the progenitor of all organisms, that is saying exactly what you said above in your post:

I said that organisms on this planet have a COMMON ANCESTOR.

Yet now because I say it, I must be wrong and a liar??

And I have NEVER "theorized progenitor of all organisms is a unicellular organism that mutated into all biological life".

So which is it, do organisms on this planet have a common ancestor as you said earlier in your post? Or was their never a theorizied progenitor of all organisms??

Nowhere in evolutionary biology does it confuse abiogenesis with evolution.

lol and neither in my post did I make that mistake. I was taking it from the point of the beginning of evolution. I haven't even begun to discuss the impossibilities of abiogenesis on this thread. Evolution has enough holes as it is.

That is proof you are lying, or just incapable of scientific discussion. You have entirely lost your objectivity. You're like Captain Ahab trying to take down Moby Dick... you're taking your self and the whole crew down in the process.